Vytautas ŠaltenisJul 28
daniel:// stenberg://

In 2002 my laptop had 96 MB ram

In 2025 my laptop has 96 GB ram

Roughly doubled every other year. There should be a law describing this.

Jul 28 at 7:49amWeb
Show thread41402-nyanJul 28
@bagder did curl ram requirements change compared to 2002? :)
Show threaddaniel:// stenberg://Jul 28
@a1ba I'm sure it needs a little more now, but generally curl's requirements grow much slower than the rest of the system...
Show thread41402-nyanJul 28
@bagder thanks for not following the rest of the industry in that sense :D
Show threadJP MensJul 28
@bagder it’s Stenberg’s Law
Show threadV'gerJul 28
@bagder Bagders Theorem?
Show thread0mega 🧟‍♂️ [SK]Jul 28
@bagder The Developer's Law ​​
Show threadPeter Gordon 🇺🇦Jul 28
@bagder Stenberg's law states that Daniel Stenberg will double the ram in his laptop every two years.
Show threadLars WirzeniusJul 28
@bagder Such a law exists! It's called "more's law": "software always uses more memory".
Show threadPhreakByteJul 28
@bagder Moore’s Law
Actually I would say
Show threadJimmy SjölundJul 28
@bagder ...
Show threadGabriel ⛺💤Jul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder Awsome
Show threadStefan EissingJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder has anyone ever used the swap space in recent memory?💁🏻‍♂️
Show threadLennyJul 28
@icing @jimmysjolund @bagder I'm surprised people still use it. Off since I started using disk encryption (is it still a hassle? it was back then) and never missed it.
Show threadgeorge, pro photographerJul 28
@f09fa681 @icing @jimmysjolund @bagder I use disk encryption and I configured zram which is almost the same thing as swap, right?
Show threadRickyxJul 28
@f09fa681 @icing @jimmysjolund @bagder I normally have a swap partition that doubles the ram, encrypted with a random key.
I fill some swap when doing photogrammetry.
Show threadAndrey DarkCat09Jul 28

@icing
The only case i can remember is compiling a font (particularly Iosevka). All available RAM was taken to optimize build time, so the system had to use swap a little

@jimmysjolund @bagder

Show threadkasperdJul 28
12GB of swap is in use on my laptop. That’s primarily because I have Chrome running.
Show threadLucJul 28
@icing @jimmysjolund @bagder Few months ago I was sitting next to a Java dev explaining a new team member to set the IntelliJ heap size to 10GB. Asked him if there was an appserver included, but apparently it’s just the IDE…
Show threadMorten GrøftehaugeJul 28
@icing @jimmysjolund @bagder Haha yes, but it really should have had a different data infrastructure.
Show threadLuca Carlon4d ago
@icing @jimmysjolund @bagder yes, for hibernation.
Show threadschrotthaufenJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder @nixCraft And then you try to compile a rust program 😭
Show threadJoe BJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder Hehe.. Great visual!
Show threadHyperlink Your HeartJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder Ah but with 32GB of RAM you could run many kittens.
Show threadMiner34Jul 28
@hyperlinkyourheart @jimmysjolund @bagder I ran 5 with less than 2 GB
Show threadAndrew ZonenbergJul 28

@jimmysjolund @bagder I've OOMed a Debian workstation with 192GB RAM before.

And at a previous job we OOM'd a box with something like half a TB.

But this is more on the supercomputing / HPC side of things not your average desktop application

Show thread-𝚍𝚜𝚛- (has pronouns)Jul 28

@azonenberg @jimmysjolund @bagder

Firefox: hold my beer!

Show threadSpace Catitude 🚀Jul 28

@jimmysjolund @bagder

As it should be!

Not shown: the full-grown cow representing my media projects.

Show threadElectroFetishJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder
Show threadCorvusJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder that easily could become a meme for @QubesOS where the couch would be pretty crowded.
Show threadFrankJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder
And then…
Show threadKroppebJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder
Made a shitty meme on my phone
Show threadFilesUnknownJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder
Same except I killed my motherboard, so I changed it and had only then realized that it was maxed 16gB for the four slots of DDR3 ram. So now have 16gB unused
Show threadLeyvi :gentoo:Jul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder LOL mine has 64 GiB…
Show threadLeyvi :gentoo:Jul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder _and_ I use Gentoo, so it only uses a few hundred MiB at idle.
Show threadHenning Paul DC4HPJul 28
@jimmysjolund @bagder Now install Chromium.
Show threadMichael Vilain6d ago
@jimmysjolund @bagder But...my Windows 11 VM...
Show threadnotwhatyouintended 🏳️‍⚧️6d ago
@jimmysjolund @bagder
Then there sits Firefox and VSCodium and the kitten can barely breathe between them
Show threadObsPy Dev Team 6d ago
@jimmysjolund @bagder you should photoshop in a big Saint Bernard dog spreading on the sofa and label it firefox 😅🤣
Show threadPxl Phile5d ago
@jimmysjolund @bagder sometimes this cat is a kitten, sometimes...
*sighs deeply*
...this cat is a full blown tiger.
Show threadJoão Santos5d ago
@jimmysjolund @bagder that holds until you open the average web app.
Show threadsounddrill ​3d ago
@jimmysjolund @bagder this is the exact opposite on my setup with 8gb RAM 😅
Show threadMartina NeumayerJul 28
@bagder Yeap.. I am also that old, by remembering pretty nice times when most important thing or even priority for almost every developer out there was decent made code optimization. People have been thinking about such topics like not eating entire resources of the machine by the released, ready to use programs, applications or even operating systems as well. Sadly those times are long time gone. That's very sad, imho, because actual reality is terrifying with all that.
Show threadshellkrJul 28
@bagder It's pretty amazing how Moore thought of this all the way back then... although not exact it has been pretty close. My guess is that this will change now with Intel's current struggles... or it might just explode when something new and shiny comes along.
Show threadGregoryJul 28
@bagder I had a PC with 128 MB of RAM around 2007. Surprisingly, that was enough for web browsing at the time. I even somehow managed to develop J2ME apps on it. The only IDE that ran somewhat usably was Borland JBuilder. It stuttered, it was an overall annoying experience, but I was surprised it worked at all.
Show threadTubemeisterJul 28
@bagder In 2003 my first brand new laptop had 640 MB ram. Should be enough for anybody, right? (It wasn’t.)
Show threadSeb 🇺🇦Jul 28
@Tubemeister @bagder 640GB RAM should be enough for everyone 😂
Show threadTubemeisterJul 28
@docteurslump @bagder ...For now.
Show threadijk64✅Jul 28
@Tubemeister @bagder
My first “laptop” had 3,538 bytes of usable RAM
Show threadSimon GreenwoodJul 28
@bagder Windows grows to fill the space available.
Show threadIanJul 28
@bagder For me, it's true for disk space too--in 1994, I had 200 MB; in 2002, I had 20 GB; in 2008, I had 1 TB; circa 2018, I had 10 TB, and I have around 300 TB now.
Show threadInga stands with 🇺🇦 🇵🇸Jul 28

@tnbp @bagder in 2008, 1TB drives were commonplace (I know this because in spring 2009 I bought an 1TB slim (with iirc only two platters) 5400 rpm drive (HD103SI), it was just $90 back then). Just as 20GB drives were kinda commonplace in 2002 (back then, even laptops with drives that size weren't uncommon). And just as ~10TB were available around 2018.

But to get 300GB now, one'd need to build a huge raid array and fork off way more money. The drives alone (without redundancy, and without the overhead for all the array-related hardware) would cost ~4k€, putting it way out of reach of ordinary consumers. But similarly you could have build a 20TB array in 2008, or 1TB in 2002.

So I don't think this is a fair comparison. Spinning platters disk space was growing fast until maybe ~2011 (when the floods in Thailand happened) and then it basically stagnated (we got like 6x density growth in the 14 years after that, and maybe 3x decrease in price per gigabyte). And SSDs are growing fast, but they still didn't overtake HDDs in terms of price; even the cheapest ones are still 3x/4x as expensive as 3.5" HDDs... which means that they approached 2011-era HDDs in terms of price and exceeded them in terms of capacity and physical size, which is great! But still very far from Moore's law, or 500x jump from floppy disks to CDs.

Show threadIanJul 28
@IngaLovinde @bagder That is correct, but what is also correct is that I had far less disposable income in 2008 than I have now. Also, most systems limited me to ~6 internal drives in 2008 and USB 2.0 was dog-slow, whereas today, USB 3 (either type) is sufficient for HDDs and you can have about 10 or so per USB controller.
Show threadUnionMammalChewyJul 28
@bagder It's the law of electron apps. Electron apps double in mass every year until it becomes big enough that it forms a black hole, so that not even a single bit can escape it.
Show threadChristina JenniferJul 28
@bagder I think it's called mores law because every year you get more.
Show threadAdaJul 28
@bagder Do we really need moore laws?
Show threadAlien software, human hardwareJul 28
@bagder maybe we can call it "the law of bad software design"? :D
Show threadUBERCHADJul 28
@bagder tell me Moore
Show threadMiner34Jul 28
@bagder 96 GB of RAM?! What even uses that much. The most ram i've seen being used is 32 GB (rendering a Blender animation with tons of simulated smoke). I have 16 on my laptop and never needed more.