Andromeda YeltonJun 25
Brian Boyer
THIS IS A GODDAMNED LEGAL AGREEMENT FFS DOCUSIGN
Jun 25 at 1:26amWeb
Show threadAndrew DrakeJun 25

@brianboyer last time it gave me that prompt I tried it (on a legal agreement) for fun, since I figured it'd probably get details hilariously wrong.

Instead it gave me a summary that was approximately "this is a [type of legal agreement] with lots of terms in it" which, while not wrong, was less informative than the document title 😂

I wonder if this reflects the attention span of the executives pushing these features. They can't bring themselves to read more than 20 words so they assume nobody else can either?

Show thread👾 Attila GondaJun 25

@adrake @brianboyer okay, but we talk about a service that scrolls down the view to the next required signature place if you fill out one, so the user experience was already a bit low.

when I'm reading through a contract and see a yellow marker I naturally want to fill it out and continue the reading, but they either think nobody reads these documents or nobody at DocuSign uses their own platform because the site hijacks my viewport and jumps down - this is the exact opposite what I'd want 😠

Show threadTom WalkerJun 25
@pcdevil @adrake @brianboyer Yes, they think that no one reads the documents, I'm pretty sure
Show threadAndrew DrakeJun 25
@pcdevil @brianboyer my own workflow is that I carefully read the doc in its entirety first, before I sign any part of it. So when I do start signing I do find it helpful to jump to the next thing that needs it; on paper I'd be flipping to the next page with a "sign here" sticky note on it (if the contract was big enough for that to be useful). I think the UX feels pretty polished for that, but as somebody who normally hates having my viewport hijacked I 100% understand the frustration if that's not your workflow!
Show thread👾 Attila GondaJun 25

@adrake @brianboyer absolutely, that's also a valid flow!

I think a good middle-ground would be that "jump to next" would require one more click by default:
that way your usage would be still easy to achieve but I don't feel myself clicking and scrolling 🙄

Show threadAndrew DrakeJun 25
@pcdevil @brianboyer oh yeah totally! I was mostly responding to the "they think nobody reads the docs", that's certainly a possibility but anther possibility is they over-optimized one specific workflow.
Show threadAndreas ScherbaumJun 25
@adrake @pcdevil @brianboyer Same here. Or, more often I got a preview of the document before signing, which I can review and potentially request changes or additions.
Show threadPete's Mom 🍉 🇺🇦 ☮️Jun 25
@brianboyer This is becoming a "survival of the fittest" moment in himan history.
Show threadLudwig VielfrassJun 25

@brianboyer 'Summarize in moments"?! Like anything I do in docusign is something I want to have a keepsake for? Weird.

Most things I've done in Docusign are closer to Eastman Moments than Kodak Moments.

Show threadcrazyeddieJun 25
@brianboyer Bullet point for investors. That's all it is. People will use it of course, but that doesn't mean it was meant to be.
Show threadJargogglesJun 25
@brianboyer
Vibe lawyering.
Show threadTamzinJun 25
@brianboyer If DocuSign is trying to talk me into not reading all of a legal agreement, then it's in good company alongside a lawyer I hired once, regarding his own contract.
Show threadJohn TimaeusJun 25

@brianboyer

If any company handed me this, I would be immediately referring it to the state bar association which probably has questions regarding confidentiality and practice of law without a license.

Show threadJohnMasheyJun 25
@brianboyer
In former life I’d signed 100+ Non-Disclosure Agreements. I read them all, mostly similar, but one was the wrong type, which i refused and pointed out. BUT this illustrates more general problem, waste of time (but good for lawyers) on fairly standard agreements.
It would have been far better to have a few standard NDAs (#1,#2, etc) with a few fill-in-the-blanks, rather than requiring careful review. I.e. “we use NDA#2, with fill-ins highlighted. Do these work for you?” Done.
Show threadRobin MonksJun 25
@brianboyer @pluralistic I’m so tired of companies trying to bolt this kind of thing on. Even if AI worked amazingly, if someone wants to use OpenAI to review a doc, they can go and use ChatGPT.
Show threadmxkJun 25
@brianboyer the pure idea of DocuSign needing AI summaries is so wild to me.
Show threadEoin O'BearaJun 25
@brianboyer It tried to summarise my one-page PDF train ticket, ha.
Show threadFrank MeerkötterJun 25
@eobeara @brianboyer my poor mother in law (82 years old) struggled with the recipes for her bank account. Stupid Adobe PDF viewer on her iPad tricked her via dark UI pattern to create "AI" summaries of those recipes...
Show threadFrank MeerkötterJun 25
@eobeara @brianboyer those were also one pagers (single transaction recipes). And of course the resulting PDF contained the wrong numbers
Show threadNN SchneiderJun 25

@eobeara @brianboyer

Clearly the AI is not that intelligent if it can't determine what needs summarizing and what does not

Show threadDatenegassieJun 25
@brianboyer I wonder if it would be possible to make a contract that would (to actual lawyers unambiguously) give me the entirety of a company, while worded in a way that makes ai summarize it into, idk, getting me a pay cut or whatever will convince CEOs to sign
Show threadRejZoRJun 25
@brianboyer Summary of EULA nonsense would be nice. Who even reads that shit?
Show threadStephen BakerJun 25
@brianboyer
I've told more than one company that I would not use Docusign. This has come with mixed responses ranging from sending me the documents through the post to ignoring my refusal and proceeding as if I had signed the document.
Show threadRichardJun 25
@brianboyer my landlords letting agents tried to force us to use this, they were very unhappy when we refused
Show threadRobert BanzJun 25
@brianboyer “How does this agreement disadvantage me?” would be something AI should help with…
Show threadJodieMJun 26
@brianboyer
Yeah as if that is going to fly in court. I have an issue that I signed a contract but the actual wording was different than what I was told I was buying from my financial adviser, and I find out 11 years later, when the shit hits the fan. But I know, that since I signed the contract, I'm not in a great position.
Show threademeritrixJun 26

@jodiem

I dunno, have you seen the courts lately?

Show threadPippzJun 26
@brianboyer Oh this just gave me the best LOL! I work with nonprofit Board(s) and when I see that AI summary my eye starts twitching. So. Much. Work. goes into Board Materials - the AI summaries just KILL ME.
Show threadMoonSongJun 27
@brianboyer It still works:
* You want to try Disney Plus;
* You barely read a legal document you were never truly prepared to understand in the first place;
* Years later your significant other dies from a preventable cause In a Disney park;
* You try to die them;
* They blame you and counter sue you with the basis of a legally binding contract with you signed years ago and it protects a huge corporation against individual persons;