Let's play a game.

Don't say PowerPoint presentation, say slidedeck
Don't say Word, say text document
Don't say Photoshop, say image editing
Don't say Excel, say spreadsheet
Don't say...

Language is important. When corporate companies own the names of the tasks or the digital items you create, you have become a cog in their branding machine.

#bigtech #DataSociety #academicchatter

@DrPen

Great advice!

But are there no better word than "text document"? That is sort of already taken by plain text. A name for documents between text and DTP. Nothing else comes to my mind, though...

@Seetee hey I'm not preaching the law! Whatever works for you. Maybe written work, word processing, but they're all clumsy. Text covers a lot of writing not only .txt files. Difficult though isn't it, when these words are subsumed into product branding.
@DrPen @Seetee I think just “document” works.

@whybird @DrPen @Seetee

I agree with this.

I only want add that we got here because of the time when only a proprietary program could open certain file extensions. At least this is my reasoning. Adobe had pdf locked down and M$ Word had word file extensions locked in, etc.

Breaking this habit will be hard.

@whybird @DrPen @Seetee

Back in the day Word and its competitors were collectively known as word processors. In fact, before PCs were affordable to most and as a stop gap between typewriters and the PC there were computers in the 80s that were collectively known as word processors. Glorified typewriters with little memory and with spell checking capabilities they wrote many a term paper back when.

Rich text document Formatted text document Formated document

@Seetee @DrPen Yeah text document implies plain text.

The wiki page for docx refers to the type of files in question as "word processing documents", which seems accurate but is a bit of a mouthful. I suppose a compromise is to contract it to (lower case) "word documents" though that of course does not stand the line particularly clearly against the Microsoft software.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Office_Open_XML

Office Open XML - Wikipedia

@jalager @Seetee @DrPen. In most contexts just saying "document" works. As in "I sent you the document we were discussing," or "The client sent over the document we asked for."

@distrowatch

That is actually a good idea. It reflects common use and is easy to understand. I like it!

@distrowatch @jalager @Seetee @DrPen

I say “doc file” or “xls file” or “ppt file”.

@RuthODay @distrowatch @jalager @Seetee these are Microsoft branded file extensions. Eg .keynote is the Mac slides software etc, or .odp is the Libre office slides file extension, .ods is the Libre spreadsheet file ext, etc etc.
@jalager @Seetee @DrPen I feel MS should have their trademark on "Word" revoked, the word is too generic to be a trademark.
@Seetee @DrPen maybe RTF? Rich text document.
Looks a little bit too much like wtf, but I think it could work...
I have been advocating for calling things what they are for years!
It is not a hoover Brits everywhere 🤣
@DrPen Combine your words with actions - use (and promote) alternatives like LibreOffice, Gimp, DuckDuckGo, etc.
@tydalforce
I think Krita would be easier to recommend for image editing
@DrPen

@phi1997

Why Krita?

I've heard of Gimp as an alternative to Photoshop but don't yet know much about other alternatives.

I use Paint.net - it's pretty good for light use, plus my Android phone photo editor.

@tydalforce @DrPen

@srfirehorseart
The name alone won't turn people off, and from what I've heard from people who are actually experienced in making digital art (unlike me), Krita is extremely well-suited for the task, while Gimp's UI is very awkward for people who aren't used to it
@tydalforce @DrPen
@phi1997 @srfirehorseart @DrPen in my defense, Gimp was just the first image editing app that sprung to mind lol

@phi1997

At first glance it appears that Krita is aimed at people who want to make digital paintings.

My experience (10 years ago) of Photoshop was that it was aimed at photographers and graphic designers. I also tested out Illustrator for package design. Gimp presumably covers that group.

So these programs are aimed at different niches?

@tydalforce @DrPen

@phi1997 @tydalforce @DrPen gimp for photos editing, inkscape for a vector program(illustrator)
@semii
Gimp's name turns a lot of people away, and for good reason.
@tydalforce @DrPen
@tydalforce @DrPen @phi1997 yep good thing i didn't know what a gimp was when i first heard of it
@tydalforce definitely wherever possible, especially by using those options (or others). Eg I always use Libre for slides these days. I also recommend other software, not only OS, bc its good for other alternatives too - Affinity, Pixelmator, Scrivener, stuff like OBS, Da Vinci Resolve, Ecosia etc etc. So many great alternatives.
@DrPen Interesting. Of these, I only used Photoshop. So I seldom used those other terms. I stuck with WordPerfect and Quattro Pro, neither of which became generic.
@jackyan @DrPen Adobe’s Photoshop was name that because in the 1990's photographer would use a physical room to edit the images. the room was called a photo shop. idk how to unlink adobe's product with the thing
@DrPen That's the way language works, and this is not specific with computers.

Have you ever said fridge, videotape, laudromat, hoover, linoleum, xerox, aspirin, cellophane, escalator, kerosene, thermos, and many more?

This is the way languages work.
@DavidBHimself True of a lot of things but more for some products and brands than others. I dont own a whirlpool, I own a washer, for example. But back in the day a 'Hoover' was more common than a vacuum cleaner. videotape - thats VHS or Betamax, or DAT so more generic.

@DavidBHimself @DrPen Language works a lot of different ways, so when trying to use language to achieve change, you have to work within the circumstances. I've intentionally used the generic coke, kleenex, etc in my writing because in the 90s, brands would actually publish in writers magazines telling us NOT to. (I still remember one: "You wouldn't XEROX a XEROX on a XEROX!" (This was long before that infamous anti-piracy ad.)

In this case, I'd lean towards avoiding the brand names, because they essentially have a monopoly. When I write the word kleenex in defiance of the trademark, it's because the box I have next to me is definitely a generic. This is true for most people, who rarely are going to have exactly kleenex™ brand tissues. Not so with spreadsheets, slidedecks, or teleconf brands, where all we do is reinforce the fact that they own us and we lack much of a choice.

But we can choose what we call them and remind folks, even if subconsciously, that there are alternatives.

@DrPen i am a cog in the kleenex industrial complex

@DrPen I would take this language battle a bit further:

do not say GOP/POTUS administration, say "Regime"
do not refer to DEI and immigration deportation as policies, but "ethnic cleansing"
do not say GOP, say AFFP(ie America's First Fascist Party)
do not say POTUS, say Felon President Trump
and many others

@yuhasz01 @DrPen

We are seeing a regime and ethnic cleansing in action and its appropriate to name this as such, but I find it unfair to shit on all the persecuted people unfairly convicted of felony offenses and reformed criminals just cos we don't like the most infamous felon atm, like being a felon doesn't mean a person is bad, there are more meaningful ways to describe and call out Trump's lack of morals and competence

@adamsaidsomething @DrPen Fair point...use term criminal ...better psychopath

@DrPen Don't say Teflon, say polytetrafluoroethylene

/hj but I kinda wanna annoy people with this

@DrPen
Download LibreOffice. Its free and French.
@DrPen Hang on a second while I google those hashtags .....
@DrPen Or misuse them deliberately to eventually make the trademark generic, as happened with bubble wrap and thermos bottles. But know what you're doing.
(Then again, none of those listed are pretty enough to use as generic terms…).
@chrysn @DrPen I think photoshop is already a widely used verb, so there is some progress there
@Methylzero @chrysn @DrPen I'm partial to corruptions of the verb like shoop or 'shopped
@chrysn interesting point there.
@DrPen we should do the same with online services. An Emacs contributor and philosopher I appreciate a lot, Protesilaos Stavrou, always say "the video-hosting platform" instead of YouTube in his videos, even if they are hosted there (for now).
@DrPen Or:
Don't say ChatGPT, say AI.
@duckworld0714 exactly. They've done the same thing. Everyone calls any similar chatbot ChatGPT. No one knows what GPT even means. And in universities (for example) they bang on every day doing Open Ai's free advertising for them.
@DrPen Great point I will try to see if I can erase “googling (vb)”. It is pretty integrated in my personal language. I forgot I can do something about it.
@DrPen Until it reverses and their brand becomes just a word. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_generic_and_genericized_trademarks
List of generic and genericized trademarks - Wikipedia

@DrPen I love how Adobe has their entire page on "don't turn it into a verb" to maintain their trademark but they still absolutely want it synonymous to some extent for monopolistic purposes.

As much as I love "potatochop" as the goofy term for editing maybe it's time for me to alter that.

@KayOhtie @DrPen As a bonus, especially for those of us that use AWS tools regularly: it's a fun and useful exercise to translate their nomenclature (like VPCs, IFWs, and various rules engines) back into their IETF standards: https://www.rfc-archive.org

I regularly and almost-religiously do this, because I refuse to let Amazon own the terms under which internet connectivity operates.

@DrPen not the same but, don’t say America say United States of America or USA… if we want to broke the branding machine we should go to the top
@DrPen Don't say "Google it" because Google is not the only search engine. I find that very annoying.
@DrPen - Don't say Google Search, say spy
@DrPen Don’t say Aspirin, say acetylsalicylic acid. 😅
@DrPen I am busy looking to replace Google and wean myself off saying google rather than search ,,,though to be fair in the Uk we call vacuum cleaners Hoovers but it’s not done that company much good

@DrPen

Personally I feel the more trademarks we can destroy by using the names generically, the better.

So I'll absolutely google how xeroxing or velcro works.

@DrPen Since I teach coding, I do have to make a note in the differences between a plaintext editor and a document editor, to me a "text document" is going to be plaintext, but that's just specific to my area as a programmer.
@DrPen @astraluma counterpoint: normalizing the genericification of all these terms destroys the trademark value of big tech, literally liberating billions of dollars of equity from oligarchs. Personally I make all my powerpoints in Keynote or Reveal.JS
@DrPen was a time when companies spent actual money to stop people using their proprietary names as generics. When people said Hoover for example instead of vacuum cleaners, and Thermos rather than vacuum flask.
@DrPen and if you can't avoid it (which, I'd agree, we should try), then maybe go so "hard in the paint" that society collectively turns the corner and causes the Kerosine/Dry Ice problem and they lose the trademark.
@DrPen Don't say "Google" say - well, anything else really.
@DrPen I think it's more powerful to go for the opposite and complete the #genericide, just like it happened to Kleenex, Xerox or Band-Aid. Say to everyone you will send them a Word document, and then send them a random other text document. Say you'll app somebody, then don't use WhatsApp but Signal, etc. These terms are so generic now, I think we're almost there already.
@DrPen I'd like to extend this good advice to Very Special Brand Orthography like "IPad". I will always write Ipad since I am not a brand ambassador.
@DrPen don't google say web search