Mastodawn

Peter Gfader Feb 2

As we guessed, it seems that despite Google saying they were not making recordings of people's voices and mining them for advertisers, they were doing exactly that.

If it was a colleague caught wiretapping the workplace, we'd have them sacked and never speak to nor trust them again. In the case of Google, it's even more personal.

No Google service is free. We are the terrain they extract from. We always pay.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/google-voice-assistant-lawsuit-settlement-68-million/

Google to pay $68 million over allegations its voice assistant eavesdropped on users

Class-action lawsuit alleged that Google's voice assistant illegally recorded and shared private conversations with advertisers.

Lance, Enjoying Copious Pollen Feb 2

@JulianOliver Just think of all the valuable data they collected for a measly $68 million. That's pocket change to them.

Julian Oliver Feb 2

@analogfusion 100%. They would have put it aside. Nothing a barrage of marketing, of smiling homes and workplaces living their best possible lives through Google, can't fix. It's dark.

Julian Oliver Feb 2

@analogfusion The only way forward is ground-up, community led and supported, migration off their platform surface and onto ethical alternatives.

(Based on your profile, I see you know this, just sounding it out for the thread)

@JulianOliver @analogfusion

why do you think no feasible alternatives have emerged?

by feasibly I also mean solutions that work for non-technical normal people.

Julian Oliver Feb 2

@rzeta0 @analogfusion Feasible alternatives to Google platforms? Many have emerged, & are increasingly used by non-technical sorts. BigBlueButton easily replaces GG Meet (I have migrated many off Zoom and GG Meet to this platform), Nextcloud replaces GG Drive and so far as many needs GG Docs (as above), Cryptpad likewise (albeit a little more geeky), GMail has many self-hosted alternatives (have moved many to Roundcube or SnappyMail) alongside click & go third party alts like Tutanota, ++ (1/2)

Julian Oliver Feb 2

@rzeta0 @analogfusion What there is not however is a single unified platform 'workspace', that people have grown accustomed to like, integrating auth flow with devices & application layer & across the platform space.

Nextcloud, to some degree, have made headway in this regard, at least so far as the sync, drive, calendar, docs, conferencing needs cluster.

Implementing high-reputation & sovereign mail transport with secure webmail atop is especially tricky, which is why I teach it. 2/2

Tom Stoneham Feb 2

@JulianOliver @rzeta0 @analogfusion #Proton will be there when Proton Meet comes out of beta. It is full suite (well, only docs and sheets ATM but mail, calendar, drive, password manager, authenticator, VPN) and all #e2ee. And easy import from Google.

Only catch is that it is freemium and most people think technology should be free.
@protonprivacy

@JulianOliver @analogfusion

Yes, we're the mine they extract from !

They excavate us. Every click is ore refined into billions. Isn't it wealth extraction colonialism in a UI?

Their "useful free tools" are oil pit infrastructure.
We're the redeemed dopamine hits!

Our stupefied inertia is their moat.

Yep, the exit strategy is to tear down enclosures, and reclaim the commons.

Open protocols over open-air prisons (despite their nice landscaping) !

Lance, Enjoying Copious Pollen Feb 2

@zack @JulianOliver Are we still talking about Proton? I subscribe to their service, which makes me a paying customer. If they don't deliver, I have recourse.

Same with my Flickr Pro subscription. I don't have a problem with companies offering freemium products.

It's not the same model of data harvesting as in "free" social media apps from Meta or Google (which I stopped using years ago). There's NO amount of dollars you can pay Meta to escape being the product.

ChloChloaca Feb 2

Courts need to stop acting like "millions" is enough of a punishment for these companies. $68m is just "the cost of doing business" for a company of this size. They profited far more than they're losing here.

Start fining in numbers that matter.

Michael T Babcock Feb 2

@JulianOliver that's a settlement, not a statement of fact. I'd be cautious about language when commenting on the story. There's no finding of guilt here. It may feel implied of course.

Julian Oliver Feb 2

@mikebabcock Fair. Hence I used "seems". However they have not contested it with evidence, despite having hundreds of lawyers. Just simply denied wrongdoing.

I would not give them the benefit of the doubt. They're a mining company.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_litigation

Google litigation - Wikipedia

John Morahan Feb 2

@JulianOliver @mikebabcock I wouldn't give them the benefit of the doubt either. But I can't help wondering if they're settling this to avoid being forced to explain how it *really* works.

Dying World 🔥🌎🔥Feb 2

@JulianOliver I'm curious how this applies in places where it's illegal to record a person without their consent? Not that I'd expect anyone at google to face any real consequences

@JulianOliver lo peor es que nos obligan usar esta plataforma en el trabajo.

lindegard.xyz Feb 2

@JulianOliver doesn't this mean they eavesdropped on business as well? There should be grounds for huge lawsuits for industrial espionage...

Julian Oliver Feb 2

@lindegardxyz I don't know. But if Google doesn't want it to escalate to that scale, perhaps even to the public sector (incl of other nation states), their gigantic legal team will need to present some form of evidence they have not been eavesdropping. As yet they have not, while the civil lawsuit seems to contain enough material to convince juries that the 'false accepts' (queries passed outside of defined 'hot words') have been happening frequently.

MegatronicThronBanks Feb 2

@JulianOliver Google just lie about everything. They are in that regard identical to Facebook, Microsoft and Apple.

@JulianOliver what's actually left for captain Gemini to extort from everyone once it takes over from the copilot...

Julian Oliver Feb 2

@htpcnz An interesting take

Mr. Lance E Sloan (IRL) 👤Feb 2

@JulianOliver
It seemed pretty obvious, but unproven, over the years. It's nice to finally have proof.

skedarwarrior Feb 2

@JulianOliver If this were justice, it would go to the American people and not the government itself.

@JulianOliver
Corporations are lying? Really? Who would have thought of that? That means, they maybe could have lied about smoking and cancer? Or the ozone layer? Or climate change?

🎹 Your Masto in April 🎹Feb 2

@JulianOliver https://www.privacyguides.org/en/

Home

Established in 2021, Privacy Guides is the most popular & trustworthy non-profit resource to find privacy tools and learn about protecting your digital life.

Rene Raggl 🇪🇺 🇺🇦 🇬🇱Feb 2

@JulianOliver Yeah that is so wild to me: that people just meekishly accept this kind of thing from big corporations that would be totally unacceptable from an individual, citing they have no options. But not trusting the government at the same time. (Yes, different can of worms.)

There are plenty of options. It seems to me the cognitive friction is just too high until they NEED to change or something 'cool' pops up. Humans are weird. #privacy #nobigtech #unplugtrump

Matthew Sheffield Feb 2

@JulianOliver If you ever needed a reason to stop using Google Chrome, this would be it.

There are better and open source options out there!

Open Risk Feb 2

@JulianOliver Trump/Epstein, Google/Meta are the symptoms of societies in moral decay. Broken financial/political systems enriching and empowering the most corrupt. Rapacious elites violating all social contracts with impunity.

It is a dystopic black hole but somehow we must summon the best in human nature to tunnel through and reclaim a bare minimum of decency, agency, fairness, democracy, accountability...

And the diverse #opensource communities have an existentially important role to play.

@JulianOliver Ugh.. Fines like this are just the cost of doing business for corporations like Google. Just think how much they profited from that data. We need some better way of holding them accountable.

Emilio ʕ̡̢̡ʘ̅͟͜͡ʘ̲̅ʔ̢̡̢🇩🇰Feb 2

@JulianOliver People absolutely need to open their eyes; this is a major alert! Are they aware that their voices are being recorded and harvested for advertisers? Get off Google!

ein kleines z Feb 2

@JulianOliver
And then you get 8 - 40$ compensation, like the apple users who got spied on by Siri. If you make a claim. Which would cost you time and energy, so it would equal a super lousy hourly wage, so you'd rather want to spend that time and energy working at your shitty job, because that would still get you better money.

Allan Chow Feb 2

@JulianOliver and yet Google STILL fails to let me know when the new tensuke market opened in Arlington heights

@JulianOliver Million? With an m? That's roughly equivalent to $0 in terms of how much they'll notice.

Maria Langer | 📝🛥️💎Feb 2

@JulianOliver @lennart The crazy thing is that there are plenty of alternatives to Google.

The only Google service I still use is YouTube and I know they are mining and likely selling information about my viewing habits. But at least they're not stealing my content, eavesdropping on conversation conversations, or selling my search history to third parties. And I'm not constantly reminded about how they're snooping on me by having ads for things I've searched for show up on other websites.

Pino Carafa Feb 2

@JulianOliver Imagine speeding at 100 km/h in a 30 km/h residential zone and being fined €0.01 for the offence.

Adrien Pedrina Feb 2

@JulianOliver It should be noted that at Infomaniak we also offers collaborative solutions comparable to those of Google (Mail, Drive, Calendar, Video, etc.), all without advertising, without reselling data, and based in Europe.

Michael McGuire Feb 2

@JulianOliver @nicklockwood There is no confirmation in this article that Google was actually doing this.

My guess is that Google did not want to enter the discovery phase which is costly and can end up revealing embarrassing stuff not even related to the case. It is pretty common for companies to settle to avoid getting to that point.

@JulianOliver "we are the terrain they extract from". damn. that's a phrase.

Troed Sångberg Feb 2

@JulianOliver No, they've not been found to do exactly that.

"Users allege that the assistant sometimes activates unintentionally"

"Google denied the allegations as part of the settlement process and said it agreed to resolve the case to avoid the cost and uncertainty of continued litigation."

Facts matter.

https://www.lawcommentary.com/articles/google-agrees-to-68-million-settlement-over-claims-google-assistant-recorded-private-conversations

Google Agrees to $68 Million Settlement Over Claims Google Assistant Recorded Private Conversations

Google has agreed to pay $68 million to settle a proposed class action lawsuit alleging that its Google Assistant feature recorded private conversations on Android devices without users’ consent. The settlement was filed on January 26 in a federal court in California and requires approval from U.S. District Judge Beth...

Julian Oliver Feb 3

@troed Indeed it "seems" they have been doing this. Their veritable army of lawyers were unable to present any viable evidence to the contrary.

From greenwashing big oil to tax avoidance, numerous cases of patent infringement & antitrust, censorship, working with IDF to help target Palestinians (Project Nimbus), their key role in the NSA's PRISM programme++ this is a company with a prolific history of lying, deceit & gaslighting.

I would not give them benefit of the doubt on this one, either.

"The lawsuit alleges that the software sometimes mistook background speech or ambient sounds for the activation phrase, leading to recordings of conversations users believed were private."