This includes all the wringing about H-1Bs taking *your* jobs.
Criticism of the exploitative tech industry and inane exploitative immigration system is valid. But I just canāt shake the gross feeling of how much of all of that is just objection of certain types of people supposedly ātaking upā the āgoodā jobs.
@skinnylatte
Ah, the issue is a different one.
If they don't like it, just make sure that the foreigners have the same rights as the natives when it comes to pay, job mobility, etc.
A surprising number of US work visas (often especially the "preferred programs") come with quite Draconian conditions which make the foreign worker little better than a intendured worker.
Eg I remember my first contact for an US startup that wanted me to move to California and I
declined the promotion. But my Aussie colleague took it, and his special work visa for Aussies back then included the provision that he would have to leave the states 7 days after losing employment. What a great deal. Having a shotgun marriage to his girlfriend so she can move with him falls under trivial.
Sorry with that kind of visa conditions, that's an open invitation to abuse. @skinnylatte
@skinnylatte It's not like jobs are some zero sum game of fruit that grows on the job tree. That's not how an economy works. People who work in a place live in the place which means they spend money to buy goods and services in that place which means that other people have to work to provide said goods and services in that place which means they have to live in the place ...
The reason people don't have jobs isn't because of immigrants. It's because of billionaires.
@JessTheUnstill @skinnylatte Itās not a zero sum game, but jobs arenāt infinite, either. People are upset because they do see their jobs vanishing. As you say, problem is that they blame others in the same situation as them, especially immigrants or people of color.
Microsoft, Meta, Google, and the rest of the American mega corporations do the same thing: they send money home to their family. They do it at a scale most of us canāt even comprehend. American wealth is derived from those billion dollar companies siphoning money out of every other nation.
@ClickyMcTicker @JessTheUnstill @skinnylatte
immigrants aren't taking anyone's job, their boss is.
(and for people who are often tempted to draw a line between conscious racism and unintended racism when such phrases are used unthinkingly and "meaning no harm", what actually happens is that's a position that offers comfort to the person who perpetuates racism and xenophobia, and equal and opposite force in the persistent injustice to the person who receives it; effectively extended violence)
@skinnylatte This is the most amazing mental gymnastics. The jobs arenāt ātakenā by immigrants. The jobs are āgivenā to immigrantsā¦by employers who want cheap labor. The idea that the person making the hiring decision is somehow blameless is ridiculous.
And for crying out loud all we have to do is let them be legal. Let them register with a tax ID and work and pay taxes. Citizenship is not the same thing as a legal right to work. Let them work. Give them a clear path to citizenship and let them live and work legally in the mean time.
@darkuncle I was an immigrant for 8 years: an American in the UK. I had the most amazing taxation-without-representation. While I lived there I rented my US house. Now, in the US the house owner pays the real estate taxes, but the resident (if they are allowed to vote) votes. I can vote by mail but only on federal stuff. So I paid Virginia and Fairfax County taxes, but I couldnāt vote in Fairfax County elections because I didnāt live there.
Meanwhile, in the UK, the tax system has the resident pay ācouncil taxā, which is your local tax to pay for schools, parks, libraries, etc. Owners only pay council tax if they live there. Tenants pay council tax wherever they live. I wasnāt a citizen, so I couldnāt vote. But I was a legal immigrant, so I paid the full council taxes my citizen neighbours paid.
So in 2 different countries I was paying taxes, and in neither place could I vote for the people that represented me and decided how to use my money.
@skinnylatte
Also, just wrong. And almost certainly stupid.
@skinnylatte Begging all people in every country who say this to recognise that it was never true in the first place. And that all people who even indicate that someone "stole" their job are proving themselves to be untrustworthy.
Having seen a lot of friends who I'd had in Slovakia get pushed back to their home countries who'd come here for work because the labour ministry suddenly decided after 5 years (curiously the amount of time it takes to access permanent residency) that "a Slovak could do their job" (y'know, the one they'd had for a few years already)... It's just ludicrous as a statement.
@skinnylatte
It's a stupid take.
If a foreigner, that in most cases does not speak English very well, has no locally recognized certifications, and no friends takes away your job, what does it say about you.
Although these people usually are not very self reflective.
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