Andrew Wooldridge ⛰️Dec 23, 2025
Anyone interested in an old #cybiko ?
Show threadTelH90Jun 13

@triptych Would love to, but @BNetzA says nope.

- As in: 'You cannot use any non-approved transcievers' and 'The primary users of said Band [ #GSM900 ] have every right to the exclusive frequency allocation they paid for.'

And as cool as it sounds, I'd rather not risk €50k+ in fines if not jailtime for #SpectrumViolation|s...

- Maybe someone will make a #LoRa / #Meshtastic version that uses 27/40/433/868MHz ?

I boosted your post tho, cuz the #Cybiko is still cool.

https://mastodon.social/@toychicken/116510383197370769

Show threadJustin DerrickJun 13
@kkarhan @triptych @BNetzA @toychicken Is there anything stopping someone from implementing LoRa over 27Mhz? Like, patents or similar?
Show threadTelH90Jun 13

@JustinDerrick @triptych @BNetzA @toychicken #LoRa AFAICT is midband, uses spread-spectrum and wider channels, so it's not compatible with like #CEPT standardized #CB radio in 27MHz...

One could do #AFSK modulated Packet Radio, but most juristictions, like Germany, do not allow DIY of Transmitters but necessitate a certified radio to be used...

DIY-ing a compliant transciever is extremely costly due to certification req..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_band_radio#Frequency_allocations
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISM_radio_band#Frequency_allocations
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/CB-Funk#CEPT-konforme_CB-Kan%C3%A4le_und_Mittenfrequenzen

Citizens band radio - Wikipedia

Show threadTelH90Jun 13

@JustinDerrick @triptych @BNetzA @toychicken also AFAICT #LoRa does have #Patents and #Trademarks that [at least the chip] manufacturers have to license...

#Dash7 seems less constrained, but is obviously incompatible.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LoRa
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DASH7#OSS-7:_Dash7_open-source_stack

LoRa - Wikipedia

Show threadTelH90Jun 13

@JustinDerrick @triptych @BNetzA @toychicken

You'd likely have an easier time implementing #LiFi or even #IrDA over visible light spectrum if not a faster version of #RONJA.

- Something that @stman has been working on for some time, including a sort-of WDM to enable more bandwith by using different LEDs at different wavelenghts together and filtering them at the RX-end.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RONJA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li-Fi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IrDA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wavelength-division_multiplexing

RONJA - Wikipedia

Show threadTelH90Jun 13

@JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken @stman That being said:
#IrDA over visible light (regardless if free-field or cabled [i.e.Mini - #TOSlink] would be nifty tho, if it can do #broadcast...

But the problem is that unlike #LoRa these are designed as [half-]duplex protocols and not as something "replayable"...
So one would need to develop some protocol that is simplex and can facilitate said transfers in small packets.

https://github.com/kbtechnologies/ATP
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IrDA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TOSLINK#Mini-TOSLINK

GitHub - KBtechnologies/ATP: Airgapped Transfer Protocol

Airgapped Transfer Protocol. Contribute to KBtechnologies/ATP development by creating an account on GitHub.

GitHub
Show threadTelH90Jun 13

@JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken @stman Either way, #Meshtastic & #LoRa is designed to exceed the range of #SRD radios that are common around the world...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short-range_device

Short-range device - Wikipedia

Show thread★ STMAN ★ 🏳️‍🌈

@kkarhan Do you know why there are no huge citizen mesh networks with Lora or WiFi ?

Because of latency. It doesn't scale well at all to an autonomous mesh cyberspace because each node brings such a huge latency that it cannot scale massively.

It's all about node latency.

And this is TCP/IP's fault mostly. Each paquet require its header to be decoded, analyzed, to know where to route it, and this task is time consuming with a CPU.

@JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken

Jun 14 at 10:11amMastodon for iOS
Show threadTelH90Jun 14

@stman @JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken Yeah.
- It's like trying to use #Iridium #SBD for Internet access, when your packets are limited to 270 Bytes.

- In #Narrowband like that, it's basically impossible to accomondate TCP/IP, to the point that it's common asvice to developers in these cases just dump binary data straight into it as it's gonna be spit out to a fixed endpoint anyway.

But when you have to route packets like #LoRa / #APRS / #AX25 / #Meshtastic, the system gets clogged fast!

Show threadAlex@rtnVFRmedia Suffolk UKJun 14

@kkarhan @stman @JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken

this also creates another social barrier - limited resources will ultimately mean folk have to decide if the message is essential if there is a crisis situation (unlike even Fedi where you can post jokes, shitposts, cat pictures and all sorts) so such things become less popular unless folk are really interested in the tech.

I've considered using some LoRA service but never get round to it as there seems to be little activity round here, and setting up a node seems to involve doxxing yourself (even if you don't add to the map, its an obvious UHF radio signal with a known location)

Show threadmancubeJun 14

@stman
i dug into one of the lora based protocols to see if there was anything interesting i could contribute. the lack of any intelligent timing and collision mitigation let alone harq stopped me from bothering. all of that stuff is toast the minute people truly need it or someone decides to interfere with it

it's cool hobby stuff but that's about it
@kkarhan @JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken

Show threadTelH90Jun 14

@mancube @stman @JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken exactly.

That's the disadvantage of a license-free, unmanaged and decentralized protocol stack.

- Like CB-Radio, it relies on all participants to be bona-fide and not malicious actors.

And by design it's rather aimed to be competing with Iridium SBD, ZigBee, WiFi, Bluetooth and IrDA than a orderly managed network like GSM and it's successors.

- Granted, it would be hard to implement the lessions @torproject learned with their network...

Show threadTelH90Jun 14

@mancube @stman @JustinDerrick @triptych @toychicken exactly.

That's the disadvantage of a license-free, unmanaged and decentralized protocol stack.

- Like CB-Radio, it relies on all participants to be bona-fide and not malicious actors.

And by design it's rather aimed to be competing with Iridium SBD, ZigBee, WiFi, Bluetooth and IrDA than a orderly managed network like GSM and it's successors.

- Granted, it would be hard to implement the lessions @torproject learned with their network...