Shyamal Patel
Ars TechnicaTesla exaggerated EV range so much that drivers thought cars were broken
Inundated with complaints, Tesla created "Diversion Team" to cancel appointments.
Thorium@arstechnica Shocked Pikachu face 
a1@arstechnica reminds me of a certain Diesel software fraud. Let’s see if a similar storm breaks loose
peteo@ar1 @arstechnica
Although #teslagate is mostly around #fraud to make a small group of people rich, as opposed to hiding #pollutants that are particularly bad for children whilst trying to make a small group of people rich
Although #teslagate is mostly around #fraud to make a small group of people rich, as opposed to hiding #pollutants that are particularly bad for children whilst trying to make a small group of people rich
Lett Osprey@ar1 @arstechnica Emissionfraud kills.
Not at all the same.
@panduck @arstechnica you are, of course, right. Plus, in both cases, people have been lied to while taking their money, which begs for consumer protection, especially as those buying EVs obviously deserve more protection as they are trying to do more in favour of our environment.
@ar1 @arstechnica Car companies (absolutely every single one of them) are notorious liars. Fuel usage, energy usage, charge speed and (less known) carrying capacity (they lie on how much the car weigh) are never to be trusted.
Journalists here have started to get their eyes open for this and strickter standards have been enforced as a result. Some people have even managed to get their cars returned and money back.
Yes, laws protecting consumer rights is the key in every case.
Nathan Wierink@arstechnica I find it almost spot on. Sometimes a bit lower and sometimes a higher then indicated. In cold winter or very hot days a 10% less then indicated. That’s about the same difference in indicating as the volvo v70 3D that i had before.
gazan@nathanwierink @arstechnica I have a similar experience. I feel weird speaking positively about tesla though, but in my defense, I bought it before I knew much about musk.
@gazan @arstechnica same here and the ‘problem’ is that there where no brands that even came close to the driving experience and range 2 years ago. I tried the polestar, VW and the ford mustang. All of them to small, still a plain looking car interior and no supercharger places. Which I think is in Europe a mayor plus. They are everywhere and much cheaper in general then other charging stations.
@nathanwierink @arstechnica Besides the fact that all of those companies are corporations run by corporate people owned by stock holders. If you look at the actions of Ford or VW for example, you’ll see that they’re absolutely no better than Musk (and I would argue quite a bit worse). It’s just that Musk is a very public person who likes to run his mouth, so we all know about the crazy shit he does. I promise you if you looked into other car executives, you will uncover something familiar.
@gazan @arstechnica and due to personal situation the car is powered for app95% by 2nd hand solarpanels at home. Ps. Musk is still an asshole full of sheit!
Beeyokey@nathanwierink I agree with that in terms of the on screen navigation in my model y but the number you get when tap the battery for a range estimate is definitely never right.
@byokii model y as well but i see the indication being quite near the actual km. Maybe there is also a difference per country. We don’t have any hills or mountains.
Sean Eric Fagan@nathanwierink @arstechnica Below 50% charge, it gives more realistic estimates.
We don't tend to charge above 50% unless we're going on a long drive (e.g., to Dublin or Cork). And we don't drive ideally, and car load and weather factor in, and so forth.
What *did* catch my interest in that article was that all other EVs, save one, *underestimated* their available range.
Also, I'm waiting for the EPA and/or DOT to weigh in.
@kithrup @arstechnica this same ‘mistake’ is also widely ‘applied’ to fossil fuel cars. Almost ever since the range was calculated.
@nathanwierink @arstechnica That's why I'm waiting to see what the EPA does, if anything -- they cracked down *hard* on fossil-fuel milage estimates a while back, and I *thought* they had similar rules for EV range. But that could be voluntary, or of course I could be wrong.
Baron Vonskinnback@arstechnica bahahahaha, imagine buying a car made by someone who thinks blowing up rockets before they get into space a huge success...😂
Carl Anderson@arstechnica a slight smaller DieselGate maybe?
Jason Petersen (he)@arstechnica @GalacticHero as a Bolt owner I always assumed my car just had lower range, being much cheaper. But it would say 130 and I’d drive 80 and it would say 50, and I’d top it off back to 220 or whatever.
I never got the idea it was lying. Hell, I hate Elon and even I never would have made this story up. Jesus.
Justin Buist@jason @arstechnica @GalacticHero
I am totally confused by your comment. The story alleges Tesla inflated mileage numbers and you say your Bolt doesn't do that, which isn't a Tesla product.
I don't understand your "I never would have made this story up" I guess.
@justinbuist my feedback was “jeez I hate this person and though I understand EV issues around range anxiety, the concept of my car not being engineered to accurately portray that is so unthinkable I’d not have expected it even from him, the stupidest and worst person on earth”
Lightning Six@arstechnica Tesla is known for dirtbag moves like that. I say this as an owner for several years.
Karl Auerbach@arstechnica We have found on long trips that our Tesla, rated at 315 mile range, would reach zero at closer to 250 miles. These were measures taken on hot days - 100F to 112F on I70 and I80 though western Colorado, Utah, and Nevada. And the car is a 2019 model.
Overlander_1@karlauerbach @arstechnica my understanding is all electric vehicles have pretty terrible highway range.
@Overlander_1 @arstechnica We are on our second EV and they actually do a pretty amazing job - roughly 4miles per KWH. Much, of course depends on things like tires and tire pressure and outside temperature. Inside comfort things also matter - but it's now pretty much all heat-pumps for heating/cooling with the heating supplemented by heated seats.
Damon C. Jones@arstechnica yeah...I was asked by a local NBC reporter for KARE 11, about the range of my Leaf vs his Tesla. This was in March. He was floored by my provable range. He expected 300+ miles from his Tesla and was getting 180. Mine was a solid 220 expectation and I was getting 180 - 200 per full charge.
the_curiostech
Alan Martello@arstechnica “The Reuters report said the news agency sent detailed questions to Tesla and Musk but received no response.” Looks like Elon hasn’t moved the X PR team over to Tesla yet to save money, otherwise they would have gotten the poop emoji response.
James Ryland Miller@arstechnica So alleged fraud / alleged false advertising by #tesla and #musk? And then an alleged #coverup? Tech genius indeed /s.
Tyler Lund@arstechnica @lisamelton This is so nuts. I know the real reason is differences in the EPA test cycle used and Tesla choosing the one that results in a higher range, but the failure to do anything about it after all the complaints for years is astounding to me.
Tyler Martin@tylopoda @arstechnica @lisamelton "the failure to do anything about it after all the complaints for years"
This sums up Tesla as a company. 🤷
@Gur814 @arstechnica @lisamelton I was going to say that they have actually done some things to respond to feedback but then all the examples I came up with are actually ones where they haven’t done what people actually asked or took way too long. Like the UI changes everyone hated. Or putting features behind subscriptions. So that’s a big yep
Adam Sims@arstechnica that does seem a little... Fraud-y
Mikklun@arstechnica A tesla being a collection of fraud, lies and gimmicks is why I contend the company and it's illustrious CEO are doing more to harm and hinder the electric car market than to help it
Samer Kadoura@arstechnica we should call it electrongate.
Mastodon Migration@SamerKadoura @arstechnica Maybe "Elongate" ? 🤷
@mastodonmigration @arstechnica This works too.
Stryder Notavi@SamerKadoura @mastodonmigration @arstechnica The problem with naming scandals after Elon Musk us that there's so many - ElonGate could legitimately refer to any number of things (the Tesla fraud, overruling the engineers to save on launchpad design, his dumbass tweets about taking Tesla private that resulted in trouble with the SEC).
We could number them, I suppose - but that still means someone has to go away and make the list.
Mike Landers@mastodonmigration @SamerKadoura @arstechnica Problem with that is you end going “which one are you referring to?”
Pēteris Pūrītis 
@arstechnica @peteriskrisjanis Aj nu beidz. Tesla pārspīlē ekonomiju tieši tikpat, cik visi pārējie, ieskaitot ICE mašīnu ražotājus, visiem jau sen zināms fakts. Tas, ka Ilonai ir daži kubi apaļos caurumos, neatceļ, ka jātaisa sensācijas pēdiņās par to, ka Teslai riteņi griežas.
xs4me2The Musk way…
C0ppertop@arstechnica anybody here, see the Hand of Musk behind any if this?
HTPC NZ@arstechnica no wonder the "X" fiasco last few days, assume Reuters reached out for comment last week and to get media and cult distracted someone created a diversion.
~robby@arstechnica The title should say "realized" not "thought".
Someone besides the owner of the car installed software with the intent of making it misbehave. They didn't just think their cars are broken. Their cars *are* broken.
Someone besides the owner of the car installed software with the intent of making it misbehave. They didn't just think their cars are broken. Their cars *are* broken.
@arstechnica We already knew of Musk’s questionable ethics. I’m not surprised Tesla was lying about range.
But I view this Teslagate as a big failure for EPA. The government surely has the capability to measure range accurately
furina 💧⚖️@arstechnica of course they would 🙄
Jason Hunter@arstechnica I switched my M3 to a simple percentage display right away. Mileage depends on so many factors: speed, temperature, incline, wind (matters a lot!), and driving style. There’s a reason your phone doesn’t say how many hours of battery are left. That said, my car is rated at 310 miles or something, and it gets 250 realistically. My gas cars didn’t get the promised mpg either.
Ju Pesci@arstechnica Elon aurait… menti?? 
Ben Curran 
. @arstechnica the dominoes are falling. Lying CEO making false promises.
YingtaiCar at Tesla charging station. @arstechnica
Tofueater@arstechnica
The term "Diversion Team" kind of gives it away.
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/tesla-batteries-range/
The term "Diversion Team" kind of gives it away.
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/tesla-batteries-range/
Monsieur Valentine 🇺🇦@arstechnica does this mean that Tesla robotaxis not appearing in 2022?
HarveyDeckAstro@arstechnica driving Tesla and I don’t find any issue with the range. Fled Twitter because did not like what Elon did there. But my overall experience with Tesla has been very good.
Dud (Mx)@arstechnica Never liked Tesla cars. Also Melon Husk is more like Thomas Edison rather than Nicolas Tesla (In that he gets other people to do the research and then HE takes the credit for it!), but the name "Edison" is still registered.
JW prince of CPH@arstechnica This is a technique known in the marketing world as "straight-up fucking lying to people". It is not frowned upon quite enough, sometimes not at all.
Mr. Completely@arstechnica hey @Stoneycase you seeing this stuff? ^^^
Stoney Takes@mrcompletely @arstechnica Yeah I responded to another thread yesterday I’ll tag you, hang on.
Larry Garfield'"Tesla years ago began exaggerating its vehicles' potential driving distance—by rigging their range-estimating software," the article published today said.'
Didn't Volkswagen get into a heap of trouble for exactly that?
