if I had a lot more time I think I might write a book on my ideas about "adversarial automation".
The idea that the point of computers is to help the humans do their job faster and easier, and sometimes the computer or the software on it is the enemy in that battle.
because I see a lot of people approaching automation from this attitude of "software/sites should have APIs so that users can write software to automate it!"
and while that's not wrong, exactly, it's also not the attitude I think makes the most sense, you know?
We do not ask for access. We don't need to get permission to be able to automate our tasks.
There is always API 0: acting like a human/browser/user.
The first API is "fuck you I'm doing it anyway". Any additional API the program provides is merely a helpful shortcut
like, if your API doesn't provide me a follow_user() call, but the user can follow anyone by clicking one link?
Your lack of a follow_user() call is not going to stop me. I'm just going to click the link, automatically.
Having an API 1.0 doesn't mean API 0 goes away.
my point is that every program, every website, DOES expose an API, you just need to know how to best use that API.
That API being "the access they provide for humans"
I think of this as a short term vs long term thinking sort of problem. Like, a lot of programmers are stuck in the "should" part of thinking about programs and sites.
Yes, the program SHOULD be open source, so you can just fix the UI. Yes, the website SHOULD have an extensive API so you can easily automate it.
I agree with all that!
but... it doesn't.
by all means, try to switch to open source alternatives or get them to fix it or add an API.
But at the end of the day that's asking "the enemy" to do something for you, and they are under no obligation to listen to you.
(They may not even exist anymore, given that a lot of the times when I've used this sort of Adversarial Automation it's been focused on software from decades ago)
But the fact is, often times people have jobs where they aren't self-employed and have to work for other people, and those other people can be like "you need to use FooBaz 2007 for this job".
Would it be easier to automate if you were using OpenBaz? Certainly! But your boss can still tell you "no, we're not switching to OpenBaz, we need to use FooBaz 2007"
well, at the time the only way you could make books for apple devices was to use the book creation program, which was basically a word processor. It was focused around the idea that you would create your books inside it.
Well, we already had our books created.
We didn't want to have someone retype them.
We could import them as plain text (or DOC, I think?) and that'd get the actual text content of our books with some minor formatting, but we had very interactive and multimedia books. Tons of images, cross links, quizzes, and so on. Pretty much all things that the apple book format supported, but didn't support importing.
Should Apple have provided better docs and interfaces and APIs?
Yes, of course!
We asked for them.
But at the end of they day, they may not. And we need to publish this stuff soon, not in several years when Apple decides it might be a good idea for the next revision
My overall point is something like:
By all means, use APIs and official channels and built-in scripting support if you can.
But remember those are only shortcuts to automation. You can always ignore them and off-road.
My silliest example of this sort of thing:
I was automatically taking screenshots of a DS game in an emulator. my program would load a savestate, jam some new data into the DS's RAM, hit a button, then screenshot it. But the emulator was showing a "SAVE STATE LOADED!" text overlay over the game's window, no matter what option I set.
I open the EXE in a hex editor. Find the string "SAVE STATE LOADED!", and change the first character to a NUL.
Now the emulator is still showing the message, but since it's zero characters long, it's invisible. Problem solved.
One thing that really pisses me off personally is the #regression in terms of #Messenger #Apps. My personal distaste and dislike for #proprietary, #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider #services like #Signal [¹](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114234551915193036) [²](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114935952643402592), #Telegram, #Discord [³](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114865723904157014) [⁴](https://social.treehouse.systems/@krutonium/115157611977216372), #WhatsApp [⁵](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114873895410403238), #Slack, #MicrosoftTeams, #discord [⁶](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/116063760849048926)[⁷](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/115736223551632209) etc. aside: - *WHY* is there no #CrossProvider #Messenger to handle that shite? - *WHY* does everyone of these shitty providers think people want to download their #bloated #WebApp that takes up triple digit Megabytes if not entire Gigabytes and will gobble up all the #RAM and #CPU each of them can?? This problem ain't new and *already got [solved for corporate social media](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114862619013462466) ages ago!* (Not to mention actually good messengers!) - And no, [bridges](https://toots.ch/@dalai/114862754556459439) *[don't](https://swecyb.com/@troed/114862774972645542) count*! - I mean `API 0` - [style](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685423773959519) access because obviously [none of the platforms](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685414638522984) will *allow, endorse or support such an endeavour* and [*actively fight the developers and users*](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685441496803574) ! So yeah, consider this a call for a @[email protected] / #Gajim or @[email protected] / #Pidgin *for garbage platforms!* - Cuz back in the day we had *way worse messengers* yet people actually made #AIM, #ICQ, #MSN, #QQ, #IRC & #XMPP work just fine from one single *"phat" client*! - Can we please get that back? Cuz #WastefulComputing pisses me off! #api0 #Enshittification
@benjohn @foone nodds in agreement
Content warning: cartoon violence against software
@foone I not only say so but I give it the finger more often!
kill -9 is the biggest finger!
@foone I think the aversion to just using regex to make your own API stems from our desire to not have a moving target.
Then you try to build on any Google API and have it move anyways.
@mjdxp @foone or beat it and the providers into submission with the digital equivalent of a aluminium baseball bat!
One thing that really pisses me off personally is the #regression in terms of #Messenger #Apps. My personal distaste and dislike for #proprietary, #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider #services like #Signal [¹](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114234551915193036) [²](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114935952643402592), #Telegram, #Discord [³](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114865723904157014) [⁴](https://social.treehouse.systems/@krutonium/115157611977216372), #WhatsApp [⁵](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114873895410403238), #Slack, #MicrosoftTeams, #discord [⁶](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/116063760849048926)[⁷](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/115736223551632209) etc. aside: - *WHY* is there no #CrossProvider #Messenger to handle that shite? - *WHY* does everyone of these shitty providers think people want to download their #bloated #WebApp that takes up triple digit Megabytes if not entire Gigabytes and will gobble up all the #RAM and #CPU each of them can?? This problem ain't new and *already got [solved for corporate social media](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114862619013462466) ages ago!* (Not to mention actually good messengers!) - And no, [bridges](https://toots.ch/@dalai/114862754556459439) *[don't](https://swecyb.com/@troed/114862774972645542) count*! - I mean `API 0` - [style](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685423773959519) access because obviously [none of the platforms](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685414638522984) will *allow, endorse or support such an endeavour* and [*actively fight the developers and users*](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685441496803574) ! So yeah, consider this a call for a @[email protected] / #Gajim or @[email protected] / #Pidgin *for garbage platforms!* - Cuz back in the day we had *way worse messengers* yet people actually made #AIM, #ICQ, #MSN, #QQ, #IRC & #XMPP work just fine from one single *"phat" client*! - Can we please get that back? Cuz #WastefulComputing pisses me off! #api0 #Enshittification
One thing that really pisses me off personally is the #regression in terms of #Messenger #Apps. My personal distaste and dislike for #proprietary, #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider #services like #Signal [¹](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114234551915193036) [²](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114935952643402592), #Telegram, #Discord [³](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114865723904157014) [⁴](https://social.treehouse.systems/@krutonium/115157611977216372), #WhatsApp [⁵](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114873895410403238), #Slack, #MicrosoftTeams, #discord [⁶](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/116063760849048926)[⁷](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/115736223551632209) etc. aside: - *WHY* is there no #CrossProvider #Messenger to handle that shite? - *WHY* does everyone of these shitty providers think people want to download their #bloated #WebApp that takes up triple digit Megabytes if not entire Gigabytes and will gobble up all the #RAM and #CPU each of them can?? This problem ain't new and *already got [solved for corporate social media](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114862619013462466) ages ago!* (Not to mention actually good messengers!) - And no, [bridges](https://toots.ch/@dalai/114862754556459439) *[don't](https://swecyb.com/@troed/114862774972645542) count*! - I mean `API 0` - [style](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685423773959519) access because obviously [none of the platforms](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685414638522984) will *allow, endorse or support such an endeavour* and [*actively fight the developers and users*](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685441496803574) ! So yeah, consider this a call for a @[email protected] / #Gajim or @[email protected] / #Pidgin *for garbage platforms!* - Cuz back in the day we had *way worse messengers* yet people actually made #AIM, #ICQ, #MSN, #QQ, #IRC & #XMPP work just fine from one single *"phat" client*! - Can we please get that back? Cuz #WastefulComputing pisses me off! #api0 #Enshittification
@dziban @foone I literally get stomach cramps and have to vomit when I touch Windows, so this is too relatable...
One thing that really pisses me off personally is the #regression in terms of #Messenger #Apps. My personal distaste and dislike for #proprietary, #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider #services like #Signal [¹](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114234551915193036) [²](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114935952643402592), #Telegram, #Discord [³](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114865723904157014) [⁴](https://social.treehouse.systems/@krutonium/115157611977216372), #WhatsApp [⁵](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114873895410403238), #Slack, #MicrosoftTeams, #discord [⁶](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/116063760849048926)[⁷](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/115736223551632209) etc. aside: - *WHY* is there no #CrossProvider #Messenger to handle that shite? - *WHY* does everyone of these shitty providers think people want to download their #bloated #WebApp that takes up triple digit Megabytes if not entire Gigabytes and will gobble up all the #RAM and #CPU each of them can?? This problem ain't new and *already got [solved for corporate social media](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114862619013462466) ages ago!* (Not to mention actually good messengers!) - And no, [bridges](https://toots.ch/@dalai/114862754556459439) *[don't](https://swecyb.com/@troed/114862774972645542) count*! - I mean `API 0` - [style](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685423773959519) access because obviously [none of the platforms](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685414638522984) will *allow, endorse or support such an endeavour* and [*actively fight the developers and users*](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685441496803574) ! So yeah, consider this a call for a @[email protected] / #Gajim or @[email protected] / #Pidgin *for garbage platforms!* - Cuz back in the day we had *way worse messengers* yet people actually made #AIM, #ICQ, #MSN, #QQ, #IRC & #XMPP work just fine from one single *"phat" client*! - Can we please get that back? Cuz #WastefulComputing pisses me off! #api0 #Enshittification
Your message is well received. I 100% agree with the "fuck you, doing it anyway" methods and have done some of the things you mention, like wrapping a shitty Java hardware controller with xdotool, editing binaries, replacing the dynamic linker to use different libc.
My first job involved protocol normalizers for financial data, and included putting an API around things designed for a dedicated rs232 attached terminal.
@foone I do say "fuck you!" way too less...
And yes, I'm pissed off about shitty #WebApps to the point that my anger becomes "weapons-grade"!
One thing that really pisses me off personally is the #regression in terms of #Messenger #Apps. My personal distaste and dislike for #proprietary, #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider #services like #Signal [¹](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114234551915193036) [²](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114935952643402592), #Telegram, #Discord [³](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114865723904157014) [⁴](https://social.treehouse.systems/@krutonium/115157611977216372), #WhatsApp [⁵](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114873895410403238), #Slack, #MicrosoftTeams, #discord [⁶](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/116063760849048926)[⁷](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/115736223551632209) etc. aside: - *WHY* is there no #CrossProvider #Messenger to handle that shite? - *WHY* does everyone of these shitty providers think people want to download their #bloated #WebApp that takes up triple digit Megabytes if not entire Gigabytes and will gobble up all the #RAM and #CPU each of them can?? This problem ain't new and *already got [solved for corporate social media](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114862619013462466) ages ago!* (Not to mention actually good messengers!) - And no, [bridges](https://toots.ch/@dalai/114862754556459439) *[don't](https://swecyb.com/@troed/114862774972645542) count*! - I mean `API 0` - [style](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685423773959519) access because obviously [none of the platforms](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685414638522984) will *allow, endorse or support such an endeavour* and [*actively fight the developers and users*](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685441496803574) ! So yeah, consider this a call for a @[email protected] / #Gajim or @[email protected] / #Pidgin *for garbage platforms!* - Cuz back in the day we had *way worse messengers* yet people actually made #AIM, #ICQ, #MSN, #QQ, #IRC & #XMPP work just fine from one single *"phat" client*! - Can we please get that back? Cuz #WastefulComputing pisses me off! #api0 #Enshittification
You've probably heard of the famous 'thank you for playing Wing Commander' story. It claims that a programmer on the original Wing Commander was stuck getting an error message when the game unloaded its memory during a quit. Pressed for time, instead of fixing the issue he simply hex edited the memory manager's error reporting to print 'thank you for playing Wing Commander' instead. A funny and relatable story!
@usagi @foone @collette I just refuse to apply to places with shitty #TechStack|s because it makes fucking aggressive...
One thing that really pisses me off personally is the #regression in terms of #Messenger #Apps. My personal distaste and dislike for #proprietary, #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider #services like #Signal [¹](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114234551915193036) [²](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114935952643402592), #Telegram, #Discord [³](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114865723904157014) [⁴](https://social.treehouse.systems/@krutonium/115157611977216372), #WhatsApp [⁵](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114873895410403238), #Slack, #MicrosoftTeams, #discord [⁶](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/116063760849048926)[⁷](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/115736223551632209) etc. aside: - *WHY* is there no #CrossProvider #Messenger to handle that shite? - *WHY* does everyone of these shitty providers think people want to download their #bloated #WebApp that takes up triple digit Megabytes if not entire Gigabytes and will gobble up all the #RAM and #CPU each of them can?? This problem ain't new and *already got [solved for corporate social media](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114862619013462466) ages ago!* (Not to mention actually good messengers!) - And no, [bridges](https://toots.ch/@dalai/114862754556459439) *[don't](https://swecyb.com/@troed/114862774972645542) count*! - I mean `API 0` - [style](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685423773959519) access because obviously [none of the platforms](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685414638522984) will *allow, endorse or support such an endeavour* and [*actively fight the developers and users*](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685441496803574) ! So yeah, consider this a call for a @[email protected] / #Gajim or @[email protected] / #Pidgin *for garbage platforms!* - Cuz back in the day we had *way worse messengers* yet people actually made #AIM, #ICQ, #MSN, #QQ, #IRC & #XMPP work just fine from one single *"phat" client*! - Can we please get that back? Cuz #WastefulComputing pisses me off! #api0 #Enshittification
Adversarial automation
@foone it’s baffling to me how many people have the preconception of “this shouldn’t be done” just because “it’s not supported”, or because “it may change at any time!”
getting rid of that opens a huge world of possibilities. Stuff will break, but so do “real” APIs from time to time. computers are shit, is there a difference here?
i feel that learning basic reverse engineering skills is something that more power users should do
@domi @foone Sadly, #TechLiteracy is in decline and #consoomers get groomed into accepting #bloatware!
One thing that really pisses me off personally is the #regression in terms of #Messenger #Apps. My personal distaste and dislike for #proprietary, #SingleVendor & #SingleProvider #services like #Signal [¹](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114234551915193036) [²](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114935952643402592), #Telegram, #Discord [³](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114865723904157014) [⁴](https://social.treehouse.systems/@krutonium/115157611977216372), #WhatsApp [⁵](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114873895410403238), #Slack, #MicrosoftTeams, #discord [⁶](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/116063760849048926)[⁷](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/115736223551632209) etc. aside: - *WHY* is there no #CrossProvider #Messenger to handle that shite? - *WHY* does everyone of these shitty providers think people want to download their #bloated #WebApp that takes up triple digit Megabytes if not entire Gigabytes and will gobble up all the #RAM and #CPU each of them can?? This problem ain't new and *already got [solved for corporate social media](https://infosec.space/@kkarhan/114862619013462466) ages ago!* (Not to mention actually good messengers!) - And no, [bridges](https://toots.ch/@dalai/114862754556459439) *[don't](https://swecyb.com/@troed/114862774972645542) count*! - I mean `API 0` - [style](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685423773959519) access because obviously [none of the platforms](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685414638522984) will *allow, endorse or support such an endeavour* and [*actively fight the developers and users*](https://digipres.club/@foone/112685441496803574) ! So yeah, consider this a call for a @[email protected] / #Gajim or @[email protected] / #Pidgin *for garbage platforms!* - Cuz back in the day we had *way worse messengers* yet people actually made #AIM, #ICQ, #MSN, #QQ, #IRC & #XMPP work just fine from one single *"phat" client*! - Can we please get that back? Cuz #WastefulComputing pisses me off! #api0 #Enshittification
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