Mastodawn

I've edited the question - I supposed there's no point in being spoily since I'll probably hit publish within the hour, but understand that more than anything I need people to click on the video and not just for selfish reasons - my ultimate goal is for this to lead to somebody hopefully writing a regulation, and I need maximum awareness for that to occur.

OK, I've settled on electric. Linky-dink incoming!

Well, it worked...

Tobias May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Neat!

Dylan May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I think this was a good choice, I know that electric cars being the target for that AM radio bill as well even though it applies to gas vehicles too

Michael D'Costa May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Thanks for a very informative if disturbing video; I need to check if it applies to my e-Kona (prob yes). I plan to send this to my local MPP & Minister of Transportation to help push regulatory change.
(You may want to create a short from it for more impact.)

⦺ irick 🐁🐈⚩May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify
Interesting, good choice. Also, Woah. That is a scary behavior D: Thank you so much for shining a light on this.

Mike J👹🐀 🤘🏻May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I was a little surprised you didn't mention what they do in F1. The "brake lights" come on any time the car is harvesting energy, even with no brake pressure.

This is an issue professional drivers have had for a decade, and they addressed it right away. They always say racing is how they bring new tech to road cars. Seems like this is one place they should do it.

I do prefer your simpler "if the car is slowing above X rate."

Alex 🔧🔮🌎🪿

May 25, 2023

@mikej
This has been a problem for decades with manual cars. Engine braking in a low gear can easily do >0.2g.
@TechConnectify

John Carney May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify it was a great video!

https://youtu.be/876ZKoorQDQ

Brikloss May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify

Found in my 2022 Ioniq 5 Software version NEEV.USA.S5W_M.V009.001.230203 that the brake lights worked fine in ipedal when just letting off @ 30mph. Here's the video of my testing.

You may have an issue with your specific i5, feel free to DM me and we can see if we can figure out what's going on with your particular car.

Refuting @TechnologyConnections Ioniq 5 Brake Light Test

YouTube

@Brikloss if you entirely release the pedal, yes the brake lights come on. I never said they never work, but you haven't shown your footwork here and that sure looks like a rapid stop

SebasFC May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I would love to cite your name on LinkedIn.

Great video!

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/sebastianfleischhacker_electric-cars-prove-we-need-to-rethink-brake-activity-7067732336066338816-M4Ie

SebasFC May 26, 2023

@TechConnectify Here are another 2000 Potential Views For your video:

Sebastian Fleischhacker on LinkedIn: Electric cars prove we need to rethink brake lights

Hybrids and #electricvehicles have been around for a while, which could have sent hints about #regenerativebraking (as in a red light indicating you are…

Blake Helms

May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify this is a really important video. I had no idea that the brake light issue existed with single pedal driving.

NHTSA needs to fix the regulations immediately if not sooner!

Jesse Brown May 26, 2023

@TechConnectify When I watched it the status showed #9 on trending. Nice work and another good video!

skipnyip May 28, 2023

@TechConnectify

Hmm, what an oddly specific article has appeared online.
https://www.slashgear.com/1298537/hyundai-ioniq-5-brake-flaw/

The Hyundai Ioniq 5 Needs To Rethink Its Brake Lights Before It Causes An Accident - SlashGear

The Hyundai Ioniq 5 has been found to have a glaring flaw -- its brake lights don't always turn on under regenerative braking.

SlashGear

don'tbe,evil May 30, 2023

@TechConnectify I agree completely with your take. Idgaf HOW you’re slowing down. Brake lights should go on!

I’ll manually tap the brake pedal to illuminate the lights if I’m engine braking (manual car) and the people way behind clearly don’t notice, especially in heavy traffic. But that’s not a thing the average driver should have to/will think about.

Winston R. Milling May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Hitting us with #Truth in the fist two minutes: "One man's software is another man's nightmare."

Alex Hall May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify My first guess is touch-based infotainment/climate control systems.

King Naga Calyo Lucere-Delphi May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify If it's something that affects new cars in general I don't think it matters that it is particularly problematic with electric cars or that you pontificate profusely about the problem with electric cars being the primary example you present.

Marco Arment May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I'd go "Electric" because (a) it will definitely get more clicks/impressions/reach, and (b) I don't think it's misleading or unfair since the topic in question is MUCH more of an issue on (some) electric cars.

MrAptronym May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify in terms of clickability I think electric cars are a hotter topic than new cars.

I don't know anything about making videos though, just what I see on my youtube dashboard, and what is most interesting to me.

noah May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify as much as I wanted to select “New”, I think that “Electric” will result in more clicks.

iaian7 May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I wish you luck!

The cynic in me voted “electric” because “modern” or “new” do not seem to have the same cultural punch.

Veritasium has a video or two about title+thumbnail strategies and metrics. IIRC the combination of accurate but provocative title combined with a thumbnail that gave the answer was pretty effective. But that’s not great for accessibility (thumbnails aren’t screen reader compatible), and maybe I remember incorrectly. 😕

Bornach May 25, 2023

@iaian7 @TechConnectify
That plus constantly swapping out thumbnail and clickbait title several times over the first week of the video's release.

Or even doing that years later seems to work, at least that's what CGP Grey has discovered when he did that to his old AI videos

Michael Graham May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I personally would be more likely to click on "Electric cars prove..." regardless of the strict accuracy of the title

Rob Bos May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify
I honestly get my hackles up a bit when there are headlines that blame EVs for a problem that all cars have. It smells like ICE industry propaganda trying to put additional and unwarranted FUD on electric vehicles.

Lexi of the Night May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify modern?

Frigid Crystal Tormented Wrath May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Stick with the hot take it -will- make people mad but it -will- help the video I'm sure.

hybrid havoc May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Is the primary angle in the script about electric cars? Or at least the opening?

The way I look at it, if a title is better for clicks and also may still be representative of the content of the video, then go for it.

@hybridhavoc The discussion is certainly mostly around a thing electric cars do.

Lucas May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I choose “New” because one of your strengths is your use of precise language even if it’s less specific. Regardless, I’ll metric the hell out of it.

@TechConnectify if it's about destroying physical controls, you can blame Tesla ... That's pretty rage-clicky

I dislike blaming EVs for things not even specific in general: idiots will actually do things that will slow down adoption/etc. But the no-physical-controls thing is clearly Tesla's fault for starting, and they deserve to be called out for it.

@TechConnectify Now that I've watched it ... Your clickbait title might be

"The one thing Tesla (might) have gotten right!". Worth A/B testing that?

@TechConnectify (I'm also required to point out that the accelerometer the Bolt uses isn't extra or added just for this. ABS requires accelerometers in each wheel for normal function, so you car already has 4. Using them for the brake-lights then becomes "just software", and has no per-unit costs)

@kilpatds Do you know that for a fact? It seems somewhat questionable to me to allow a body control module to talk to the ABS module like that

@TechConnectify I am not a citable source, no. Lemme see if I can find you one.

@TechConnectify but for evidence of the connection: your car throws codes when they fail, so they're obviously connected.

See also "unlock&start your car via the headlight" discourse for a general sense of the isolation of car components from each other (none)

@kilpatds Yes, I'm aware they're connected - every module is over the CAN bus. But usually they're limited in what they can say to each other for security and network reasons. While sharing actual sensor data between modules isn't impossible, it doesn't pass my sniff test.

Also... doesn't ABS use wheel-speed sensors?

@TechConnectify Yes?

Which you turn into a deceleration (accelerometer) and compare against possible deceleration/expected deceleration to detect a wheel lockup event.

(I checked, I've lost my contact with the Bolt-tied engineer I knew, so I can't get you proof)

@kilpatds Oh - see, by my standards that would count as you "knowing for a fact"

(also, quite honestly I've never head anyone refer to wheel speed sensors as accelerometers)

@TechConnectify they measure wheel speed rapidly, turn that wheel speed into wheel acceleration, and then figure out if that number's "bad". So they don't measure acceleration directly, no. But they measure (wheel) acceleration as a core element of their function.

Also, I never talked to said Bolt engineer on this topic directly, so by my standards I still don't "know for a fact". :)

@kilpatds No, right, understand that I get the theory of ABS 100% - but truthfully I've never heard it described as detecting differences in wheel acceleration. I mean, yes that's literally what's happening but I've always had it in my inner-monologue that the computer is just looking for improbable mismatches in rotational speed.

bhtooefr May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify @kilpatds It *can* be done with just wheel speed sensors, if you have a lookup table for how quickly a wheel can decelerate without being locked, but a lot of systems also use accelerometers to detect when a wheel is spinning too slowly relative to the vehicle speed, to better modulate it

also some systems specifically use braking G forces to automatically enable hazard flashers under panic braking, and in some cases even (non-destructively) tension seatbelts

bhtooefr May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify @kilpatds oh, and AFAIK, two-wheeler ABS systems (off-topic, but they exist, and are mandated for a lot of motorcycles in Europe, and even exist on bicycles now) basically need accelerometers because with only two wheels that aren't connected by differentials, it's a lot harder to trust that *either* wheel speed is accurate for the vehicle speed (lock both wheels and you'll have a very fast crash, and it can't detect that scenario well without an accelerometer)

@bhtooefr @TechConnectify Right. His concern is "does that information get to the computer that controls the brake light?" (and also: yes. Because that's usually the ECU, and the ECU also needs wheel acceleration info for traction control)

bhtooefr May 25, 2023

@kilpatds @TechConnectify On modern designs it's a "body control module" that controls things like lighting and locks (with potentially more CAN bus from there to individual light fixtures), not the engine control unit that handles traction control

Leon Cowle May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify In the horrible game that you have to play on YouTube with titles and thumbnail images (sadly), I would guess “electric cars” will get more clicks?

H. A. Kirsch May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I'm ass/u/me-ing that this is about brake lights and 'when you aren't pressing the accelerator’?

João Tiago Rebelo May 25, 2023

@hakirsch @TechConnectify came here to say the same thing. I'm sick and tired of people complaining about "look at that driver, always with their foot on the brake pedal, they don't know how to drive" (forgetting the driver might be on an automatic and only the brake pedal brakes the car) and then comes a newer car with one pedal driving and they go "where did that brake check came from" because they couldn't see the car was slowing down with its motor/regen and not showing any brake lights on.

João Pinheiro May 25, 2023

@jt_rebelo @hakirsch @TechConnectify

May I add something I love? People that love braking and only afterwards and very calmly use the turn signal! Oh God, how I really love them!

@joao @jt_rebelo @hakirsch I dislike this very much, too, however - when you have the combined stop/turn signal lights we do here, it's arguable less ambiguous to brake first, then pop on the turn signal.

Which is yet another reason we should abolish that setup, but I figure it's worth pointing out

João Tiago Rebelo May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify completely right and I think I'll try and find out if any newer cars people around me have with this problem, actively. The "GM could figure it out in 2016" should be shameful enough for everyone else to fix it.
@joao @hakirsch

João Tiago Rebelo May 25, 2023

@joao
That's called (by me and many people who got it from me) "the my turn signal equals a stop sign people" (assuming that when you turn the turn signal on everyone must give way to you), but reversed.
@TechConnectify @hakirsch

Simon Hewison May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify it depends what you're trying to prove. If it's unique to electric cars, then use 'Electric'.
Technically, an ICE car could be configured to behave as if it had one-pedal driving, though without regen, there's nowhere for the energy to go other than as heat and noise.

Jason Petersen (he)May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify is what they prove desirable or not?

MJ May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify best to go with "But, sometimes, it's latent heat!" for maximum effect on all future videos -- and add a purple monkey dishwasher for good measure. Seriously, though, I think "electric" would be the best word to use, as has been reasoned already by other replies.

Stephanie Reed ♠️May 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I hate reading articles that needlessly dunk on electric cars, but I still voted for electric because I know my next car will be electric so I am not interested in reading about any other kind of car.