Jay Lyerly
Daniël Franke 
When exactly did we start to think that the point of humans was to be productive, instead of thinking that the point of productivity was to take care of humans?
JuneSim63 💚@ainmosni When elites started taking any surplus for themselves.
Tusknode@junesim63 @ainmosni for me is since ever, just last periods that is more noticeable cause of the development of tech. Higher technology-more power for single individuals. Its going to getting worse, and that scares me.
Jax UK
Ejner Borgbjerg@ainmosni when "productivity" was thought to be the software category of office suites, perhaps...
João Santos@ainmosni just before someone built the first proto-palace in one of the first cities.
epicdemiologist@ainmosni As soon as one human controlled the result of other humans' productivity.
sotolf
Kit Rhett Aultman@ainmosni I reckon the big inflection point in that came when most of us stopped farming for survival.
rascal
seism0saurusWhen was capitalism established as the only "valid" system?
Violet MadderWhen they enclosed the commons and made it all but impossible for people to survive outside their control. That's when.
JackieIt took a while. It took things like the enclosure acts and the displacement of the agricultural peasantry for it really to take root in the British context
acb
Resuna
Pilum::🌞
Жафстелце
Nina Cried PowerIt's more about security, whether that be food or energy security, or security from a neighbour seeking those for themselves.
The nation that neglects its own security in order to be kind tends to be one that is colonised by a nation which doesn't.
ChookMother 🇦🇺🦘@ainmosni Around Henry Ford's time.
Jason Pettus 
@ainmosni Right around 20,000 BC.
Sonja Schulte@ainmosni I love this dually: as a rhetorical question, but also how Mastodon gives various serious and probable answers
Jeff Bronks
Jake in the desert@ainmosni capitalism, etc, the fertile crescent, colonizers, Henry Ford, just all of it. Garbage. hahaha
Grey Pilgrim@ainmosni
Depends on your country I think - here it was roughly the start of this century, give or take a decade, when economic growth became goal instead of means for providing for people.
Depends on your country I think - here it was roughly the start of this century, give or take a decade, when economic growth became goal instead of means for providing for people.
Moss Wizard@ainmosni sometime around the building of the pyramids.
Frans Super 🇺🇦🇵🇸🍋 FKNZS🔻@ainmosni It started when someone said 'I am more important than you, so you do as I say and that is work the field and hand in your crops to me'.
SkyNebula
Molenaar@ainmosni Well, that's an easy one. First, the Guild system had to collapse, so the "productivity to take care of humans" part is no longer looked after.
Then the steam engine had to be developed enough, so that it is more wasteful to stop the engine than to produce a surplus. It takes an enormous amount of time and fuel to start a steam engine, while mills can be stopped at any time. So since the steam engine was used for the productivity, we started to produce first, and then tried to sell our products, which was enormously stupid when al the work was still craftsmanship by hand or driven with wind or water.
Our whole economy still runs on the ideas of the steam age, even if all power is electric or diesel these days, and can be started and stopped without penalty.
Dan Lyke
Carolyn
Nick
draNgNon
Pierre-Yves Comtois@ainmosni at the time of the Industrial Revolution. 1760–1840.
VHG 🇪🇺🇺🇦
Doug Wade@ainmosni if you’re sincerely asking for a date, rather than making a rhetorical point, the earliest I could concretely cite would be Cotton Mather’s 1701 sermon “A Christian At His Calling.”
Jonne Arjoranta@dougwade @ainmosni I would think that he was influenced by the Reformation. Most factions – but especially Calvinists – started emphasizing labour as a way to prove one's worth in the eyes of God (See e.g. Weber: The Protestant Ethic and the Spirit of Capitalism).
So to answer your rhetorical question: roughly 16th century.
David W. Jones@ainmosni
"At the end of the day, we are human *beings*, not human *doings*" a quote from a rabbi that I read somewhere in a newspaper.
"At the end of the day, we are human *beings*, not human *doings*" a quote from a rabbi that I read somewhere in a newspaper.
Ulrich RummelWhen the ‘Protestant sects’ (in Max Weber's sense) appeared on the scene.
(Thanks for nothing.)
Korma Chameleon@ainmosni the protestant reformation
Infrapink (he/his/him)@ainmosni I'm going to say when John Calvin took over Geneva. Early Calvinism had the idea that God would bless and reward the righteous while still alive, and one of those blessings was wealth. Since work can, in some instances, lead to wealth, this gave rise ot the idea that work itself is inherently righteous, rather than a means to an end. The heresy that wealth == righteousness appeals to wealthy people who get to impose that idea on everybody.
Solar🌄Garden@ainmosni "point of productivity...to take care of humans"
humans ... while everything else beautiful and self-sustaining by way of its complexity and frugality is obliterated
before interjecting I just did a page search for any terms relevant to anything living other than the [default] rape-ape species. Not in this thread... but elsewhere in the followed timeline, this from @jackofalltrades, 2nd para of which fits: https://mas.to/@jackofalltrades/116125048598041523
Jack of all tradesIt is the anthropocentric perspective:
CodeByJeff@ainmosni it can actually be traced back to early biblical times, and the story of Adam and Eve
Adam and Eve | The Ancients
Technomancer Star, Alpha@ainmosni When money became more important than human lives. Amazing how it works.
CassandraVertI don't know, but it's at least since WWII.
Raphael
radar man from the moon@ainmosni
I saw a sticker on someone's car that said "busy is not your purpose" which struck me as funny...then horrifying when I thought about just how brain-hacked we are, our own existential confusion used against us by the those that benefit from us believing our jobs are the center of our identity and success is measured in dollars instead of happiness.
I saw a sticker on someone's car that said "busy is not your purpose" which struck me as funny...then horrifying when I thought about just how brain-hacked we are, our own existential confusion used against us by the those that benefit from us believing our jobs are the center of our identity and success is measured in dollars instead of happiness.
D
millennial fulcrum@ainmosni I don't know that question but I can confirm I have never got that wrong. it has been obvious to me since I was a child, learning the definition of productivity, that it is a tool with the singular purpose of making life better for the living and the still to come.
I can't imagine the trauma a brain would need to sustain in order to get those two things around the wrong way like that.
but did you meet someone who had?
what help do they need to get better?
Alex, the Hearth Fire@ainmosni been a few millennia, unfortunately
CJPaloma might be hiking@ainmosni wow, some of these comments are full of….assumptions. Depends on who "we" is.
THOUSANDS of cultures lived (and still do) without exploiting people. Ya just haven't heard of them because they don't fit the narratives that colonizing cultures tend to want people to focus on...
and that might be because well, Western Civ WANTS to normalize its ways of being as "normal"
even when the ways are and have been just disgustingly exploitative -when compared to others.
Olivia🌼
StarkRG
Greg Wilson@ainmosni "…the defenders of free markets forget that what we really want is free men." - Mark Crawford
🇺🇦 haxadecimal 🚫👑@ainmosni
How else can the rich sacrifice you to the God of Capital?
How else can the rich sacrifice you to the God of Capital?