RE: https://nileane.fr/@nileane/116715874283622057
So:
• With Siri AI, Apple deliberately developed a brand-new (and central) OS feature that they knew would not meet the DMA requirements they've been subjected to since 2023
• They went to the EU Commission with the proposal of a technical solution that is not ready and would not roll out before 18 months
• The EU Commission said no because lol what do you mean you plan to disobey the DMA *again* for the next 18 months
• Apple whines
@[email protected] @[email protected] Yes, If I would still be using an iPhone, I would think us Europeans lucky that we were spared this "AI". I thought the same about that Apple "AI" that didn't initially make it to Europe two years ago or so. Only with a .4 iOS update or so. I already forgot what "AI" that was. But I had a few annoying arguments back then with techbros who ridiculed the EU for: - sleeping on innovation and getting left behind - being bloated and useless and making too many rules and being evil for not doing unregulated capitalism, due to the cups attached to plastic bottles regulation and the annoying cookie banners When I explained that cookie banners are the fault of malicious companies, not the EU, I got the usual last-effort reply of a techbro that the EU is Stalinism and Maoism and that we already lost millions in lives to communism and communism has to stop. The techbros do not like it when they can't get access to the "AI".
we used to use this "snark" definition of trust when we felt our users weren't getting it:
trust: an implicit faith in a consistent pattern of behavior.
sometimes took a minute before they realized that "consistent" wasn't the same as "safe" or "desired"... ;)
@nileane so they won’t allow
“any AI system nearly unlimited access to a user’s device, as well as the ability to act on that access autonomously without a user’s ongoing visibility and control. That includes the ability to read and send messages, make purchases, access files, and execute actions across any app.”
But they will allow their AI system these exact rights, right?
I haven’t yet researched (nor will I) what supposed limitations will be on their Siri AI, nor whatever the hell “Private Cloud Compute” is.
But the “trust us, bro” vibes are strong in this one.
PS: Obligatory reminder not to ever again trust Cook’s bootlicking company, as I once did:
@greentothebone Huh. Apple sure has a funny way of saying, "Due to our infringements of the Digital Markets Act, Apple will not be able to ship Siri AI in the EU."
@knowprose @nileane The idea is, people should be free to install whatever they want on their devices. In this case, any LLM. Or, in my case, no LLM at all.
I know, mind-boggling.
@knowprose @nileane is there an LLM you could run on your device that you could control?
Anyway, just get an android
Sure. There are. But not on an apple.
By self control of an LLM it seems that means not publishing to the App Store
But even then I image “entitlements” control access to certain data at compile time. Not a developer, so I don’t know if a “non-published” in some form might meet your definition
@alcatholic @nileane when the greatest constraint is the ecosystem, the only way to change the constraint is to change the ecosystem.
I am not going to tell you a competing ecosystem is better. Android is almost as bad, costs less, yadda yadda.
What i will say is that the argument is for a llm being able to control your device, it is a fool's argument.
Get out of the puddle if one's feet are wet. Complaining of wet feet while standing in a puddle only gives the puddle power.
I agree with your main point that it seems DMA wants more unfettered LLMs on devices
For me the Apple-controlled-only LLM approach feels safe enough
On the general question…would I want DMA controlling Apple’s design choices? No, for one reason
Say Apple decides to pull back on their own data access or cloud access, I think EU would block Apple from reducing access for other LLM. LLMs would sue to EU to prevent Apple forcing them to change
@alcatholic @nileane the fact that there is a conversation so apple specific seems a tyranny all it's own.
Vendor locked.
Correct
So it seems to me EU are willing to trade away a private product/LLM environment in order to break vendor lock for its own sake even at the cost of increased malware/privacy invasion for EU citizens
It reads to me they pursue economic objectives at the cost of privacy
@alcatholic @nileane the DMA quote makes no sense to me.
Apple makes no sense to me.
So if you are trying to negotiate meaning between the two, that's based on your interests.
To me, it's clowns to the left and jokers to the right.
There are other things that hold my interest. Not this.
Apple's endgame is never to comply with the EU Commission, but rather wait for enough people to complain to the EU Commission to change the rules.
That is the endgame.
@Linux @nileane in fact, the only reason Apple complies with anything, is if they're facing a flatout ban:
GAFAMs literally expect the U.S. government to lobby if not extort other governments into their bs.!
#Apple #Sarcasm #Commentary #EUpol #Govware #Backdoors #China #Russia #GAFAMs #EU #USpol #extortion #Lobbyism #RightToRepair #Repair #Repairability
@alcatholic @Linux @nileane @EUCommission the only ones that can provide any resemblance of privacy are those that run 100% on ine's personal device & offline!
In fact, being able to do airgapped Self-Hosting is why Mistral got some actually profitable industial clients, but corpos like ASML mostly use their tech to automate QC by checking wavers against reference images and flagging defective ones.
#EUpol #privacy #WastefulComputing #AIslop #AI #Mistral #airgapping #airgap #ASML #MachineLearning #MachineVision #QC
@Netzblockierer @Linux @nileane @EUCommission right
So does DMA requiring any random LLM to access your iPhone data seem desirable to you? Is that what you want Apple to implement?
@alcatholic @Linux @nileane @EUCommission that's bs and you know that!
@eduo @alcatholic @Linux @nileane @noybeu @wbs_legal EXACTLY!
Besides @EUCommission's concern is to prevent monopolization and enshure compliance with EU standards (incl. Consumer Rights like Privacy)…
Just like many US websites choose to geoblock EU visitors instead if yeeting their illegal tracking code!
#EUcomission #Standards #Compliance #Apple #privacy #ConsumerRights #USpol #US #geoblocking #Geoblcking #Tracking
@Netzblockierer @eduo @Linux @nileane @noybeu @wbs_legal @EUCommission
I think I explained my intent
It opens the door to any random LLM, and that opens the doors to scams/malware
Forcing Open the door to random LLMs no different than forcing open the door to malware
On privacy, EU explicitly chooses economic competition over privacy guardrails
Cannot argue this enhances privacy
@alcatholic @eduo @Linux @nileane @noybeu @wbs_legal @EUCommission If you can't trust the users, then why should you trust Apple, who are known to collude against the interests of said users?
We'll pull out if [insert nation here]!
When Signal never did that (and never will)!
That Applie is getting caught lying is nothing new.
So stop eating up corporate bs propaganda for a golden cage, and realize that it's not your (nor Apple's!) right to restrict consumer choices!
#Apple #Privacy #AI #Enshittification #Govware #Backdoors #Signal #Honeypot #Lies #Propaganda
@Netzblockierer @eduo @Linux @nileane @noybeu @wbs_legal @EUCommission @signalapp @Mer__edith
I don’t think I would accept a “Trusting users” framing for something as dangerous as this levels of access to users’ iPhone data. Again malware/scams. Users need to trust their devices, too
China forcing Apple to open up user data an ugly thing, for sure
@alcatholic @eduo @Linux @nileane @noybeu @wbs_legal @EUCommission @signalapp @Mer__edith It's not just in,"P.R." China…
@Netzblockierer @eduo @Linux @nileane @noybeu @wbs_legal @EUCommission
Self-hosting?
I admit I missed that
Apple allowing self hosted AI with no access to network at all seems reasonable. Must enforce no network access to make sense
I hope they do that down the road
@alcatholic @eduo @Linux @nileane @wbs_legal @EUCommission if Apple was actually "pro privacy" they'd only do on-device & self-hosting instead of partnering with Google Gemini for "Apple Intelligence"…
Again: Stop huffing' corporate propaganda and realize that it's not just DMA but also GDPR that corporations in the EU have to comply with.
#EU #Apple #Privacy #DMA #GDPR #CloudAct #AI #AppleIntelligence #AIslop
@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] If you can't trust the users, then [why](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YbeGjnqEZ8) should you trust Apple, who are known to collude against the interests of said users? - Like in the *"PR"* China [where they served all their customers on a silver platter](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev9_oDHNf-4) to the CCP! - I mean, it's clear that [Apple's Privacy Claims are just Propaganda Lies](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r38Epj6ldKU) if they're able and willing to integrate Govware Backdoors. - Kinda reminds me of how @[email protected] 's @[email protected] is constantly spouting bs like: > We'll pull out if [insert nation here]! When Signal never did that (and never will)! That Applie is [getting caught lying](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4n1yyCJiaw) is nothing new. So stop eating up corporate bs propaganda for a golden cage, and realize that it's not your (nor Apple's!) right to restrict consumer choices! #Apple #Privacy #AI #Enshittification #Govware #Backdoors #Signal #Honeypot #Lies #Propaganda
@Netzblockierer @eduo @Linux @nileane @wbs_legal @EUCommission @noybeu
I don’t want to engage flippantly, so walk me through this
You think DMA plus GDPR plus Privacy Intent mean iPhones should have no built in AI that connects to the cloud? (Presumably users could choose to install such AI)
So an iPhone where a user would need to install Siri AI?
@Netzblockierer @Linux @nileane yeah.
Without @EUCommission, Apple would propably use only proprietary ports with less documentation than what Motorola (Iridium) and SGI released in their heights…
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