Brian KungNov 19, 2022
Dave Troy 

For those wondering, Mastodon contains no “web3” or crypto technology, and significantly predates any of that. The technology deployed here is primarily ActivityPub, which has roots in tech like RSS and PubSubHubbub.

It is noteworthy that “web3” designs are absent from the Twitter emigration discussion; that’s because it’s a scam and not fit for purpose.

The minute people start talking about adding crypto to the fediverse, run. That’s not what this is about and violates its spirit and design.

Nov 19, 2022 at 10:24amWeb
Show threadDave Troy Nov 19, 2022
And to be clear, for anyone to whom it is not patently obvious, I’m talking about “crypto” as in cryptocurrency, not standard cryptological encryption which is widely used to secure HTTPs connections. That’s standard web technology, and best practice.
Show threadDagNov 19, 2022
@davetroy The servers do run on tulips and beanie babies though right?
Show threadDave Troy Nov 19, 2022
@3fecta unfortunately it’s V8 engines running on leaded gas all the way down the stack… old school. 😆
Show threadCoach Pāṇini ®Nov 19, 2022
@3fecta @davetroy er, diesel 😉
Show threadIxtli Dekami 🍕⚾🖖Nov 19, 2022
@paninid @3fecta @davetroy
Worse: fueloil =O
Show threadC-richNov 19, 2022

@3fecta

@davetroy

*slams pogs on the table*

Finally, my collections are valuable

Show threadC-richNov 19, 2022
@davetroy
So encrypted in transit but..... not at rest on instances, correct?
Show threadDave Troy Nov 19, 2022
@crichardson I haven’t given a full review of it but yes I believe that’s correct. Simply not a design goal.
Show threadmhoNov 19, 2022
@davetroy @crichardson encrypting at rest isn't any more "web3 crypto" than https is - they're both sensible security defaults
Show threadNatanael ⚠️Nov 22, 2022
@mho @davetroy @crichardson enabling disk encryption on the servers would solve half that problem (adding database level encryption is possible too but slightly harder). But in either case the admin will have access to the keys.
Show threadMrs Mouse at workNov 19, 2022

@davetroy Please enter 0.001BTC for 10 more toots.

/s

Show threadJim StewartsonNov 19, 2022
@davetroy OK but can I find with the blockchain / metaverse / web3 browser plugin I got with my first FTX deposit?
Show threadBeFree AgencyNov 19, 2022
@jimstewartson @davetroy only if you pay for feature upgrade in crypto (?)
🙃
Show threadTomSeppertNov 20, 2022
@davetroy
So are you saying that cryptography an decentralized systems existed before current crypto hype?
Amazing! 😜 🤡
Show threadNatanael ⚠️Nov 22, 2022
@TomSeppert @davetroy some of those people keeps forgetting that the crypto in cryptocurrency means cryptography. We've been around for quite a while.
Show threadRussell GarnerNov 19, 2022
@davetroy @[email protected] literally just yesterday fled screaming from a discussion in which a Bluesky proponent claimed that the first network to add crypto would "win"
Show threadMaura HubbellNov 20, 2022
@davetroy @robertbrook @rgarner Screaming or laughing?
Show threadRussell GarnerNov 20, 2022
@SistaWendy the latter externally the former internally
Show threadwhonose123Nov 22, 2022
@rgarner @davetroy @robertbrook what the actual ferk!!! Someone needs beating about the head with a reality stick LOL
Show threadNatanael ⚠️Nov 22, 2022
@rgarner @davetroy @[email protected] they did win. The prize is an entry on most instances' block lists.
Show threadalexyangworldNov 19, 2022
@davetroy we need a federal public place not controlled by monarchy
Show threadFran SotoFeb 3, 2023
@alexyangworld @davetroy UK, Norway and Spain are against this.
Show threadTed Saves Everything Nov 19, 2022
@davetroy I did a 3 month experiment on my research account, about a year ago to see what that "account system could get in the way of free blockchain linked tokens, access, and any other of the "free" promos. I fully immersed the account and soon was being pressured to boost a discord, given a web 3 dev non fungible token that accesses nothing, inbox full of retirement scams, and Twitter dms were being offered boost-for-pay promos as soon as I shared a freely minted token.
Show threadTed Saves Everything Nov 19, 2022

@davetroy To be clear there is no swag. The free stuff isn't real. NFT are like imaginary real estate (literally in metaverse) and can consist of every media... it's just got a place in the (ledger). The anonymity isn't legally real since the endpoint wallet must be signed like any financial account.

As far as "decentralization", tokens such as BAT and non fungible holdings appear to recentralize currency under businesses while all of it is only good as the fiat it's able to be exchanged with

Show threadSteve Shreve 📷Nov 19, 2022
@davetroy agree wholeheartedly. 👊
Show threadLeonardo Di OttioNov 19, 2022

@davetroy I have always felt that calling decentralisation Web3 makes perfect sense.

Web1 was ‘anyone can broadcast’.
Web2 was ‘anyone can talk back’.
Web3 is ‘anyone can host’.

Technologies such as Bittorrent and ActivityPub are then fine examples of Web3. Blockchain could be Web3 but is not required (or particularly useful).

Try to get that genie back into the bottle, though… Especially if there’s so much money behind the ‘cryptobro’ definition of Web3.

Show threadJames PurserNov 19, 2022
@LeonardoDiOttio @davetroy by that definition email is web3
Show threadNatanael ⚠️Nov 22, 2022
@purserj @LeonardoDiOttio @davetroy I think extending it to include portable identity too makes a bit more sense. You can switch instances and automatically bring your followers over here
Show threadZiggy the Hamster ☎️ 4ZTHNov 19, 2022

@LeonardoDiOttio @davetroy

Web 2.0 was asynchronous JavaScript, the concept of web applications, the semantic web (i.e., literally ActivityPub and the other RDF things that came before it), and decentralization.

"Web3" is something a bunch of grifters created to sell people concepts which had long been standardized.

Anyone has always been able to host the web.

Show threadDave Troy Nov 19, 2022
@ZiggyTheHamster @LeonardoDiOttio more specifically 'web3' also aims to turn the web into a propertarian hellscape in service of profits and ideological fetishes. So there's that. lol
Show threadricardo Nov 19, 2022
@davetroy and that's how we like it.
Show threadjoëlNov 19, 2022
@davetroy however, misskey (a fediverse software people often use as single-person-Instance) is sponsored by rss3, which is trying ... something with RSS an blockchain. Not sure what to make of that exactly, but I guess it's good to be cautious.
Show threadTim✅:verified:Nov 19, 2022
@davetroy I absolutely agree. If someone needs encryption they are likely hiding something.
Show threadninchukaNov 19, 2022
@MrKnowItAll @davetroy so you like your personal conversations between you and your family/friends being able to be read by anyone?
Show threadjzakotnikNov 19, 2022
@davetroy maybe the problem is the people and not the technology ? Whatever „crypto“ means in this context. Do you refer to „cryptography“? What’s bad about this?
Show threadwonderwomancodeNov 19, 2022

@davetroy

Ugh, OK, here we go.

Some of us are exhausted by the get rich quick scammers in the web3 space.

Hi I'm Angela. I work in web3 on open-source, collectively owned, community-governed, peer-to-peer systems. I am not a billionaire or trying to convince my friends and relatives to immediately dump their fiat.

I've worked on other distributed systems like ActivityPub, Pubsubhubbub, XMPP PubSub, Kafka and more.

I might just have something interesting to add to the conversation here.

Show threadBastian Blankenburg 🤝 🛡Nov 20, 2022
@wonderwomancode @davetroy Yes please.
Show threadPekka SipiläNov 19, 2022

@davetroy I brought up this exact point and we discussed this topic at the first Mastodon meeting in Finland last night.

https://attractive.space/@Setok/109364326291755986

Finnish startup Jaiku from 2006 was also mentioned as opening API for aggregated social media before PubSubHubbub, though bought by Google and discontinued shortly after. Hard to find exact details on this history because of link rot.

And I'm too young to remember these events clearly while being in high school back then.

#MastodonMeetup #Slush2022

Kristoffer Lawson (@[email protected])

Even more topical than we imagined with #riptwitter going on: today will be the first ever #mastodon #meetup in #finland. Courtesy of @[email protected] and myself. 17:00 at Bierhaus, Tripla, Helsinki. A short distance from #slush. Open to everyone. Let’s discuss the futures of social media over beer.

Mastodon
Show threadPekka SipiläNov 19, 2022

@davetroy Maybe Jyri Engeström and Petteri Koponen, the founders of Jaiku, can tell us the story in more detail when they join Mastodon?

I can't find them through name search here yet and no indications of Mastodon on their Twitter accounts' bio.

#MastodonMeetup #Slush2022 #Jaiku #PubSubHubbub #ActivityPub #RSS #API

Show threadStjepan ZlodiNov 19, 2022
@davetroy There is no "web3 technology", just a big bubble filled with fog.
Show threadKornelNov 19, 2022

@davetroy Mastodon could benefit from the old-school cryptography to offer stronger privacy for DMs.

It's sad that scammers have hijacked and muddled terms like "crypto(graphy)", "decentralization", and "web" for their scammy vaporware.

Show threadundead enby of the apocalypseNov 19, 2022
@davetroy we block or defederate crypto shills here
Show threadRileyNov 19, 2022
@davetroy was it really called PubSubHubbub lmao
Show threaddanbriNov 19, 2022
@davetroy does the word “cryptography” need spelling out in full now and forever, to avoid confusion with web3-grift-crypto?
Show thread:verified: andy :verified:Nov 19, 2022
@davetroy probably no reason to run since nobody will be able to build a scalable technology that just won’t work for the use case
Show threadJim StewartsonNov 19, 2022
@davetroy OK, you totally had me until “PubSubHubbub” 😂
Show threadMorganNov 19, 2022
@davetroy the amount of times I've seen (or been) someone tryna explain the fediverse say something along the lines of "decentralized (not crypto)"
Show threadElle of the Past Nov 19, 2022
@davetroy web3 is not just crypto, and it’s sad that crypto bros have co-opted an entire terminology like that. Mastodon is indeed a web3 technology, it’s just not built with any sort of blockchain or crypto.
Show threadDave Troy Nov 19, 2022
@pastelscute yeah no. That assertion is not widely accepted.
Show threadElle of the Past Nov 19, 2022

@davetroy That's exactly my point, before this crypto blitz Web3 was any software or protocol attempting to decentralize the web. Crypto was but one aspect of it. Web3 was originally things just like Mastodon, Scuttlebutt, Matrix or any other distributed service, technology, or otherwise. The main point was taking back the web from Web2's centralized nature.

The term was completely co-opted.

Show threadDave Troy Nov 19, 2022
@pastelscute fair enough.
Show threadMatt WNov 20, 2022
@davetroy PREACH!
Show threadMatt WillemsenNov 20, 2022
@davetroy You had me at RSS!
Show threadGert BachmannNov 20, 2022
@davetroy so its not an other darknet after all?;=)) I may be pessimistic but I expect serious attemps to ban peer to peer activity and local nongov servers for good. I have not forgotten what happened to pirate bay.
Show threadThunderOwlNov 21, 2022
@davetroy Amen.
Show threadarunodaNov 21, 2022
@davetroy Well first of all, web3 is a joke. It’s a buzzword made by some of VCs who took a hit recently with the FTX saga. Current web as is all good.
Show threadDave Troy Nov 21, 2022
@arunoda yes, I know.
Show threadLeif JohanssonNov 22, 2022
@davetroy hear hear
Show threadHans-CeesNov 22, 2022

@davetroy now there's a word I like
PubSubHubbub
The
PubSubHubbub

I was walking in the
#PubSubHubbub