Mastodawn

Trisha Clay (she/her)Mar 9

Every day I’m more convinced that the Fediverse’s slow mainstream adoption isn’t really about usability.

People say it’s because it’s hard to join, the terms are confusing, or the apps aren’t polished enough. Maybe a little. But honestly… look at the platforms people already use.

Finding anything on LinkedIn is painful.
Trying to locate the original video on TikTok is a scavenger hunt.
Facebook is still full of weird bugs and odd UI choices.
Instagram hides posts behind algorithms.
Twitter/X constantly changes the rules of engagement.

None of these platforms are exactly “easy.”

People stay because their friends are there. Because the big creators are there. Because that’s where the conversation already lives.

And, if we’re honest, because these platforms are engineered around a very effective reward loop: notifications, likes, infinite scroll. A dopamine machine. You learn the confusing terms and awkward interfaces because there’s a constant reward for doing so.

So yes, making the Fediverse easier to join absolutely helps.

But what would help even more is something simpler:
more mainstream, recognizable, official accounts showing up here.

That’s how networks grow.
People follow people not platforms.

#Fediverse #ActivityPub #Mastodon

Ewen Bell 📸Mar 9

What if it didn't matter if the Fediverse grows slowly instead of quickly? What if that was better?

I would like to see more of my friends here, for sure. A handful of them anyway. The famous people, with the loud voices, not so much. The longer they stay away the longer I can enjoy the lady in Sweden whittling spoons from a piece of birch.

And I definitely don't want this little corner of the internet to turn into a dopamine factory. That's why I'm happy here, and not over there.

Manc AvGeek Mar 9

@ewen @mapache I completely agree.
This place is a refuge for me, my mental health is much improved since leaving the commercial data silos.
I remember the brief period when some of the most prominent Left-leaning British political activists (People like Femi, SuperTanski, SteveBray, etc) came over here, and expected everyone to love them the way they did on Twitter.
But they refused to engage, with their fiollowers, only with those they deemed worthy (each other), then flounced out declaring it was dead and went back to Twitter, where they carried on complaining about, erm, Twitter.
I've heard anecdotal stories about US activist-celebrities doing the same thing, which always leads me to doubt their credibility - are they doing this because they believe in their declared activism, or because they are building a brand?
Hint - it's the brand, it's always the brand.
Whereas here, it's always the connections and interactions, as well as the cat/dog/Moopsy pics, the almost indecipherable memes, the hashtagHashtagGames, and the community building.
The longest-running attempt to build a Twitter-style brand I've seen here is George Takei, which most people seem to ignore, and with good reaso - his team mostly post links to articles which are little more than a bit of text and a seemingly endless array of Twitter posts they have ifted.
Yeah, I don't need or want the big names here.

The Drop Bear 2.0

Looking for explanations…Mar 10

It always takes a while for newbies to settle in, learn the ropes, and deal with their withdrawal symptoms. And if they somewhat inadvertently step on someone’s toes in the meantime or have an unpleasant experience for other reasons, they might leave before they have a chance to see how good it is.

Others simply don’t see that what’s “missing” here is the dopamine hits.

Ewen Bell 📸Mar 10

@Susan60 @mapache

Yeah that's a good point. A few bad interactions can really taint your initial feelings towards the Fediverse.

Let alone the lack of dopamine.

It took a while for me to get my feed right. I ended up unfollowing people I really like in a general sense because too much of their posts were click-bait, or too negative.

It just took me a while to work out what was making my day better, and what wasn't. Which is kind of a big deal really. That's no small thing to be sufficiently aware of what is good for you. Twitter back in the day was making me unwell, but I still clung to it. I didn't want to let go of the connection/outrage/dopamine whatever. Then "you know who" bought it and I just walked away because that was too much for me. So I was lucky.

But it wasn't until after I walked away that I really came to terms with how toxic that space was. And each time I saw glimpses of that toxicity here, I had to make effort to block/mute/unfollow to preserve my safe space.

I just think there's a lot of people complaining that the Fediverse isn't what they want it to be. But in truth, most of us get to make it into whatever we want, and that takes effort and time.

Unless dopamine is what you want, in which case I cannot help you :)

Ewen Bell 📸Mar 10

@Susan60 @mapache

A lot of folks want the fediverse to magically present the ideal social media experience right out of the box. Those are often the people who are easily swayed by an algorithm that presses a few reptilian buttons.

I just figure they're not ready for the Fediverse. And that really is OK. They can join when they feel the time is right for them.

Looking for explanations…Mar 10

That’s pretty much me! I try to be a little generous & patient with newbies, and it’s possible to enjoy chatting with people but get tired of their boosts etc. (I probably fall into that category with a lot of people!)

I also find that it helps to maintain a list of favourites/safe follows, and that’s where I spend most of my time. But sometimes I’m slack about moving accounts onto or off that list.

Maho 🦝🍻Mar 10

@Susan60 @ewen I have a "dopamine" list of people I enjoy reading.

Looking for explanations…Mar 11

😁

Yes, a “feel good” list is a good idea. Not false positivity stuff, with pasted on smiles, but genuinely nice stuff, or silly fun stuff.

Problem is that most of us can vary greatly, as we should if we’re being a reasonably authentic version of ourselves.

@ewen @mapache 💯 agree!

Phosphenes Mar 12

Linux and open source grew very slowly at first, and now they're everywhere.

The Fediverse doesn't have a marketing department or VC funding either, so it doesn't scale fast. But over time it can scale *big* because it can't go bankrupt or get bought out and shut down. Like open source, it keeps evolving beyond its failures.

@[email protected] said:

Finding anything on LinkedIn is painful.
Trying to locate the original video on TikTok is a scavenger hunt.
Facebook is still full of weird bugs and odd UI choices.
Instagram hides posts behind algorithms.
Twitter/X constantly changes the rules of engagement.

Is this the case because the sites were built from the ground-up to be poor, or was it a result of enshittification after-the-fact?

The assumption still holds true that sites become popular because they serve a need... they do something well enough that users go to it for lack of a better option.

I think the limiting factor toward mainstream adoption is not merely that ActivityPub implementations are better than alternatives, but they are not 10x better than alternatives. Usability fixes are one aspect, we need to keep outpacing the competition.

⁂ ActivityPub.Space

⁂ ActivityPub.Space

Frank 🍁⚜️Mar 9

@mapache That's true.

Even me, deleting my 'mainstream' social media took a lot of effort, mentally speaking.

It's a big decision.

It's like leaving a party alone while everybody is still having fun.

@frank @mapache It helps to remember that virtually everybody's fun is shooting up dopamine while shouting at each other.

Maho 🦝🍻Mar 9

@menos @frank I hate that.

Looking for explanations…Mar 10

@frank @mapache

Or while you think they might’ve started having fun, just after you left. It’s the dopamine, or the possibility of it, that we miss. But once we kick the habit…

Frank 🍁⚜️Mar 10

@Susan60 @mapache

Yeah, usually, when I made my mind and delete the account,

I don't really think about it again.

It's done and I move on

@mapache see also, the "But I don't know how to use linux!!" from people who have NO GODDAMNED IDEA how to use... windows.

The real question is, do we really want that type of growth, motivated by personality cults? It brought nothing but toxicity to past DTBO socmedia platforms.

Food for thought.

Maho 🦝🍻Mar 9

@faraiwe I agree, I don't want personality cults here, but I wish I could reach out to more of my real-life friends here, tbh, even if just photos of people I care. And people follow people.

@mapache have you invited them?

I get it, most see CHOOSING a server is a daunting high peak to overcome, but a nudge and suggestion to prod them over that life-altering (...) decision will land them at the common "enter a login and a password here" part of the process.

FWIW, AYBABTU, etc, What I has been happening is, most folks are burnt out from DTBO socmedia platforms, and consider fediverse to be Yet Another.

Curiously, the same people ends up at blewski. Because cult of personality.

Maho 🦝🍻Mar 9

@faraiwe exactly! We need to start inviting more people here. @stefan created a nice tool for it: https://invite.jointhefediverse.net/?server=hachyderm.io&apps=1,2,3,5

and also we can have a "Invite one person to the fediverse" day?

A day where everyone at the fediverse go and reach a friend, family, stranger, coworker, partner, mistress, neighbor, rival, coffee buddy, artist, business partner, etc... and invites them/onboard-them to any of the #fediverse apps.

HashRaydamon Mar 9

@mapache my own hot take is that the slow adoption is because there is a weird anti social streak going on here, a significant amount of the starter user base despised the preexisting social networks so they avoid engaging other user which is great to avoid the noise and the rage but not so much if you make things and hope to build a community

1/2

HashRaydamon Mar 9

@mapache For example If you are a webcomic artist, come here, get a few hundreds of followers but they can't be bother to even press the like button you probably are not going to stay very long

2/2

Maho 🦝🍻Mar 9

@hashraydamon I have been inviting a friend who does webcomics, who hates AI, is tired of facebook/instagram/etc... to join pixelfed, and he has just refused and keeps complaining in ... facebook.

HashRaydamon Mar 9

@mapache pixelfed is a little more active (is user base came from Instagram) If you pick the right server

@mapache the obvious elephant in the room: massive marketing.

Maho 🦝🍻Mar 9

@claudius I know, I have think about it, but that means probably dirty money. Or regulations.

Claudius Mar 10

@mapache I mean this in more ways than one. My favorite thing to point out is early 2010s iPhone ads. They used their 20 seconds to explain one detail about the iPhone UI each. One clip about the home button. One about voicemail etc.

While pointing out "how easy it is" they actually explained the steps that were not much more easy or hard to millions of people. Who then got their phones and were convinced these devices were easy to use (because they already learned most things from the ads).

Claudius Mar 10

@mapache here's a big collection. Not every single one falls into this category, of course. But MOST will show some aspect of how it's used with a big closeup of the screen.

They showed what to use stuff for, why they should care and then how to actually do it. All packed into a couple of seconds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlFfqVJ7trc

Every iPhone Ad (2007-2017) 2G - 7 Plus

YouTube

Emo Vulcan Mar 9

@mapache all it takes is a viral moment.

Tom Bortels Mar 10

"Mainstream adoption" is a very poor metric for success. Indeed - it feels it may be an anti-metric - the more mainstream mastodon gets, the less it is a refuge from that very mainstream.

User satisfaction is a much better metric. Lack of aggressive corporate presence. Fewer assholes and nazis and "influencers"- we left them behind for a reason.

Growth pursued for its own sake is the very thing that poisoned the other platforms. Let's not make the same mistake.

If your feed has interesting posts from good people and is *already* more than you can easily read in a day - it ain't broke, don't fix it. And if you don't have enough to read, ask around. We're happy to show you good folks to follow who are already here, and have been for a while now. There is already far more good content than anyone can consume with just a bit of self-curation - no need for more "mainstream", thank you anyway.

@tbortels @mapache I agree with you 100%. My feed is interesting, rarely leaves me with negative feelings (liberal use of temporary muting, or when necessary, blocking is a wonderful thing), and some days is so active I don’t even have the time to read everything on it! It took time and effort to get to this point, but it’s been totally worth it. Like most things, you get more out of it when you invest some time in to it.

Tom Bortels Mar 10

@mapache @guinnessduck

A really important lesson I accepted only recently is: you don't have to read it all. There is no prize for finishing your feed, and there is no penalty for being "full" and stopping. And there isn't really any advantage to having more than you need. It isn't wasted if you somehow miss something - if it's good, it'll come around again.

datenwolf Mar 10

@mapache yes @pluralistic recently wrote an essay about this very problem.

@mapache Completely agree with you. Bridging from other platforms is also extremely valuable because of this. I wish it wasn’t so complex for users to understand and set up.