HumanRights&Business
Forcing your computer to rat you out. ‘Zuckerberg insists that anyone who wanted to use a pseudonym online is "two-faced," engaged in dishonest social behavior. …Zuckerberg…claims that forcing people to use their own names is a way to ensure civility… From the very beginning, social scientists…told Zuckerberg that he was wrong. …a Real Names Policy affects different people differently.’ | Cory Doctorow, Pluralistic https://pluralistic.net/2023/08/02/self-incrimination/ @pluralistic
Pluralistic: Forcing your computer to rat you out (02 August 2023) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

Aug 6, 2023 at 3:06pmMetatext
Show threadOggieAug 6, 2023

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic Always with the egocentrism. 'It would stop me from saying shitty things, probably. So obviously it will stop everyone else. And I would only not want my name attached if I had something to hide, because I haven't had to face consequences for anything that I said that was legal and reasonable, so nobody else would either.'

Your life is not a model for the real world for everyone else seems like such a simple obvious fact, but it escapes some completely.

Show threadBlort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️Aug 6, 2023
@HRandbusiness
An old (mis)quote that seems to apply nicely to Zuck here:
"I do not hide my information because I doubt my intentions, but because I doubt yours."
@pluralistic
Show threadINIT_6Aug 6, 2023

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic

Slightly related, Google+ had a requirement for using your real name. I of course didn't want to, I was using 'Jason Gutentug' and they banned me, but after getting about 40-60 people to say it was my real name, they accepted it.

Point being, even if they require real names, trust me, people will always find a way to trick the system.

Show threadsilverwizardAug 6, 2023
@INIT6 @pluralistic @HRandbusiness @niqdanger told me a good story about this once
Show threadZorin =^o.o^=Aug 6, 2023

@INIT6 @HRandbusiness @pluralistic Google Plus had so much potential. I remember starting to use it immediately because it was finally a place that did what Facebook did, without the real name requirement. I like being Zorin the Lynx on the Internet. I don't want to be my real life identity there socially.

Then of course they ruined it by demanding people use "real names”, which caused near everyone to leave after their friends started getting banned. The bans were badly implemented, disabling your entire Google account instead of just Plus. Even I left myself.

They must have realize they f-ed up, because they removed the policy, but by then the damage was done, it never came back to what it was and they killed it.

Bad decisions are part of Google culture I suppose.

Show threadINIT_6Aug 6, 2023

@zorinlynx @HRandbusiness @pluralistic

You remember the thing right before G+, the Google Maps thing 'Google Latitude' where you could see people around you.

Well, that was really bad; people didn't even realize their profiles were public and allowed people with amazing accuracy to connect real-life people with their online profiles.

I was able to DoXx people in real-time and scare the shit out of them with facts like where they lived, studied in school, etc.

(I only scared people in very public areas and mainly was bar bets, bet you a drink I can guess what you're studying in school)

Real identities, with real-world locations, with unclear privacy settings, well, .... is just so bad.

Show threadThe Evil MicrowizardAug 6, 2023
@zorinlynx @INIT6 @HRandbusiness @pluralistic At least one nym-user I knew of discovered that the disabling of the Google account also broke pretty much all their Android hardware. 😫
Show threadChloé RaccoonAug 7, 2023
@zorinlynx @INIT6 @HRandbusiness @pluralistic @patterfloof I remember one sysadmin/coder saying on a.s.r about how Google tried to force her to use her real name on accounts/Google+ when she was working at Google. And how it pretty much led to lots of "who you fsck are you" conversations, as no one knew who she was suddenly. Everyone knew her as <nick> not <real name>.
Show threadJoeAug 7, 2023
@INIT6 @HRandbusiness @zorinlynx @pluralistic @patterfloof @chloeraccoon neo was real, Mr Andersen was not. It’s really that simple.
Show threadChloé RaccoonAug 7, 2023
@AproposJoe @INIT6 @HRandbusiness @zorinlynx @pluralistic @patterfloof It's slightly more scary in that that reference is roughly around the right time frame too! ;)
Show threadResunaAug 6, 2023

@INIT6 @HRandbusiness @pluralistic I am shocked. I never before heard of anyone using a credible fake name getting kicked by Google, just people with funny sounding real names. Including one actual Google employee with a mononym on their actual Google namebadge.

They killed the vanilla name policy after they did a study and found people were awful using their real names too. Seriously, Yonatan Zunger did a blog on it and everything.

Show thread7leaguebootdisk𓅽Aug 6, 2023
@INIT6 @HRandbusiness @pluralistic I photoshopped my driver's license for Facebook.
Show threadWade RobertsAug 6, 2023

@INIT6 @HRandbusiness @pluralistic I haven’t maintained a Google account, and have actively avoided their products, since the ‘Real Names’ policy was in place.

I had largely given them the benefit of the doubt to that point, but this obliterated my trust in them, and they’ve done little to nothing toward regain it since.

Show threadKevin E. WalshAug 6, 2023

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic
Facebook's removal of news posts in Canada demonstrates its ability to moderate content when it wants.

Platforms should be treated like publishers and held responsible for their content. #Facebook #Moderation

Show threadMax Lee Aug 6, 2023
@HRandbusiness Funny how for over a decade I never had my real name on Facebook... and they never bothered me about it! Not even after I paid for ads on it and they knew my name. (Yes, shame on me for doing that. But it was over half a decade ago and they only got a couple bucks out of it. I will never spent another cent on such privacy violating ads!)
Show threadJMinSDAug 6, 2023
@the_moep @HRandbusiness I've also used a pseudonym on FB for years and haven't been caught. Did this for privacy from an ex-spouse.
Show threadcatfluoride Aug 6, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic tbf, I bet that people would generally be way less toxic on the internet if they were forced to use their real names. That said, I would never use my real name to be displayed on publicly available feeds.
Show threadActionreplayAug 6, 2023
@catfluoride @HRandbusiness @pluralistic no people are equally vile using their real names. I choose to use a pseudonym on here as it allows me to be more open about sharing and swapping medical info and stories with others who suffer from the same health conditions
Show threadSolarbird Aug 7, 2023
@Actionreplay @catfluoride @HRandbusiness @pluralistic I seem to recall one fair-sized study where their results showed what actually produced the best behaviour overall was consistent pseudonyms.
Show threadGI Jack: All American ZeroAug 8, 2023

@catfluoride

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic

bullshit. look at facebook

Show threadcatfluoride Aug 8, 2023
@GI_Jack @HRandbusiness @pluralistic nah, I'm not going to look at Facebook, regardlessly.
Show threadAT-AT Assault 🏳️‍⚧️Aug 6, 2023

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic

Zuck is hardcore projecting. I've always used a screen name, and I've never behaved like a shitty fucktard.

Show threadJ.H.NoyesAug 6, 2023

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic

I dunno. The author seems somewhat disingenuous. Zuckerberg, like many billionaires, is operating from a place of contempt rather than naiveté. Only a fool would give Facebook their data in light of the attached conversation.

Show threadAmy PettyAug 6, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic And it was a transparent excuse to obscure the actual motive of data tracking. Personally I wish people would forcefully confront that fact instead of treating it as an otherwise legitimate argument to refute.
Show threadLisPiAug 6, 2023

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic South Korea & China have tested that and found that it indeed does very little against toxicity (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real-name_system#South_Korea).

China kept it for other reasons.

Real-name system - Wikipedia

Show threadhacknorrisAug 6, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic i have such nickname i can use it as real name. pfff
Show threadThe Evil MicrowizardAug 6, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic I suppose he hasn't noticed (or isn't doing anything about the fact that) it isn't working on FB. I've lost track of the number of people who are clearly not using their names as their FB handles - whether they use their first and middle, or spell it backwards, or use something that is "name-shaped" a la the nym wars. I suppose he can probably identify them pretty clearly from other big (meta-) data anyway...
Show threadThat Anonymous CowardAug 7, 2023

@HRandbusiness @pluralistic

Ah yes, my dishonest social behavior...
I helped ring the alarm bell about those lawyers at Prenda (and other firms) who were shaking people down with sketchy legal claims using the courts as part of their extortion scheme.

I'm still a nym online, and the Prenda lawyers went to prison... so exactly how dishonest am I again?

Show threadTheriacAug 7, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic

this from the man who, not so long ago, ended up paying an 8 figure sum to settle legal issues arising from hacking exploits he carried out at uni.
Chancerism Across the ages.

The philosophy of life that connects Irish Victorian parliamentarians and Facebook.

Plasma Trap~
Show threadKevin Karhan Aug 7, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic this was intentional, as #NSAbook is just the privatized #Stasi 4.0 and thus copies the #ModiOperandi and #Copaganda of the Stasi!
Show threadNika2022 🐶🎶🌐☕️Aug 7, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic Mark made me thereby NOT use his Facebook.
Insta I opened with email and password combo not facebook SSI. Oh and Threads I wont touch with a flagpole
Show threadSebAug 7, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic @KydiaMusic Once I was forced to create a personal Facebook page in order to keep my business page. I was asked for my real name but Facebook didn't accept it. "This isn't a correct name", the message read i think.
Show threadGI Jack: All American ZeroAug 8, 2023

@HRandbusiness

@pluralistic

here we are 5 years later with a big told you.

Real Name policy enables the person who faces no issues IRL harassing people to do it online as well

Show threadkitastroAug 9, 2023
@HRandbusiness
the zuck needs to touch grass. there are people i know irl that repeat the most toxic things straight to my face. so i dont for even a second believe this opinion.
@pluralistic
Show threadGI Jack: All American ZeroAug 12, 2023

@HRandbusiness

@pluralistic

If you remember 10 years ago, it was Amy Schumer and some other thin skin celebs pushing this hard with a giant smear campaign, because they got trolled/people didn't like their work

Show threadSiberCecurityAug 19, 2023
@HRandbusiness @pluralistic
"They trust me. The dumb fucks. I don't know why."
- two-faced zuck
Show threadMy name is nobodyAug 26, 2023
Suppressing the right to privacy is suppressing the right to dissend and resist and thus suppress the right of having democracy. Why is voting anonymous?