Nic J
Dr. Lucky Tran 
Nathanael NerodeEveryone who has had #Covid once is now immunocompromised (according to many, many studies) and therefore at higher risk. This is probably over half the US population.
The pandemic doesn't end until we start protecting one another.
The Spoonless Kitchen@neroden @luckytran I ask this every time this comes up. It seems to be a standard talking point and I still have not received an evidence-based scientific answer:
IF SARS-CoV-2 causes "immune system dysfunction" why did SARS-CoV-1 NOT have the same issue?
Why do NONE of the other four coronaviruses (the ones that are now no longer lethal) cause "immune system dysfunction/disorder/autoimmune disorder" (that's another red flag different terms keep getting thrown around), despite those coronaviruses causing 15% of all colds, every year, multiple times per year?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronavirus#Common_cold
Perhaps they do, and perhaps that will finally allow #science to crack the nut on auto-immune disorders.
Eventually the SARS-CoV-2 #pandemic will end the way the HC-OC43 (another coronavirus) pandemic did.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8441924/
HC-OC43 does not make its annual/multiple-times-yearly sufferers have "immune dysfunction."
Unless it does. In which case, #science really needs to catch up. Quickly.
@neroden @luckytran ...and I still haven't received an answer to this....
No, but seriously, if one of the sequelae of coronavirus infection is "auto-immune disorder" or "immune dysfuction" or "becoming immunocompromised" (note I have seen ALL of these descriptions touted as "inevitable after first COVID infection"), then 10-15% OF THE EARTH would, every year, MUTLIPLE TIMES per year, be really, truly, disabled, because "immune dysfunction" is a bad, bad, bad, thing, and NOT just "I got a bacterial infection after the flu" which is the kind of TEMPORARILY lowered immune response ACTUAL evidence-based scientists and doctors are talking about. Which also happens with flu. But no one cares about flu either.
Either 10-15% of everyone, everywhere, every year, up until now, have developed auto-immune disease as a result of catching one of four common cold betacoronaviruses, and no one has correlated it (in which case BIG YIKES) or it's BS.
I'll let you figure out what I lean towards.
Giant@thespoonless @neroden @luckytran Your argument is like saying that leopards and house cats are the same thing because they're both felines. House cats never eat faces, therefore leopards are safe to have as housepets. For some reason I'm assuming you're doing this in good faith and simply haven't read up. SARS-COV2 is not the same as other coronaviruses. It's way worse. To get you up to speed, here are some papers about the damage SARS-COV2 does to the immune system. Cheers! :)
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33777042/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33751111/
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.08.09.22278592v1
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.05.20.492764v1
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/all.15372
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41392-022-00919-x
https://www.cell.com/action/showPdf?pii=S0092-8674%2820%2931067-9
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7773371/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8783674/
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/science.abq1841
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.09.13.22279912v1
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.09.15.507787v1
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41423-021-00728-2
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fimmu.2021.676932/full
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.10.18.512708v1
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12668-022-01020-x
https://bmcmedicine.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12916-021-02228-6
https://journals.plos.org/plospathogens/article?id=10.1371/journal.ppat.1009742
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41392-021-00749-3
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41590-022-01351-7
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fimmu.2022.1034159/full
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35079804/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34022619/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36479392/
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41385-021-00482-8
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fimmu.2022.1080822/full
https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/scitranslmed.add0484
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-021-25509-3
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32425950/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9057012/
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-022-04702-4
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-29801-8?s=09
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41590-021-01113-x
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33884644/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32632085/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33821250/
https://www.mdpi.com/2227-9059/10/2/382
Autoimmune and Rheumatic Manifestations Associated With COVID-19 in Adults: An Updated Systematic Review - PubMed
<span><b>Background:</b> Numerous cases of the coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) with autoimmune and rheumatic manifestations have been reported. Despite the available reviews that summarized its autoimmune/rheumatic manifestations, a systematic approach is still lacking. Therefore, we conducted a compr</span> …
Mark M. Evans@thespoonless You are all over the place with this expecting dozens or more of different viruses to all have the same long term effects on people. But that's not how it works. Remember before it was classified it was called the novel coronavirus. Novel, as in "we've never seen this one before." You are clearly trying to cherry pick "facts" about related viruses to support some narrative.
Doctors and scientists are still trying to figure this beast out and it's evolving. That's reality whether we like it or not.
Cynde@luckytran @neroden 80% of the population has been infected by the latest estimates. Considering the lack of testing, reporting, and tracing, it’s probably closer to 90%.
Indeed.
Due to the utter lack of valid data collection, I'm not willing to commit to that level of specificity. I know there are some of us who have never caught Covid because we took serious precautions -- and I don't know how many of us there are or how to count us.
@luckytran @neroden We will never know the true numbers. Data has to be captured consistently and universally and that wasn’t even attempted.
dr 🛠️🛰️📡🎧
@neroden @luckytran I found the 9/2021 study but others are hard to find because of search term overlap. Do you have some refs?
@davidr @neroden @luckytran Here's where I gave someone else in the thread the links you're looking for: https://kolektiva.social/@giantrectangle/109625645934544316
PamVT41@luckytran You got that right. 3 years of isolation and zoom.
Jules@luckytran thank you yes yes yes.
Edge@luckytran I’d like this broadcast every where, every day, until it sinks in.
@luckytran ...they didn't want us in society to begin with, was always the issue.
To "the right" we are "economic burdens."
To "the left" we are "useless eaters."
And here we are, stuck in the middle, as both sides wilfully spread the plague, albeit for different reasons!
We are in the #Eugenics Wars portion of the Star Trek timeline. I 100% believe this.
Never mind the stone-cold solid FACT that reducing the burden of ALL upper respiratory illnesses would benefit BOTH "sides", both socially (left) AND economically (right) but noooo can't have that! Must have exponential unending growth (of disease)!
...but I'm not bitter...
ChookMother 🇦🇺🦘Yes!!!! to this!
We're the new "disabled". We're at the "sorry, we can't accommodate you" stage of fighting for equal rights.
DrBashir2022
@VivianCreekmore@luckytran
Thank you for this!
My hairdresser Type1 diabetic; her doc doesn't recommend vaccination; she doesn't qualify for the $40.00 cap on insulin.
And, she is the ONLY one at her salon wearing a mask.
Thank you for this!
My hairdresser Type1 diabetic; her doc doesn't recommend vaccination; she doesn't qualify for the $40.00 cap on insulin.
And, she is the ONLY one at her salon wearing a mask.
micropainter@luckytran Seeing as there are more and more higher risk people thanks to re-infection and long Covid and longer-term health issues....will it ever be over?
Graydon@luckytran The idea that the people making the policy are going to be moved by this is lamentably unfounded.
They really truly do not care who dies so long as line-goes-up.
Infecting the entire population with a disease that causes lasting immune dysfunction is going to make line go down, but that will never be inarguable. (The pro-smoking playbook of disdaining facts is still out there.)
Anybody with people skills might-maybe could be considering starting a pro-facts political party?
Lisa@luckytran So true.
We haven't eaten inside a restaurant since 2019 b/c my husband is high risk.
So tired of the blatant lies a/b vaccines.
Tired of selfish, ignorant people.
Just tired.
We haven't eaten inside a restaurant since 2019 b/c my husband is high risk.
So tired of the blatant lies a/b vaccines.
Tired of selfish, ignorant people.
Just tired.
Valerie van de Flier@luckytran as an immunocompromised transplant patient, THANK YOU! I wish my government would realize this as well.
GJ Groothedde 🇪🇺@luckytran The pandemic is far from over.
Derek Chai Media@luckytran That is reliant on the caring / unselfish nature of the community. Well, I guess it’s not going to end anytime soon then ☹️🤷🏻
Lord Caramac the Clueless, KSC@luckytran I think the pandemic ends if and when we get an inhalable aerosol vaccine that causes sterile immunity against #SarsCoV2 , and we need to vaccinate as much of the population as possible, repeatedly, with updated vaccines against the latest variants. Only if we can bring a vaccine which actually stops virus transmission to the people will the pandemic truly end. Otherwise #Covid will just become endemic - well, #HIV is endemic, and #polio used to be endemic, we don't want that.
iteration523 
@LordCaramac @luckytran This, except that "sterile immunity" is a myth these days due to antivaxxers spreading their garbled version of it ("getting infected without getting infectious", which does not happen in real life).
The actual term is "sterilizing immunity" and it simply means zero breakthrough infections, and is actually the exception, not the rule: it is only possible against a small number of pathogens, who need to have particular evolutionary properties (highly conserved genome, low reproductive rate).
Sadly, that's magical thinking. Such vaccines don't exist and may never exist.
The pandemic ends when we #CleanTheAir with #HEPA and #CorsiRosenthalBoxes, and people use #P100 and #N95 respirators.
We stop cholera with clean water -- NOT with vaccines, which aren't good enough.
We stop Covid with clean air -- NOT with vaccines, which aren't good enough.
We don't drink dirty water, why do we breathe dirty air?
That's how this ends
#CovidIsAirborne #Covid
@LordCaramac @luckytran Cholera still exists. But it's endemic in places with dirty water, and almost nonexistent in places with clean water.
Covid will still exist. But if we #CleanTheAir, it'll be endemic in places with dirty air, but almost nonexistent in places with clean air...
#N95 and #P100 masks are the equivalent for an airborne disease of the "boil water order" for a waterborne disease
Why are people just drinking dirty water & breathing dirty air?
@neroden @luckytran I'm currently one of the less than 5% of people around here who still wear masks at supermarkets. And the politicians are too afraid of the conspiracy nuts to reinstate mask mandates, if they even want to. They all still think they're safe because they've been vaccinated and/or had the 'rona once. Popular media declare the pandemic is over while the healthcare system is collapsing. It's some kind of contagious collective madness. Air filters are often turned off in order to save energy, since due to the war Russian gas has become unavailable.
So I'm afraid we will probably see hundreds of thousands of newly disabled people suffering from chronic #LongCovid / #PostCovid in the future before people notice what's going on, and since chronic illness tends to be invisible, Long Covid doesn't really catch very much media attention. The antivaxx conspiracy nuts believe that the vaccine causes it, and since there are many who have recovered from Covid and haven't noticed any lasting damage so far, many people think of Long Covid as something rare and unusual.
I still think Long Covid is the new #PostPolio - we will have a lot of disabled people when this is over, if this ever ends. If this bloody SARS 2.x coronavirus becomes permanently endemic, it will do the kind of damage to our society nobody has seen who doesn't remember the #IronLung - outside of #malaria regions, that is. We'll just get a lot of newly disabled people year after year, people who just disappear because they spend their entire lives lying in bed and sitting on the couch. They'll be easy to ignore for a long time, I fear, as long as the public can be distracted by some public outrage about some migrant crime story or some politician who said something stupid.
An aerosol vaccine would be likely to stop most infections right in the nose at least for some time, so if we somehow managed to get virtually everyone to get a puff of the latest version every few months, we might be able to keep outbreaks small and limited. That, however, might not be possible without exposing at least parts of the population to the vaccine aerosol without their knowledge and consent, which is something no liberal democracy could pull off. China could, maybe China will. It is hard to stab people with a needle without their consent, but it should be rather easy to make them inhale something they don't want.
Sorry for the wall of text, my instance recently switched from 500 to 5000 characters, and now I'm just typing as if this was Tumblr.
Matthew "Smiffy" SmithLast boost, being in that cohort, too fucking right.