raintrooper7Jun 13, 2023
Christian Selig
It's a real shame that Reddit seems to care this little about the community that rather than making an effort to talk to developers and moderators and apologize for how this was handled, they'd rather just wall themselves off and and dare users to keep going. https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/13/23759559/reddit-internal-memo-api-pricing-changes-steve-huffman
Reddit CEO tells employees that subreddit blackout ‘will pass’

Reddit CEO Steve Huffman says in an internal memo that the latest protest over API changes “will pass.” He also warned employees about wearing Reddit items in public.

The Verge
Jun 13, 2023 at 7:59pmIvory for iOS
Show threadChristian SeligJun 13, 2023

No one is asking Reddit for the moon and the stars, just to listen to small changes.

Even Twitch, which made horrendous moves this month, recognized that the community is what gives their company any value at all, and responded in some capacity to make their users feel heard.

Show threadkylemsguyJun 13, 2023
@christianselig that moment when Amazon is more willing to listen to the users than Reddit.

I guess the difference is that Twitch creators can jump ship to YouTube or the like and take a lot of money with them, while the value of Reddit users is alot more abstract.
Show threadRexJun 13, 2023
@kylemsguy Are there any reddit alternatives? There's plenty of livestreaming platforms
Show threadBookkeeping101Jun 13, 2023
@rexfeng @kylemsguy fedia.io is trying to take advantage of the opportunity
Show threadcitiesJun 13, 2023
@DeepSpaceFine @rexfeng @kylemsguy is there a difference in kbin and fedia.io or is it the same content due to the "fediverse" only trying to learn
Show threadDawidJun 14, 2023
@cities @DeepSpaceFine @rexfeng @kylemsguy Fedia is instance of kbin. It's the same content as on all kbin servers. And not even only kbin, but you can interact with that content and users srraight from Mastodon due to fediverse.
Show threadCapraJun 13, 2023
@rexfeng @kylemsguy #kbin ! kbin is an open source decentralized redditish platform. https://kbin.social is the "official" instance.
kbin.social - Explore the Fediverse

Explore the Fediverse

Show threadGlumbarJun 14, 2023
@capra @rexfeng @kylemsguy Can you link your k.bin and mastadon accounts? I'm still figuring this all out -___-'
Show threadkylemsguyJun 14, 2023
@Glumbar @capra @rexfeng You can put them in your profile, but they're like different email addresses. As far as I can understand, anyways.
Show threadDarin Warling Jun 13, 2023
@rexfeng @kylemsguy Both kbin and Lemmy
Show threadTom StreeterJun 14, 2023
@warling @rexfeng @kylemsguy And in addition, it’s not an either/or choice. They’re both written to ActivityPub, so they interoperate.
Show threadgkdivaJun 14, 2023
@rexfeng @kylemsguy Can't Mastodon be the Reddit alternative?
Show threadLuke The YetiJun 14, 2023
@gkdiva @rexfeng @kylemsguy mastodon is a twitter alternative?
Show threadErick WJun 14, 2023
@gkdiva @rexfeng @kylemsguy yeah I wish it was, the layout is more twitter though right, not as nice for content in my opinion. Still looking for the replacement though.
Show threadDźwiedziuJun 14, 2023

@AlpacaKing
To be brunt, you'll probably won't find it. Twitter was a unique experience (well, still is, just the wrong(-er) way). Mastodon, and Fediverse overall, are built about different philosophies at the core.
For Twitter it is profit and you are the product. For Fedi it's being open, in multitude of ways, and having a moderation.

@gkdiva @rexfeng @kylemsguy

Show threadLuke The YetiJun 14, 2023
@AlpacaKing @gkdiva @rexfeng @kylemsguy on Reddit you subscribe to topics and see content related to the topic by users. On Twitter you subscribe to people and see variyes content based on the whims of the person. Topic vs personality.
Show threadbwazJun 14, 2023
@LukeTheYeti @AlpacaKing @gkdiva @rexfeng @kylemsguy
Explains why I hate Twiddle. Even before its Muskification.
Show threadGrant 🇺🇦ArmUkraine🇺🇦Jun 14, 2023
@gkdiva @rexfeng @kylemsguy #lemmy and #kbin are far better suited as a Reddit replacement. The improvements are coming quickly! #fediverse ftw
Show threadRune Dance TwoJun 14, 2023

@Grant_M

Have you tried either #Lemmy or #Kbin?

I so far have only an account on Lemmy but am looking to make one on Kbin too...

Show threadGrant 🇺🇦ArmUkraine🇺🇦Jun 14, 2023
@runedancetwo Just Lemmy so far!
Show threadBiggestBulb 💡🏳️‍🌈🧑‍💻Jun 14, 2023
@runedancetwo @Grant_M I've been using #kbin for the past few days and I enjoy it so far. Good times with some good people!
Show threadKevin RussellJun 15, 2023

@gkdiva @rexfeng @kylemsguy

I think about 100,000 redittors have joined mastodon fediverse etc al. As of yesterday morning.

Show threadbappityJun 14, 2023
@rexfeng @kylemsguy Lemmy or kbin 👀
Show threadrastilinJun 14, 2023

@rexfeng @kylemsguy

I think kbin.social is the current best choice for an alterantive. It has a compact mode that works exactly like old Reddit and is federated.

Show threadAlexander The 1stJun 14, 2023

@rexfeng @kylemsguy At the risk of sounding really out of date, my immediate thought was InvisionFree boards...though from what I can tell, they went through a Geocities-like migration to another forums platform?

Either way, while it might not be an 100% great replacement, I'm pretty sure free forum hosting/software still exists that could be spun up to take on at least individual Reddit communities. Migration might be difficult, but...

Show threadmaltheftJun 15, 2023
@rexfeng
Try Lemmy. A lot of activity lately and a great platform. Couldn't recommend enough.
@kylemsguy
Show threadmaltheftJun 15, 2023

@rexfeng

@kylemsguy

Show threadkylemsguyJun 15, 2023
@maltheft @rexfeng I use kbin at the moment. It’s alright
Show threadmonokaiJun 13, 2023
@christianselig I’ve never seen a CEO of a community-based business so delusional on what their success is built on. We’ll continue to fight.
Show threadBonkersJun 13, 2023
@monokai @christianselig does it even make sense to fight? #reddit is a platform run by a private business, and the business decided to alienate themselves with the most active part of the community. There's no way back, and the most passionate moderators will just shut the doors and leave.
Show threadDenverComicGuyJun 13, 2023
@bonkers @monokai @christianselig Yeah, we all had a good ride on Reddit while VCs were subsidizing it, now they’re going to monetize it (and make it a less interesting and less dynamic platform). Time to delete accounts, move on and find something new. Everything fades, Reddit included.
Show threadBonkersJun 13, 2023
@DenverComicGuy @monokai @christianselig well it has to be sustainable, so it has to earn money. But there are ways to do it together with the community without destroying it.
Show threadDenverComicGuyJun 13, 2023

@bonkers @monokai @christianselig and building a sustainable positive community will have to be done off Reddit. The major platforms have lived too long on VC money, the owners need a return and it will come at the expense of the users.

FYI this convo is happening on an open source non profit platform, so not every platform needs to make a profit (but I agree, they do need some form of sustainable funding model(

Show threadBonkersJun 13, 2023

@DenverComicGuy @monokai @christianselig

Just as we speak, home.socal is closing down for undisclosed reasons, but I suspect it's because of financial burden and tons of unpaid work.

Show threadBonkersJun 13, 2023

@DenverComicGuy @monokai @christianselig

My point is, #reddit had a good chance to stay alive and sustainable, which means profitable, if the CEO actually cared about people.

Show threadBluewall Jun 14, 2023
@monokai @christianselig I mean, Elon ? lol
Show threadEshu MarneediJun 13, 2023
@christianselig For once, Twitch did something moderately commendable. Spez is a POS and I wouldn’t expect anything like that from him.
Show threadashJun 13, 2023

@christianselig Twitch knew everyone would leave and meant it. Now they are attacking their own Mods, and App developers. Let’s not forget Spez thinking you are stupid by saying you blackmailed them, and then doubling down. If he had any accountability, his ass would be fired for that.

Thank you for always being honest and transparent on these issues. Long time beta user here who is deleting my account and no longer using reddit. Fuck that company and Spez for that BS.

Show threadBee • New Move!Jun 13, 2023
@christianselig Imagine being shown up on community communication by Twitch.tv, well-known for absolutely ramfucking creators on its site
Show threadsanguishJun 13, 2023
@christianselig I’m really impressed with how your community has rallied to you. You work clearly has made a big difference.
Show threadHernanLGJun 13, 2023
@sanguish @christianselig I think this goes beyond Apolo. There are lots of 3rd party apps in the same situation. But the huge user base of Apolo certainly helped move a critical mass in this 'protest'
Show threadBeef BinglyJun 14, 2023
@sanguish @christianselig Honestly, Apollo was the only reason I stayed on Reddit as long as I did. I would have left long ago, otherwise. I know I'm not alone in that.
Show threadJason CoxJun 13, 2023
@christianselig I love that Apollo doesn't have ads, but during all of you chats with Reddit, did they ever suggest that the API could stay free if third party apps served inline ads to non-Premium members? Just curious!
Show threadTyler MartinJun 13, 2023

@christianselig It's all about the money. Why change if they think they'll make more on the current course?

So poorly handled on all fronts and clearly motivated by greed. All well. Onto the Fediverse.

Show threadAxelShooterJun 13, 2023
@Gur814 @christianselig It's not even about money. If they just wanted to earn money negotiating with third party developers for a solution that serves ads and/or has a reasonable pricing would lock in a steady income from each third party app user. It's about control and locking down users to their client because they think that their value is in the user data, and not in their API.
Show threadTyler MartinJun 13, 2023

@axelshooter63 Right. Which they believe will make them more money compared to fairly monetizing 3rd party apps.

Locking down and controlling user data = more money in Reddit's eyes.

Show threadMorgan le Fay/MerlinJun 13, 2023
@christianselig preach
Show threadEvanJun 13, 2023

@christianselig Thanks for fighting the good fight. Apollo was/is my most used app and I’ll be very sad to have to retire it.

I won’t be using their client.

Show threadKathy E. Gill 🇺🇦Jun 14, 2023

@christianselig
Reddit is part of the entertainment conglomerate, Condé Nast, which is turn owned by Advance Communications ($2.4B revenue in 2022).

(I’ve never understood the 2006 purchase.)

It’s still operated by the founders (2005), which is amazing. Who knows what pressures corporate are exerting?

EDIT: I did know about the IPO. 🤦🏼‍♀️

Show threadyasharmaJun 14, 2023
@christianselig I’m gonna say the same thing as most replies here but Reddit knows outrage is short lived and people need social media. Unless FB builds a Reddit clone.
Show threadStrypeyJun 14, 2023

@yasharma
> Reddit knows outrage is short lived and people need social media. Unless FB builds a Reddit clone

A lot of subReddit communities are not just outraged, they've moved. Many of them to fediverse servers running forum apps like Lemmy and KBin. Probably for good, because unlike with Titter, when you move as a *community*, there's much less temptation to drift back.

@christianselig

Show threadStrypeyJun 14, 2023

@yasharma
Discourse is also rolling out ActivityPub support, which will give them a more mature forum UI connected to the fediverse. I believe Flarum is working on AP support too.

https://discuss.flarum.org/d/17748-federated-flarum-activitypub

@christianselig

Federated flarum / activitypub - Flarum Community

Get support using and extending Flarum, the next-generation forum software that makes online discussion fun.

Show threadRussell_Senpai 🎮Jun 14, 2023

@christianselig They listened because it's well-known they have serious competition and they couldn't ensure they'd be profitable going with this long term.

I imagine everything YouTube's been doing recently, even as of today may have gotten out to someone over at Amazon ahead of time, and going ahead with that would've been bad biz.

Show threadManitcorJun 14, 2023

@christianselig that may be the case for some but for a growing number its already a bridge too far.

twitter at least has a purpose as a marketing platform, reddit is little more than a overcentralized phpbb instance.

to the fediverse!

Show threadTore JuløJun 14, 2023
@christianselig even if they do give a little, don't you think the damage is done?
That trust is not easily regained and I'd expect reddit client devs to quietly start working on Lemmy or Kbin apps on the side no matter what.
Show threadLeifJun 14, 2023
@christianselig twitch has youtube and other platforms as decent counterweights. We need a reddit competitor to really make them cave at all. reddit fills a niche that no one else does unfortunately.
Show threadJoeJun 14, 2023
@christianselig really sad to see Reddit treating their community so badly. I’ve been a Reddit user for over 10 years, but will not be returning to the site after this low quality sequence of events.
Show thread_frostJun 14, 2023
@christianselig What are the small changes? I have sympathy for the third party apps, but I also think it's fair for reddit to charge at least something for their API use. Free seems unsustainable. What would you consider a middle ground between the two parties?
Show threadmysleepingkarmaJun 14, 2023
@christianselig I really don‘t understand what‘s going on in the mind of the reddit CEO. As a longtime Apollo Ultra user I followed the whole story all along. It is really sad, that you were forced to pull the plug but doing business with childish partners (reddit) is not possible. Thank you for this wonderful app, I used it daily. I cancelled my reddit pro subscription and will now explore the fediverse (Lemmy).