Never take seriously those who ridicule low income people for having a smartphone or laptop.
“If they’re so poor how did they buy an iPhone???”
Because they’re trying to escape poverty, not the 1700s, genius. If you think basic tech access is luxury, survive a month without it.
@chebra @housepanther @QasimRashid
I've never owned an iPhone in my life and I've managed to survive just fine. There are cheaper alternatives working fine.
@housepanther
One of my colleagues is also a type 2 diabetic and uses a dedicated device for monitoring. He considers it more reliable than smartphones.
And yes, I also know people who are comfortable with Apple's restrictive approach and therefore find their devices more reliable. Freedom requires responsibility. That's probably one of the main reasons why many people prefer Windows over Linux, regardless of the dependencies and risks.
@QasimRashid I’m visually impaired, and I actually pay for my iPhone monthly because it’s the only way I can afford it. For me, it’s not a luxury — it’s essential. I’ve tried Android, and while it’s usable for some, it just doesn’t work as smoothly with screen readers. The iPhone’s VoiceOver feature reads my apps, texts, and labels on products — I can scan a box from my cupboard to find out what it is. It’s my eyes, my weather alert system, my way to stay connected.
It’s all about priorities. My fiancé and I don’t have cable TV or a landline. We have internet and a couple of low-cost streaming services, and even those we’ve cut back on. For us, the phone stays — because without it, a lot of daily life simply wouldn’t be possible. For many of us with disabilities, technology isn’t an extra; it’s independence.
Apparently, many may not be aware of this... but the marked for used phones and computers is huge in most parts of the world.
Some will even buy phones with cracked screens, as long as its still usable.
Second hand tech is a real life saver for anyone who cannot afford the cost of a new phone or laptop.
@QasimRashid not to mention this tech in poor households and among the unhoused is often gifted, handed down from acquaintances who could afford and wanted a newer model, or provided at no cost by an org or gov.
Some people wrongly believe the only way to have stuff (legally) is to personally buy it for $$$.
I've faced the same assumptions with my book collection. It doesn't occur to these people that gift cards, direct gifts, salvaging, & picking through thrift/pawn shops can be big deals.
I remember when I bought my first cell phone - I was pulling into my office when I noticed one of the ubiquitous "recycling guys" (collecting cans and bottles for their return value)...this was probably '95-96.
This trash scrounger was talking on his cell with, I assume his wife, saying I'll get milk on the way home.
I purchased my own "mobile extension" (as I called it to my customers then) and then I was modern...much later than the trash guy. No more pager/pay phone for me.
Yup. I've seen orphans in poverty in africa with cell phones. It's essential.
@QasimRashid I *was* shocked to discover there's slightly more iPhone users than Android users in the US recently.
The cheapest model iPhone is *extremely* expensive compared to the average readily available generic Android phone.
I'd always thought of iPhones as kinda status symbols - but it seems like they are somehow mass market?
I'm not criticizing, but am very surprised -- based on basic economic principles I had expected iPhones to be perhaps 25% and the rest Android, minus flip phones.
@QasimRashid Also: I'm irritated daily by the fact that my new job uses an "app" for a time-clock. Yes, I have a smartphone. Yes, most people do. But I shouldn't *have* to have one to clock in and out of a dish-washing job. More and more you *have* to have a smart phone to function in the world.
Thankfully my phone is ruggedized after many had been destroyed working in kitchens.
Imagine if your phone being broken at work meant you can't clock in the next day unless you replace it.
@QasimRashid I was poor.
It is a terrible financial advice to buy luxury premium tech products (lost/destroyed at an accident). There are more important things to spend money on.
Getting basic tech access to escape poverty is a straw man fallacy when comes to buying a luxury tier of tech.
Even if I'm not poor anymore. All phones I own(ed) cost less than half of an iPhone.
(With exception of Pixel 7, that I returned because it wasn't worth the more than double price of good enough phones.)
That’s almost certainly true for new iPhones, but second-hand ones are often a similar price to Android ones with the same specs and are far more likely to get security updates. Unless you’re able (and have enough time to) install a third-party ROM and keep it up to date, a second-hand iPhone is often the best bet for something that can run recent apps (banks love to drop support for old operating systems, so that they don’t carry any liability from phones being hacked) and still gets security updates.
In my region:
- New iPhones start at 600€.
- New decent Android phones with great camera cost 200€ to 300€.
- New good enough Android phones for strictly basic needs cost 150€.
- Pixel costs similarly to iPhone (same luxury tier)
When being poor. Risk of destroying thing by accident, or during manual labor, is NOT negligible.
It's more secure to buy a new basic-needs phone each single year, than to hope expensive iPhone will (mechanically) last 4 years.
Second hand iPhone 8s (which are still getting security updates and got an OS update in September) are under £100, and work with a pre-pay SIM that costs under £1/month, and I have never seen the local second-hand computer shop not have one in stock. There are Android phones for less, but almost none of them still get security updates, many of them run locked-down firmware so you can’t install anything else. We recently spent £60 on a second-hand Android tablet for a demo (doesn’t get security updates but we don’t care, it’s connected to a local WiFi to talk to an MQTT server to provide a UI for an embedded device). I’d been planning on getting an Android phone but the tablet was cheaper than any phones that they had in stock that ran a vaguely recent Android (i.e. one that I could target without jumping through lots of hoops).
That's not bad, actually.
For how long do iPhones get security updates?
From quick skim at local second-hand portal, searching iPhone offers below 200€:
- found mostly Phone SE 2020 or iPhone 11 (2019) or iPhone 12 (2020)
- conditions new/refurbished or good-condition second-hand
- ranged from 120€ to 200€ (probably depending on seller's hurry / patience), but mostly around 180€
The iPhone 8 was released 8 years ago and is still getting updates. Most cheap Android phones get them for 2-3 years, the expensive ones for a few years longer.
Enough people buy the latest and greatest iPhone and sell on their old one that the price for the older ones that still have a decent lifespan is not too high.
@david_chisnall @qasimrashid okay, so here we have:
- getting old iPhone under 150€ in great condition (maybe its last update),
- or new Android under 150€ (likely no update ever).
Hmm, that's dilemma. Both sound fine as 1-year lasting choices.
And, both have good cameras, nowadays.
Thank you. You changed my view - iPhones can be a cheap and good option.
I was quite fixated on my old knowledge/experience of iPhones being too expensive, even secondhand or one had to be lucky with secondhand.
@david_chisnall @qasimrashid however, I'm still quite surprised by the new learning, that iPhone can be cheap and yet good to great option.
I used iPhone 7 (company provided phone, not owned by me), and it had quite great camera.
So, later iPhones should have same or better cameras. Doesn't sound bad, actually.
@QasimRashid I must confess than an iPhone, specifically, does not look like "basic tech" to me. There are many good Android phones which offer the same functionality for much less.
If you got it gifted or similar or you need the iPhone for a special purpose (such as screen readers) then OK, but otherwise if you're struggling, it isn't a very good financial decision to buy an iPhone.
Getting a refurbished iPhone is one option. No need to buy a new one.
@juuhaa @QasimRashid True, I hadn’t considered that. (Although my experience with refurbished things has been very bad. They broke down very quickly and had no warranty, so personally I avoid refurbished.)
Second-hand would be a better option IMO. And around 200 USD, not too bad.
@QasimRashid To clarify. A NEW iPhone while struggling = BAD decision.
Second-hand I just learned through others, there are good options. 👍
(And no, I had many issues with refurbished "goods", and Android phones under 200€ so I would stay away from either)
@QasimRashid I didn't read something more false and stupid as this, in my life!
Yet another troll who's writing pseudo helpful sentences, but in the reality only incites people against each other with cleverly chosen topics!
Nope, smartphones nor laptops aren't a "first need" things. You can survive or live your life without them very easily. That's not the problem at all.
The real problem are paid trolls like you. Misleading people with fancy bullshit, driving them into hateful arguing etc.
@QasimRashid The discussion in this thread tells me that it is exactly how the 0,1% envisioned would want it to be.
We squabble amongst ourselves over insignificant minute details about whether the poor should have use cheaper Android devices instead of Apple ecosystem. Or why a poor family needs a big flatscreen television. While it is actually about WHY THE RICH SHOULD GET YET ANOTHER TAX BREAK TO BUY ANOTHER LUXURY BUNKER-MANSION, PRIVATE JET OR ROCKET SHIP!
And in order to do that, your rights, healthcare, education and all basic means for a functioning and fair society are being stripped or dismantled to their benefit. Those thousand dollar devices are truly the least of your problems while the world is heading into a plutocracy.
Focus on the bigger picture, people. Qasim was trying to tell you that.
@QasimRashid I’m disappointed the comments on here are mostly Android vs iPhone, instead of “why is **everything I need** online?”
Looking for a bus schedule? “scan the QR code to see when the next bus arrives”
Are you applying for a driver’s license, voter registration, or some kind of benefit? “please download and fill out the form before you arrive at your appointment”
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