Sérgio RamosAug 3, 2023
Jeff Fortin T. (風の庭園のNekohayo)

A list of recent hostile moves by #Google's #Chrome team; handy for sharing with your entourage, to explain why they should stop using #Chromium / #GoogleChrome and use #Firefox or #Epiphany as their main #web #browser :

* The "Manifest v3" sabotage of content blocking extensions: https://www.theverge.com/2022/6/10/23131029/mozilla-ad-blocking-firefox-google-chrome-privacy-manifest-v3-web-request
* The attempted sabotage of #JPEGXL: https://www.cnet.com/tech/computing/chrome-banishes-jpeg-xl-photo-format-that-could-save-phone-space/
* #WebEnvironmentIntegrity a.k.a. #DRM for whole websites would hurt the web, #opensource browsers and OSes: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2023/07/googles-web-integrity-api-sounds-like-drm-for-the-web/

Firefox and Chrome are squaring off over ad-blocker extensions

Mozilla, the makers of the Firefox browser, has said that ad blocking at the network level will be supported in its implementation of the Manifest V3 standard, drawing a contrast with Google Chrome.

The Verge
Jul 25, 2023 at 4:26pmWeb
Show threadGen X-WingJul 26, 2023
@nekohayo Chrome and Android should be separated from Alphabet.
Show threadErik MartinoAug 3, 2023
@breadbin @nekohayo Who should pay for the development? It will probably be Microsoft then.
Show threadFahri Reza 🍉Aug 3, 2023

Something that doesn't produce their own profit doesn't sit well with capitalism.
Privatising them probably better.

@erikmartino @breadbin @nekohayo

Show threadGen X-WingAug 3, 2023

@dozymoe @nekohayo That or just new companies. Make Android into a non profit a la many other open source projects. Have all those makers pay to use it commercially. Make it an OS that’s not wrapped up in Alphabets plans.

Or make it a stand alone company that have to fend for itself.

But them using those two to hold people’s access to the internet hostage, terrible thing.

Show threadetsy  Aug 3, 2023
@breadbin @dozymoe @nekohayo this is largely unnecessary. at this point, google develops the stock pixel os but AOSP, while still technically at the mercy of Google, is largely left untouched other than the bare minimum. the project is still licensed under Apache License 2.0 allowing others to fork and change as they wish.
Show threadEnricoAug 8, 2023
@avrin @breadbin @dozymoe @nekohayo the license means nothing if they keep all phone makers hostage with other contracts. Ever wondered why no one sells AOSP phones outside of china? https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/07/googles-iron-grip-on-android-controlling-open-source-by-any-means-necessary/
Google’s iron grip on Android: Controlling open source by any means necessary

From the archives: Android is open—except for all the good parts.

Ars Technica
Show threadMatt EricksonAug 3, 2023
@breadbin @dozymoe @nekohayo
But using them to hold people's access to the internet hostage is *exactly the point*. It's like Windows with IE back in the day. Alphabet, and Google, exist to produce money for their shareholders. They'd be *not doing their jobs* if they spent effort to be nice to the internet.
Show threadLN Aug 7, 2023
@matt @breadbin @dozymoe @nekohayo All sufficiently large tech companies are or will be Microsoft.
Show threadGukkeyAug 3, 2023
@breadbin @nekohayo and you can add Google maps with that.
Show threadGoing T. MaineAug 2, 2023
@nekohayo no 1Password support on iOS, alas
Show threadjojoAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo i think firefox is a little better then chrome
Show threadDon MartiAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo Don't forget all the built-in adtech stuff (still being shipped by Google now despite W3C reaction)
https://www.theregister.com/2023/01/18/google_topics_api/
Shot down: Google's grand fancy plan for pro-privacy targeted ads

W3C's techies have a few choice words for the Chocolate Factory

The Register
Show threadGanWeavingAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo if Chrome blocks ad-blockers then I'm gone
Show threadSandraAug 3, 2023
@WeavingWithAI

The WEI proposal goes further than that. It's a way for websites to block people who are using any kind of modified browsers, including adblockers. So it'd not just be Chrome disabling adblockers but them making it so that websites will break for all non-WEI–browsers.

@nekohayo, thank you for mentioning Epiphany! Such a great browser 👍🏻
Show threadJeff Fortin T. (風の庭園のNekohayo)Aug 3, 2023

@Sandra @WeavingWithAI
Of course! #Epiphany / #GNOMEWeb is one of the very few non-Blink-engine FLOSS #browsers out there. For this reason, and since I'm a @gnome contributor, I've been helping Epiphany & @WebKitGTK with lots of bug reporting & testing in recent months, so that we don't just have "Firefox vs the world".

My performance tracker bug: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=245783

My big UX wish: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/epiphany/-/issues/1835

245783 – (GLibPerformance) [GTK] Slow performance issues tracker bug (scrolling, animations, drag & drop, input)

Show threadSeirdyAug 4, 2023

@nekohayo @Sandra @WeavingWithAI What’s the state of site isolation in WebKit2GTK? That’s the main thing holding me back.

I do like seeing JPEG-XL working in Canary.

Show threadPixel PurritoAug 4, 2023
@Seirdy @Sandra @nekohayo @WeavingWithAI these days isolation is per-origin, each site gets its own WebKitWebProcess... Almost. The main missing bit is iframe isolation, which is being worked on at the moment. It will come at some point, but right now I cannot give any ETA.
Show threadSeirdyAug 4, 2023
@aperezdc @Sandra @nekohayo @WeavingWithAI Wait, I thought sites are supposed to opt into origin-keyed clustering with COOP+COEP and/or Origin-Agent-Cluster headers, and remain keyed by site otherwise. Wouldn’t origin-keying by default break backward compatibility?
Show threadPixel PurritoAug 4, 2023

@nekohayo @Sandra @WeavingWithAI @WebKitGTK @gnome thanks for all the bug reporting and testing effort! We may not say it often but it's super appreciated, and has already helped to ship performance improvements 🤩

Of course there is still work to do, and usually the main complication is figuring out where exactly the problems are—web engines are huge and complex! 

Show threadMagical CatAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo I was so enfuriated by all these news, listed in this post that i switched for personal use to Firefox today. May be will have to use chrome/edge for testing sites i work on, especially at work, but for personal use - Firefox now on. I also subscribed to donate a bit monthly to Mozilla Foundation. Not a big donation, because I am not a someone "rich". But what I can afford monthly. Next step will be de-googling of my mailboxes I have control over.
Show threadBrendan JonesAug 3, 2023
@koteisaev @nekohayo iirc, funds donated to Mozilla Foundation aren’t (can’t be?) used for Firefox development. Best to support Firefox by using a Mozilla Corporation product, like Mozilla VPN or Relay. The corporation is a subsidiary of the foundation. I’m using both, they work great.
Show threadLuis MedinasAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo i hope Brave is able to hold on and continue to fork Chromium and provide the right functionality.
Show threadUberAvonAug 3, 2023
@NexusM @nekohayo doubt they have the pockets for engine maintenance, the Web surface area is huge
Show threadLuis MedinasAug 3, 2023
@UberAvon @nekohayo maybe they get money out of their token.
Show threadFoobarbecueAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo don't forget AMP!
Show threadArthurAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo I keep hearing the counter argument that "Safari already shipped a version of WEI and no one made a fuss" but I can't tell if that's true or just missing a lot of nuance. Can someone explain?
Show threadVictor WiebeAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo This is an interesting read. I'm pretty simple when it comes to how browsers work on the backend; any idea on how this change would effect Brave?
Show threadJeff Fortin T. (風の庭園のNekohayo)Aug 3, 2023

@wwwiebe
Brave is using Blink, Chromium/Chrome's web engine controlled by Google. So does Edge, Vivaldi, Opera, etc. They're all mostly just a UI on top of the same engine.

Other than Mozilla Firefox's "Gecko"… the other engine that powers Safari & iOS is WebKit + @WebKitGTK (for Epiphany, a.k.a. "GNOME Web", and for embedded).

Google does (some) open source "products", but they are typically not FLOSS "projects". They feel read-only, not read+write for indie community contributors.

Show threadannevanrossumAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo would love to but Firefox has such an nontransparent decision process on e.g. supporting bluetooth in the browser.
Show threadantlersAug 3, 2023

@nekohayo
https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=1178058#c84

As a fan of progressive loading and transparency, the JPEG-XL saga is a personal issue.

The only way to rebel is to USE IT ANYWAY; provide multiple image sources through <picture> tags, consider it for personal use-cases, and be a part of the wide-spread adoption that successors of JPEG have been working towards since JPEG-2000.

1178058 - chromium - An open-source project to help move the web forward. - Monorail

Show threadBJSAug 3, 2023
@nekohayo I thought Firefox was out of commission
Show threadnitrofuranoSep 1, 2023
@nekohayo wonder why there are people still using #chrome and #firefox
Show threadDirk HartmannApr 25, 2024
@nekohayo I switched to LibreWolf and Brave some time ago. Never looked back.