Zhi ZhuDec 10, 2022

"Once you're willing to debate whether one group of people or another should be abused, then abusing and expelling people from society is something that is up for debate."
~@JuliusGoat

Really good thread about being "reasonable" when discussing intolerance from A. R. Moxon.

Read the whole thing:
https://mstdn.social/@JuliusGoat@mastodon.social/109486257175259797

Reminds me of the "Paradox of Tolerance" essay.

#Racism #Sexism #Bigotry
#LGBT #Homophobia

A.R. Moxon, Verified Duck 🦆 (@[email protected])

Imagine you have a friend. Let’s call him Rick Reasonable. Now imagine you have an enemy. Let’s call your enemy Bart B. Oilingwater. Bart is a real piece of crap. Here's what he does: Whenever he sees you, he throws boiling water at you. Usually you dodge it, but every once in a while, he catches you with a bit. You have to constantly be on the lookout for Bart, because if you let your guard down, it’s scalding water time!

Mastodon
Show threadZhi ZhuDec 10, 2022

The Paradox of Tolerance

Unlimited tolerance must lead to the disappearance of tolerance. If we extend unlimited tolerance even to those who are intolerant, if we are not prepared to defend a tolerant society against the onslaught of the intolerant, then the tolerant will be destroyed, and tolerance with them.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

#Paradox #Philosophy
#Politics #WWII

Paradox of tolerance - Wikipedia

Show threadZhi ZhuDec 10, 2022
Comic strip based on Karl Popper's "The Paradox of Tolerance"
Show threadpgcdDec 10, 2022
@ZhiZhu the best answer to that is (I paraphrase because I don't remember the exact wording): "Tolerance is not a moral stance, it's a contract. If one of the parts doesn't abide by the contract, they're not covered by it".
Show threadVentura JakeDec 10, 2022

@pgcd @ZhiZhu this view of tolerance as a contract needs to be promoted far and wide. It's a soundbite sized idea for a soundbite world.

#tolerancecontract #tolerance #paradoxoftolerance

Show threadpgcdDec 10, 2022
@VenturaJake @ZhiZhu I'm sorry I don't recall where I saw it so I can't offer proper attribution, but I wholly agree. It's just a sensible and understandable way of putting.
Show threadZhi Zhu

@pgcd @VenturaJake

I think I found the source.

"Tolerance is not a moral absolute; it is a peace treaty. Tolerance is a social norm because it allows different people to live side-by-side without being at each other’s throats...

But the model of a peace treaty differs from the model of a moral precept in one simple way: the protection of a peace treaty only extends to those willing to abide by its terms."
~Yonatan Zunger
https://extranewsfeed.com/tolerance-is-not-a-moral-precept-1af7007d6376

#Tolerance #Intolerance #Morality #Society

Tolerance is not a moral precept - Extra Newsfeed

The title of this essay should disturb you. We have been brought up to believe that tolerating other people is one of the things you do if you’re a nice person — whether we learned this in…

Extra Newsfeed
Dec 12, 2022 at 2:19pmWeb
Show threadpgcdDec 12, 2022
@ZhiZhu @VenturaJake that's it, thank you. Mine was clearly a dumbed down version =)
Show threadZhi ZhuDec 12, 2022

@pgcd @VenturaJake

NOT dumbed down, just differently worded. Probably because contracts seem more relevant to your everyday life than peace treaties.

I'm going to make a meme of this idea (using the quote from the article). But I wouldn't have found the article without the inspiration of your post. Thank you! 🙂

Show threadpgcdDec 12, 2022
@ZhiZhu @VenturaJake following this space for news!
Show threadZhi ZhuDec 12, 2022

@pgcd @VenturaJake

An Answer to the Paradox of Tolerance

"Tolerance is not a moral absolute; it is a peace treaty.
...
[And] the model of a peace treaty differs from the model of a moral precept in one simple way:
the protection of a peace treaty only extends to those willing to abide by its terms.

It is an agreement to live in peace, not an agreement to be peaceful no matter the conduct of others."

~Yonatan Zunger
https://extranewsfeed.com/tolerance-is-not-a-moral-precept-1af7007d6376

#Tolerance #Intolerance #Morality #Society

Tolerance is not a moral precept - Extra Newsfeed

The title of this essay should disturb you. We have been brought up to believe that tolerating other people is one of the things you do if you’re a nice person — whether we learned this in…

Extra Newsfeed
Show threadVentura JakeDec 12, 2022
@pgcd not at all. You remembered the spirit of it, which imo is the key.
@ZhiZhu great work hunting this all down!