Rowan Johnson
Argals"Healthy people cost less.
Educated people contribute more.
Housed people are more stable.
...in a healthy society there are no "undeserving".
There are just people."
Baloo Uriza@argals Republicans should be housed in prisons until properly disposed of, tho.
millennial fulcrum@argals common sense feels like cool, clean water hydrating my face.
good faith social democracy is the only valid type of government. all other "government" types are inherently corrupt.
the crazy thing is... just do what these folks do.
kirch@argals reminds me of:
“A developed country is not a place where the poor have cars. It’s where the rich use public transport. It is where the rich walk and where they use bikes. We should create cities where rich and poor meet as equals: in parks, on the sidewalks, on public transport.”
― Meik Wiking, The Little Book of Lykke: Secrets of the World’s Happiest People
Mad Engineering
brett danvers
Peter Krefting@kirch @argals The "MAGA" party of Norway (Framskrittspartiet) sees cyclists as "elitists" and seems to have stopping the building of bike lanes in favour of car routes as one of their founding principles.
(Swedish immigrant in Norway here, living in Oslo since 26 years and have not yet seen the need to own a car).
JWM (Joe No Se)@argals There are plenty of undeserving. We just call them “billionaires”
Greg Bell
spiegelmama@spiegelmama @argals @soatok even if they mean well it's still always less efficient than just using the money to help more ppl instead of measuring their virtue
Dannyboyguyman@argals while I fully embrace and endorse the sentiment and message from the Norwegian, I wonder if all Norwegians would be as enthusiastic about paying for public goods to support everybody in Norway if they had as ethnically diverse a populace as the US does
·J Mopp@jmopp @argals I am only observing that a significant portion of Americans are hostile to the idea of public goods and public welfare and I'm pretty sure it's because of their racism and explicitly opposed to the sentiment expressed in the original post. I would rather we all were like the Norwegian, alas.
sotolf@pinsk @argals I mean if you would care you should know that we're not a homogenous white pride utopia, while we're probably not as mixed up as the US we do have immigrants as well, I personally grew up with kids whose parents were pakistani, iranian, ethiopian, etc we also have right leaning rasistic leaning parties etc.of course, it's not all roses, I just get so tired of that clap-back that we get from Americans so often, as if we're some kind of white masterrace ethnostate.
WintergreenWas it Norway where some guy with a lot of money get a $200,000 (or similar) speeding ticket?
Leeloo@Wintergr33n @argals
Probably Switzerland.
They may not be the only country to do it, but they are infamous for it.
As I understand, speeding fines are a percentage of the price of the car. Speeding in a Ferrari? That's going to be expensive. Speeding in a 2CV? Good luck with that.
Nikkileah 🎮🚄🏳️⚧️🇬🇧@leeloo @Wintergr33n @argals speeding in a 2CV, the cops are behind cheering the driver on before having a friendly word after 😋
Henning Buddenbaum@henningbuddenbaum @leeloo @Wintergr33n @argals brilliant!!
Also faster than Jimmy Broadbent's Ferrari 360 Modena as long as it's parked.
The 2CV really is Best Car! ☺️😋
Also faster than Jimmy Broadbent's Ferrari 360 Modena as long as it's parked.
The 2CV really is Best Car! ☺️😋
@henningbuddenbaum @leeloo @Wintergr33n @argals also want to state I support the OP posting too.
Norwegian Soc Dem sounds fantastic.
Long may it continue
Norwegian Soc Dem sounds fantastic.
Long may it continue
Aleksandr Koltsoff@leeloo @Wintergr33n @argals In Finland speeding tickets (once the speeding is severe) are calculated based on income levels based on last taxed income (and additionally based on severity).
Other countries using similar arrangements are Sweden, Denmark, Germany, Mexico and Macao (according to wikipedia): https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/P%C3%A4iv%C3%A4sakko
Benjamin Braatz@nihkeys @leeloo @Wintergr33n @argals Germany's speeding tickets are (unfortunately) not based on income.
Yes, we have day-fines based on income, but only for criminal offences, while speeding tickets are usually only regulatory offences.
Yes, we have day-fines based on income, but only for criminal offences, while speeding tickets are usually only regulatory offences.
Joakim Fors@Wintergr33n @argals Finland has income based speeding tickets. Don't know about Norway.
Marianne@argals sadly a lot of their countryfolk don't buy it. There's a big problem of right-wing thought in Norway too, with racism, misogyny and anti-state sentiment. Not too different from a lot of places really.
Not to say they're wrong or anything, and I agree. Just in case anyone comes with 😍 Norway (I married one, but they left the country, so)
Not to say they're wrong or anything, and I agree. Just in case anyone comes with 😍 Norway (I married one, but they left the country, so)
GJ
Mensch, Marina@argals dignity is part of human rights and it must be for everyone, not only priviledged - if our societies aren't there yet, we need to work hard toward this goal! #HumanRights #Dignity
nixFREAK@argals The problem with U.S. is if it’s not good for me I don’t want it. The U.S. is very selfish and there has to be major societal changes before “we” could ever enact something like “democratic socialism” it’s sad but it’s the truth. The government has always been about “profits before people”.
DarqEven the most selfish people benefit from everybody receiving what they need. Less poverty makes places nicer to live in for everybody, including those with wealth. The motivation seems to go even deeper than selfishness, people are willing to make their own lives worse, just so someone else doesn't get something they didn't "earn".
Qybat@argals Here in the UK we feel disgusted at the idea of the lower classes receiving anything they haven't earned by toil and suffering. Poverty is seen as a moral failing, proof of laziness, criminality and stupidity. The US inherited that from us.
The only thing that angers us more than benefits going to poor people is when benefits go to poor, non-white people.
Neil Moffatt@argals Ever the wrong people pumping out overly simple and flawed messages with the media supporting them every step of the way.
epilonious@argals I've gotten to a point where I've started calling this "Norwegian Envyposting."
Where a person, usually white, basically posts "Look at how nice white People in Norway can be when there isn't a critical mass of Not White People upsetting them?"
And the problem is... They bury the lede on whether the problem is "White people in former colonies still don't want to give up the benefits that racism got their ancestors" or the problem is "This colony let too many not white people thrive"
@argals @argals because let me tell you: Democrats, Republicans, Fascists, Antifascists... They ALL want what Norwegians have.
But they have VERY different ideas of how to get there and who in the current society deserves it most.
And what is so scary is that now people are saying "The quiet part out loud" on the who and the how has been very upsetting for everyone involved.
But a good start is for well-meaning liberal types to stop posting a country of homogenous white people as the ideal.
'Where a person, usually white, basically posts "Look at how nice white People in Norway can be when there isn't a critical mass of Not White People upsetting them?"'
That's a really strange way to interpret the OOP...
"because let me tell you: Democrats, Republicans, Fascists, Antifascists... They ALL want what Norwegians have."
Not really though. Conservatives, and fascists especially, want there to be an underclass. Their ideology requires it. For society to be hierarchical, they need some people to be considered "more deserving" than others. Progressives want to dismantle those hierarchies, as the OOP said, there is no "deserving".
@Darq @epilonious @argals The success of Norway owes quite a lot to a lucrative oil industry combined with a sensible investment policy to make the most out of all that oil wealth.
Olympus MonsTer@argals - "We WANT our taxes to go to the 'undeserving.'"
Except my taxes go to (1) the federal government, (2) the state government, (3) the county, (4) the school district, (5) the city.
Maybe you can do this in a small, very rich, homogenous, unitary state like Norway, but it's not so easy in a very large, debt-ridden, ethnically diverse, multi-layered federal system like the U.S. where the "undeserving" is always some other level-of-government's problem.
Eric Lawton"To each according to their needs, from each according to their abilities."
— socialism in a nutshell
vy@argals I once shocked a right wing person who was whining to me about how liberals wanted to pay for health care for poor people and foreigners, by explaining I would rather my children did not get untreatable TB from someone who he was too short sighted to pay a few pennies in tax to treat.