David Allen KellyAug 16, 2023
Rod Hilton

Right now if you search for "country in Africa that starts with the letter K":

- DuckDuckGo will link to an alphabetical list of countries in Africa which includes Kenya.

- Google, as the first hit, links to a ChatGPT transcript where it claims that there are none, and summarizes to say the same.

This is because ChatGPT at some point ingested this popular joke:

"There are no countries in Africa that start with K."
"What about Kenya?"
"Kenya suck deez nuts?"

Google Search is over.

Aug 15, 2023 at 5:30pmWeb
Show threadLAURENAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton I honestly want to punch ChatGPT
Show threadPaul Chambers🚧Aug 15, 2023

@noondlyt @rodhilton

I believed him, but this is the internet so I checked for myself.

Oh my goodness. 💯 Real.

Show threadRyan2one3Aug 16, 2023
@paul @noondlyt @rodhilton lol same!
Show threadMinisterofimpedimentsAug 16, 2023
@paul @noondlyt @rodhilton …yeah, me too. Like the proverbial train wreck I just had to see the bodies myself.
Show threadJarjan (He/Him)Aug 17, 2023
@paul
Did you know the I in AI stands for Idiot? 😂
@noondlyt @rodhilton
Show threadapophisAug 16, 2023
@noondlyt @rodhilton it has a very pickaxe-to-the-CPU-able way with words
Show threadmk30Aug 16, 2023
@noondlyt @rodhilton @nicholas i'm sorry, that's ChadGPT: he speaks very confidently about things he knows nothing about. and yes, his face is extremely punchable.
Show threadThree plus or minus fiveAug 16, 2023
@mk30 @noondlyt @rodhilton @nicholas
It hadn’t occurred to me before, but there is now no question in my mind that ChatGPT is a “him”.
Show threadLAURENAug 16, 2023
@ThreeSigma @mk30 @rodhilton @[email protected] heh heh heh
Show threadMudManAug 17, 2023

@noondlyt @rodhilton
This doesn't really have a lot to do with ChatGPT.

To be clear, the chain of events is accurate, but what's happening here is Google's non-ML algo is picking up a funny excerpt on a site and featuring it as a "snippet".

The real outrage bait here is a) Google stealing site content to paste it on their search results page, and b) Google being bad at stealing that content and choosing the wrong one.

Show threadChuckAug 15, 2023

@rodhilton It also looks like none of the results that Google displays provides the answer. The ones that look like they might are scam sites.

It does provide the answer under the "People also ask" section, but since those are hardly relevant to me the majority of the time, I tend to ignore that section.

Show threadChuckAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton Also, my Google Home gave the exact same answer as the ChatGPT one. I need to get rid of that thing.
Show threadLAURENAug 15, 2023
@chuck @rodhilton naturallllly! this is the exact reason you only use them to turn your lights on and off and play music! 😃
Show threadCaryJMAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton Not that this contradicts the main point (that Google Search is over, which I agree with) but this same query in Google for me provides the correct result. Incredibly low bar but it does come back correct.
Show threadRod HiltonAug 15, 2023
@Caryjm the fact that Google was doing this went viral on a lot of socials and I believe there was a frontpage HN post about it as well, so Google has patched the query to fix this. It's working for me now as well.
Show threadCaryJMAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton that was what I was assuming as well - so egregious and with enough visibility that a manual fix was required. 100% agree with your thesis - if you’re looking for a fact which is known, Google no longer useful as a way to get it
Show threadkaupAug 15, 2023
@Caryjm @rodhilton I just did it, and exactly wrong. Not patched.
Show threadskelricAug 15, 2023
@Caryjm @rodhilton
Looks like AI was the weak link in the chain.
Show threadClickyMcTickerAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton @Caryjm It still produces the incorrect result as of this post. The suggested search query omits “the letter” from the query (see my other comment) which produces a correct result.
Show threadRAKAug 15, 2023
@ClickyMcTicker @rodhilton @Caryjm: Unfortunately, I appear, even without "the letter", to get the incorrect result.
Show threadMiro CollasAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton @Caryjm I get the same result as the OP
Show threadBornachAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton @Caryjm
Asking Google Home mini still fails for me
Show threadMarkAug 16, 2023
@rodhilton @Caryjm still the same now from Germany on google.de
Also "fixing" one exact search case will probably not help the issue at cause.
Show threadCaryJMAug 16, 2023
@weipah @rodhilton Yup
Show threadalex.tmAug 16, 2023
@rodhilton @Caryjm FYI, I just tried it 18 hours after your comment and still got the “Kenya doesn’t start with K” response from Google.
Show threadCrows LabyrinthAug 15, 2023

@Caryjm

Not for me. I get the wrong answer from Google.

@rodhilton

Show threadClickyMcTickerAug 15, 2023
@Caryjm @rodhilton Did you type “country in Africa that starts with the letter k” or “country in Africa that starts with k”? The former produces the result seen above, and the latter produces the result you received (albeit that same result is the second on the list behind the correct answer)
Show threadIsho'yeAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton This is the snippet that I get, but the first link below that, and the "people also ask" section is the wildly incorrect AI-generated one.
Show threadRod HiltonAug 15, 2023
@wuffish yeah they fixed it after news of this search went viral
Show threadkaupAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton @wuffish Not fixed for me.
Show threadjonny (good kind)Aug 16, 2023
@wuffish
@rodhilton
that snippet is also incorrect LLM garbage lmao.
Show threadIsho'yeAug 16, 2023

@jonny @rodhilton and they want to make it worse. Thankfully, for now, the "feature" is experimental, and has to be explicitly enabled on your Google account.

https://www.androidpolice.com/google-search-generative-experience-while-browsing/

Google's AI Search Experience wants to change the way you look at a page

Google's AI search tool wants to streamline page viewing

Android Police
Show threadjonny (good kind)Aug 16, 2023
@wuffish
@rodhilton
aha didn't see this update today. for the record I freaking called it
https://jon-e.net/surveillance-graphs/#the-near-future-of-surveillance-capitalism-knowledge-graphs-get-chatbots
Surveillance Graphs

Vulgarity and Cloud Orthodoxy in Linked Data Infrastructures - A critical history of the semantic web and linked data, grappling with the next generation of surveillance capitalism, where grand corporate knowledge graphs devour the planet and sell it back to us as a glassy-eyed LLM personal assistants, will we remain stuck in the ideology of the cloud, or can we have better dreams?

Surveillance Graphs
Show threadKonchog Tenzen SangpoAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton uh... Wtf!
But well, it's always been (and what the majority maybe never learned in the first) that Google ain't a fact finding machine, same as (academic) Wikipedia often is years behind actualities
Show threadDa NobsAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton
works for me...
but probably because I use the "german" google
Show threadArtemisAug 15, 2023
@nobs
It may also vary person to person. What with search histories and all, we aren't all given the same results anyway. Which is possibly more insidious because some people will be given bullshit answers and others won't even see that happening.
@rodhilton
Show threadDamon L. WakesAug 16, 2023
@artemis @nobs @rodhilton Thanks for highlighting this. I get the impression a lot of people (especially in these replies) don't realise that other people won't necessarily see the same results as them even for the exact same query.
Show threadPurpleAug 16, 2023
@nobs @rodhilton I had the same result as you. But Tanzania is in the south, not in the north!
Show threadEd MasteAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton I see lots of replies that report it was fixed, but I got the bogus result just now. Incredible.
Show threadDweebishAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton Might want to check the alt text on these images
Show threadPrasenjeet DuttaAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton they appear to have fixed it now, but absolutely agree it’s no longer as relatively great as it used to be.
Show threadErik JonkerAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton
If you ask it ChatGPT the answer is perfect
@zandbelt
Show threadmiawgogo  Aug 15, 2023
@ErikJonker @rodhilton @zandbelt so if you ask it the prompt that gave that response that Googles quoting, it still gets it wrong
Show threadkaupAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton I just tested it. Amazing.
Show threadEdelruth, PBS Passport HolderAug 15, 2023

@rodhilton

Which is why I am using #DuckDuckGo to track down a replacement gasket for my dryer door. No thank you Google, I do not want to purchase a new dryer.

Show threadDeuchnordAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton ????
Show threadMad_DogAug 17, 2023

@Deuchnord @rodhilton : ça me rappelle les fois où j'ai demandé à chat GPT de m'aider pour le Wordle.

C'est toujours très drôle quand tu lui demande des mots qui ne contiennent pas la lettre "o" et que dès le 5ème, il te dit "harmonica"

Show threadDeuchnordAug 17, 2023
@maddog @rodhilton ou bien tu demandes uniquement des mots de 6 lettres, mais la réponse ne contient que des mots qui n’en ont pas !
Show threadMad_DogAug 17, 2023

@Deuchnord @rodhilton : ha ha ha.

J'adore ce moment où la technologie sensée nous dépasser montre ses failles

Show threadahimsaAug 15, 2023

@rodhilton I tried it and got similar bad results from Google. That bogus Emergent Mind result was the second link listed, not the first one. The 5th resultwas a reddit post from 2021 claiming there are no countries in Africa that start with K.

DuckDuckGo returned a different list of countries (https://www.countries-ofthe-world.com/countries-of-africa.html) as the first link.

List of countries in Africa in alphabetical order

All 54 independent countries of Africa in alphabetical order, from Algeria to Zimbabwe. Always up-to-date and accurate information.

Show threadJan  Aug 15, 2023

@rodhilton I've just tried it myself and I am actually speechless.🤐

ChatGPT: "Being speechless is actually a symptom of..."

Show threadBruce MirkenAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton Amazingly, the bogus result is STILL at the top of #Google's results page. #AI
Show threadIan Hecht 🇨🇦Aug 15, 2023
@rodhilton Argh! My students will inevitably use the first result that pops up on Google because they assume it's authoritative. I guess I'll be teaching them all to use an alternate search engine this year...
Show threadMatt PalmerAug 16, 2023
@ianhecht @rodhilton in addition to teaching them to use an alternative search engine, could you also teach them to be skeptical information consumers in general? Check sources, investigate extraordinary claims, get multiple independent sources, etc?
Show threadAshi HelveticaAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton jesus hercules christ it’s still doing it on my end
Show threadWin 🌱Aug 15, 2023
@rodhilton same for me wtf is going on?!?
Show threadRaysOfRedAug 15, 2023
@rodhilton “benefits”
Show threadNoah CookAug 15, 2023

@rodhilton Google search has been going downhill for some time. It thinks Medicare and Medicaid are the same program, likely because there is a federal agency called the Center for Medicare and Medicaid Services, and so it sees the two names connected very often.

For some reason Google also believes that "hyper" and "hypo" are synonyms.

It has been a long time since I have been able to use Google for anything work-related. It's quicker and easier to email a colleague for a link.

Show threadEvelynAug 15, 2023

@rodhilton @accretionist Oooh!

Did you know that, while “Kenya” starts with the ‘K’ sound, it’s actually spelled with the letter ‘K’?

https://www.emergentmind.com/posts/did-you-know-that-there-is-no-country-in-africa-that#:~:text=While%20there%20are%2054%20recognized,with%20a%20%22K%22%20sound.

#TheDressIsWhiteAndGold

Did you know that there is no country in Africa that starts with the letter "k"?

A ChatGPT example about the absence of countries starting with the letter "k" in Africa.