How bus use has changed in London & in big cities outside of London since deregulation. (from which London was exempt).
From @thomasforth (posted at the other place)
Its quite an extraordinary 'natural experiment' - from which we can draw the conclusion (without too much difficulty) that #privatisation is not the way forward if #busses are to be part of the #greentransition
(and don't get me started on #London exceptionalism....)
Outrageous central government over-reach, how dare they dictate like that to local government. The right are never about freedom.
Worth clarifying there are still private companies operating in London. The difference is between unregulated and regulated markets.
In london TFL franchises the routes, companies compete on cost and performance. Bringing down cost and improving performance. Profit margins are low and comparble across operators. A service every 15 mins or less is run to make the network attractive to commuters.
Outside of in the unregulated private market, private companies form monopolies, drive up prices and only run the most profitable routes and schedules while demanding huge subsidies for anything else. Profit margins are typically much higher but there is no alternative as they own all the depots and literally drive other operators out by blocking routes!
Excitied to see a regulated market approach coming to #manchester also what the ROI on for proper investment in bus (in regulated markets) could be for working families and the environment.
@JackRS1 @ChrisMayLA6 @thomasforth Let's be clear that there is not really a difference between what TFL are doing and government control. The bus companies do what TFL tells them to do and TFL is big and mean enough not to be abused. Smaller Local Authorities would be subject to manipulation by the large private providers so I doubt the London model would work elsewhere.
State provision directly with democratic control is the solution.
@peterbrown @Billybobbell @ChrisMayLA6 @thomasforth
Exactly @peterbrown.
Potentially the ideal scenario would be a TFL like franchise market operated by social enterprises or worker coops.
Get overall network vision amd some incentives for operators to improve performance and keep costs low.
Might be a long way off.
Certainly possible for some of the larger devolved regions to start putting in TFL like regulated markets.
yes, there's certainly been some of that going on in rural #lancashire!
Could you assume that the rest of England was sacrificed to the corporates in exchange for London?
Why does everything have to be 'for profit'? The gov could incentive commuter trips?
That's certainly one way of looking at it, and would (I think) fit the evidence to hand....
Listen to this episode from Reasons to be Cheerful with Ed Miliband and Geoff Lloyd on Spotify. All aboard! Last weekend, Greater Manchester made history as the first place outside London to bring its bus system into public control. Since 1986 - when buses were deregulated - fares have almost doubled, routes have been cut and fewer people are taking the bus. The Bee Network is Mayor Andy Burnham's answer to the problem. We spoke to him in 2021 about his commitment to make the region's buses better. We also talked to transport expert Nicole Badstuber about why London's buses never suffered the same fate as elsewhere in the country, and to Ian Taylor about visionary public transport systems in Europe and further afield. Will other parts of Britain soon see their buses back in public hands?See you on Monday for our next episode of Reasons to be Cheerful!GuestsNicole Badstuber, Transport Expert (@nicolebadstuber)Andy Burnham, Mayor of Greater Manchester (@AndyBurnhamGM)Ian Taylor, Transport for Quality of LifeMore informationListen to RTBC Episode 23: Ding, ding, next stop: sorting out the busesListen to RTBC Episode 192 Ticket to ride: buses, Burnham and public control Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
@ChrisMayLA6 You can see this in practice if you live in London and use the buses (as I do) and then go anywhere else in Britain and try to use the buses
In London: there is one unified ticketing system, bus stop style, schedule and arrival tracker
Outside London: who the fuck knows
I lived in London for 35 years so am only too aware of the transport issues.... but London's exceptionalism only really hit home when I moved away & saw it from the outside... and of course 'don't get me started' is not so much shutting things down as admitting there's too much for one post to cover....
Is there data for Edinburgh? As LRT was still council owned I thought.
Sorry I just picked this up from a post elsewhere... no idea if there is city-based data, although I'd expect there would be if you searched for it.
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