Pilots on Facebook are sharing stories + images of #SpaceJunk breakups and alerts they have seen. Surreal that this is seemingly a regular occurrence in #Aviation now.
@TheMartianLife "... we hope" not what you want to hear from ATC.
@TheMartianLife "...we hope"
@RedstoneLP2 @TheMartianLife That and "Some expected to burn off". I always thought space junk re-entry was pretty harmless
@admin
Depends on the size. Smaller stuff usually just burns up, but bigger stuff may reach the ground
(See: several farmers standing near space debris on a field)
@TheMartianLife
@RedstoneLP2 @admin @TheMartianLife It depends on a lot of things, the size, the shape, the material, how everything is put together, etc. Ideally, the manufacturers would design things in such a way that maximises re-entry vaporisation, but I don't think that's always the case (the only motivation is the possibility of the operating company being responsible for retrieving the object from private property and possibly paying for any repairs).

@StarkRG @RedstoneLP2 @admin @TheMartianLife
☠️ The brutal reality:
IF something from Space X burning up in the atmosphere was to take out a plane, a big plane with over 200 souls on -board, people would freak out, Elon would do literally nothing (except maybe tweet), WE would all do nothing, then it would go back to business as usual.

Right?

@clintruin
Not to defend Musk, but the chances of that happening are so miniscule that i don't think it would justify any action. You're in way more danger crossing a suburban street.

SpaceX is only the launch provider for most large satellites at this point, starlink sats are super tiny and very likely to burn up. Second stages can hit the ground but mostly have predictable ground tracks. Those are the most likely to cause problems, not satellites.
@StarkRG @RedstoneLP2 @admin @TheMartianLife

@rbos @StarkRG @RedstoneLP2 @admin @TheMartianLife

My point had NOTHING to do with the "chances of that happening".

My point had everything to do with the reaction --not just of Musk -- but also the general public...
No matter how "miniscule" the possibility of an actual occurrence.

Hence my giant IF at the beginning of the post.

@clintruin Fair enough. I'm just saying that doing nothing *is* the responsible choice in that situation. Some things are just so low-probability that preparing for them isn't cost-effective. The hypothetical owner of a satellite that hits an airplane should have insurance, of course, but the insurance company would probably eat it and move on.

@TheMartianLife well, but the risk of getting hit while in the air is similar to getting hit while on the ground

so… not that high

only they move a relatively large thing that maybe COULD be agile enough to evade

IDK… this probably would be the last thing I'd worry about if flying?

@drazraeltod I’d not worry about it, no. The odds of an incident are so minor.

That said, I would imagine their odds of being hit are slightly higher than the ground. To get hit on the ground, something has to have de-orbited over land, made it to the ground, and hit specifically you. To get hit in the sky you could be over the ocean (where we deorbit things), hit anywhere on the aircraft (which has a large footprint), and up high (where more pieces could be intact).

Also a passenger airline will absolutely not be logistically able to manoeuvre so fast, even if the frame where capable and they had warning. These memos are less a warning to do something about and more an “if you suddenly explode or depressurise, this was why”.

@TheMartianLife LEO stuff would decrease pretty fast if there was a break in launches. But we keep sending more each week.
@TheMartianLife probably the most logical explanation of a lot of these 'best UAP video yet' clips where objects seem to fly past planes...
@TheMartianLife What are they supposed to do? Swerve? 😮
@TheMartianLife "exercise caution" like wtf are they supposed to do about it? it's not like they can see it coming and dodge to the side like a dark souls boss (i have never played dark souls)

@xaphania @TheMartianLife you might be surprised at how sporting an airliner can be when push comes to shove

but you can't dodge a hypersonic blob of molten metal

@TheMartianLife
I'm guessing that it moves too fast to avoid if you see it heading towards your plane 😬
@AlisonW very much so, yes.
@TheMartianLife @AlisonW
Let me translate – "if you see a burning hunk of metal fall out of the sky in front of you, don't bother reporting it, we already know".
@TheMartianLife I didn't know space junk counted as "weather"! (Sigmet.)
@TheMartianLife
What does "exercise caution" even mean in this case? Be ready to dodge?
@jozeldenrust @TheMartianLife take a look at your flight path and divert a little bit to avoid the area, if not too inconvenient?
@TheMartianLife It occurs to me it's probably best that these notices are sent out now to avoid panic. It's... exactly the equivalent of the "Low Flying Planes" advisory signs on highways adjoining airports.
@TheMartianLife now imagine if #SpaceX's #Starlink satellites were as huge as #Iridium's first gen Satellites aka. Lockheed-Martin LM700A or even big ass #Thuraya satellites...

@TheMartianLife

"Exercise caution. The junk is speeding at you from above so I'll be fucked if I know what exercising caution would even look like but yeah, exercise caution"

@TheMartianLife I wonder if we need to update the METAR code.... or maybe we'll just use the RMK field. Talk about "space weather"...
@TheMartianLife StarLink #SpaceJunk has the opportunity to do the funniest thing to Elon’s private jet…
@TheMartianLife Interesting how informal these are.
@TheMartianLife Ah, the good old times when big space junk fell at Point Nemo and (almost) nowhere else...
@TheMartianLife @octothorpe It’s time to get out the Skylab Protective Helmet I purchased in 1979. 🤦‍♂️

@TheMartianLife oh wow! I'm also in the field of space traffic and #spacedebris and this is so cool (as a proof). I've never seen it before.

Big ass problem what we're getting up there

@caeruleus657 oh awesome! I work with CSIRO and the University of Tasmania (and in a contract capacity with a few others in the past) on software changes or parallel backends that allow astronomical radio telescopes to detect satellites or act as receivers in space debris detection. I’m mostly a programmer but I get more and more involved in the hardware over time and the lack of people in this field I think awards us few a lot of autonomy in our projects down here in Australia. What do you do?
@TheMartianLife that's very cool! I work in Germany at a company focused in space traffic coordination and space situational awareness. So more on the spacecraft side of things, how to keep track of them so they don't crash into each other. You are more on the "dark and quiet skies" side of things! Pretty cool

@caeruleus657 “dark and quiet skies” are more the domain of the astrophysicists and space weather people I work with. My actual job is to operationalise atypical systems to collect SSA data for Australia, because there aren’t enough dedicated sensors in the southern hemisphere to keep as good a track of things as we’d like.

I worked a bit with dedicated and passive arrays when interning and contracting, and I’ve done some dedicated real-time backend stuff for some of our telescopes down here that do launch and mission support for NASA/ESA, now I’m mostly working on very high-frequency astro telescopes looking at feasible ways to design and performance test “commensal” SSA systems that other VLBI instruments can just follow to collect SSA data for free without changing their busy observation schedules.

We know these telescopes catch satellites incidentally all the time, so I’m looking at the performance trade-offs of the approach where you pick satellites out of data collected for other reasons. So the transmission or reflection might be coming from outside the primary beam, or caught by some antenna and not others, or way below the noise floor before integration but correlation will scrub it entirely. The goal is to figure out in a comparable way how much worse all that is versus the benefit of being able to collect data all the time.

@TheMartianLife What are you even supposed to do with that information? It's a track 500 miles wide! It's one of those "today just might be your day to die" kind of things.
@TheMartianLife Between the lines the message is you might see some cool streaks in the sky so stay alert.
@TheMartianLife
This seems like something in @sundogplanets 's wheelhouse!
@TheMartianLife What kind of caution are you supposed to exercise when you're doing ~0.22km/s and a VW bus starts coming at you at ~10km/s?

@TheMartianLife “exercise caution”

That’s as helpful as a roadsign “possible rock slides” 🙄

@TheMartianLife ah - now I'm getting what the #Starship is actually about: reenacting the scene with the infinite improbability drive from the #HitchhikersGuide, where as a result a Magrathean sperm whale falls from the sky.
@TheMartianLife [2nd pic] “Travelling in a fried-up kombi…”
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@TheMartianLife
@sundogplanets

Have you seen this? But trigger warning. It might make you want to yell.

@TheMartianLife @brunthal Too many satellites or too many planes? Or both of it? #SkyJunk

@TheMartianLife polluting earth was not enought.

Space is now full of junk.

You want to put a staellite up there, you need to fire a rocket first to make some space.

@TheMartianLife
In Zukunft mehr Sternschnuppen... Oder sollte ich Muskschuppen sagen? 🤣
@TheMartianLife this has been warned about but minimized - as you can see in this aeroamerica article: https://aerospaceamerica.aiaa.org/features/dodging-debris/
Dodging debris

Aerospace America