John Shirley

Evangelicals Are Now Rejecting JESUS as TOO LIBERAL (not a joke! Not The Onion!)

"Multiple pastors tell me, essentially, the same story about quoting the Sermon on the Mount and...'Where did you get those liberal talking points?'"

"When the pastor would say, 'I'm literally quoting Jesus Christ' ... The response would be, 'Yes, but that doesn't work anymore.' "When we get to the point where the teachings of Jesus himself are seen as subversive to us, we're in a crisis."
https://www.newsweek.com/evangelicals-rejecting-jesus-teachings-liberal-talking-points-pastor-1818706

Evangelicals Are Now Rejecting ‘Liberal’ Teachings of Jesus

Christian devotees of former President Donald Trump are denouncing Bible verses attributed to Jesus as “weak,“ according to an evangelical leader.

Newsweek
Aug 12, 2023 at 4:45pmWeb
Show threadJohn ShirleyAug 12, 2023
Yes they DO think Jesus is too woke. Not all evangelicals take this attitude. But there's a MAGA faction of Christians. Some are saying, "We need to get more Old Testament"--others say no, because that's so...Jewish
Show threadWoodchazAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023
It's NT for me, OT for thee.
Show threadMr. Big John Aug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 wow, they figured out how to make Christianity even less coherent.
Show threadLarryAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023
Probably don't want to give up blended textiles.
Show threadTimothy ClarkAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 There's a real qualitative change now, where they've gone well past silent disregard or contorted rationalizations to disregard teaching they themselves call "inerrant" and now are just straight up calling Jesus's teachings morally incorrect. There was a time when calling Jesus's works or words evil ("woke" = evil in their dictionary) was not just heretical but outright blasphemous.
Show threadResunaAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 One thing that early turned me off the Honor Harrington series is when they turned the awful old-testament-only sect with chattel slavery for women unto bold old-testament-inspired warriors against the -Soviet-Union- Republic of Haven with chattel slavery for MOST women.
Show threadGuitarsophistAug 12, 2023

@JohnShirley2023 Often it seems that evangelicals are doing and saying the opposite of what Jesus does and says. But the Old Testament is full of raunchy stuff that they wouldn't approve of either. A lot of it is God telling the Israelites what to do and the Israelites not doing it and getting in big trouble.

Are we watching a MAGA schism in Christianity? Perhaps The Art of the Deal becomes a new sacred text?

Show threadJeff CraigAug 12, 2023
@jredlund @JohnShirley2023 Honestly, breaking the back of the idea that "Christian" is a political bloc would be great. Break them back into denominations like before the 1970s, and we all benefit. Even the Christians who don't want to be politically lumped in with Evangelicals.
Show threadgraphictruthAug 12, 2023

@jredlund @JohnShirley2023

Reading Revelations these days is starting to make me wonder what Shrooms John of Patmos was eating, because Donald Trump is a damn fine #antichrist.

As an #Ignostic I don't see much need for prophecies; they are either common sense coerced into doctrines or the sacred gibberish that comes from trying to relate and understand a shamanic trance journey. Subjective truths; often useless. Pulling meaning out is difficult.

Show threadPeter Paaske JuulAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 look, the whole "sell all your stuff, give the money to the poor, then come follow me" was clearly an ALLEGORY for... Something. It probably means "hire the poor and give them a little money for their work. But not too much. Can't have them become rich. They are just gonna love money, and that is a root of all evil."
Show threadAdrian J. ChungAug 13, 2023

@Rockbear @JohnShirley2023
The evangelicals abandoned christian vows of poverty centuries ago. They were eventually superseded by the prosperity gospel

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/andrewbrown/2013/may/29/prosperity-gospel-mockery-christianity

The prosperity gospel makes a mockery of Christianity

Andrew Brown: Preachers who get rich by saying success is a mark of divine favour go against everything Jesus taught – maybe he had a point

The Guardian
Show threadPeter Paaske JuulAug 13, 2023

@ajc418 @JohnShirley2023 indeed. And while the capitalism-ization of church has been a great success for some, the parishioners has experienced exactly what workers everywhere has experienced. The lie "You too can be a Billionaire, if you work really hard." Has been transformed into "you too can be a blessed and become a billionaire, if you pray and give really hard."

It was basically the same scam when kings and bishops talked people into going to war "for God". (1/2)

Show threadPeter Paaske JuulAug 13, 2023

@ajc418 @JohnShirley2023 It saddens me that this sort of "Christianity" from the evangelical right has gained so much traction that few even know of the evangelical left, of Christian socialism, of Liberation Theology and similar movements.

But one may suspect that the loud evangelicals of this era would rather forget about Martin Luther King Jr. et al...
(2/2)

Show threadMark PauleyAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 wait til they find out that Jesus was Jewish
Show threadJamesAug 12, 2023

@JohnShirley2023

So, let me see; the only way they can get to heaven is to be baptized and believe in Jesus Christ (My apologies if I get this wrong). So these folks are saying they don't believe in the teachings of Christ . . . So they can go to Hell, eternal damnation, for a political point?

Show threadWoodchazAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023
Christian is only a cultural signifier for them. At most, they (we?) were following Paul anyway. It went from Jesus asking Mary and Martha for their opinions to "women be silent." Jesus was too liberal for Jews, Greeks and Romans also.
Show threadDrew CostenAug 13, 2023
@Woodchaz Honestly, they weren’t even following Paul. Paul is extremely misunderstood, and MAGA Christians would dislike his teachings as much as the teachings Jesus gave while He walked the earth, if they actually understand what he was saying (Paul taught that everyone will eventually experience salvation, which even Jesus didn’t teach during His earthly ministry, but saved for Paul to teach later).
Show threadVincent Van DinskyAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023
Well they always did reject His teachings; now they're just being honest about it.
Show threadPRAEst76Aug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 They need to get back to basics...
Show threadRev. Dr. Richard V. LindsayAug 12, 2023
@praest76 @JohnShirley2023 laugh all you want, but the 1973 harvest was significantly better than '72.
Show threadmsgbiAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 talking to themselves but unloading this stuff onto others with different gods churches @charles_ex
Show threadThe Skeptic's Book of ListsAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 I think Vonnegut pointed out right wing Christians always want the Ten Commandments on capitol grounds. But those are Jewish commandments. Jesus's beatitudes are HIS commandments. But not one wants those enshrined as the basis for American culture.
Show threadThe DoctorAug 12, 2023

@JohnShirley2023  

What the gamma photon emitting fuck.

Show threadEliasAug 12, 2023

@JohnShirley2023 To be fair, Jesus was indeed hugely liberal (in the meaning of the word "liberal" in US political debate).

Talking about things like being merciful, turning the other cheek, loving your enemies, and all that blabbering about forgiveness. It is clearly left-wing lunacy, all of it.

For right-wing/conservative folks it is therefore logical to reject the teachings of Jesus.

Show threadSimon KowalewskiAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 Of course, Jesus was subversive. It was Paul who ground his teachings down into a form that could be used as a state religion to oppress people.
Show threadOblomovAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 I doubt they're only noticing now. George Carlin was doing jokes about the un-Christianity of these “christians” 40 years ago.
Show threadInferisAug 12, 2023
@Dhmspector omg
Show threadDave SpectorAug 12, 2023
@inferis
Show threadRevJeberAug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 @samloonie
Christianity got its start as a reaction to the Jewish beliefs. They included the Old Testament in the Bible but taught it had been rendered irrelevant by Jesus. So it seems traditional that they now move on from the New Testament as well and adopt a fascist platform of hate and bigotry as their new Bible.
Show threadAnotherGrumpyDayInHell 💙🇺🇲🇺🇦Aug 12, 2023

@jeber @JohnShirley2023 @samloonie

Thank you! I've been screaming this for so long now. They aren't Christians anymore, and probably never more. I keep getting told that's a No True Scotsman fallacy. It's not a fallacy if it's true! They're pretending that they are Christians when in reality their religion is something entirely new and rooted in fascism.

Show threadT.WllmsAug 12, 2023

@JohnShirley2023

It was bound to happen… Jesus isn’t mean enough or cruel enough for the extremist far right evangelicals… these are the same people who reject democracy for authoritarian rule…

Show threadOctorineAug 12, 2023

@JohnShirley2023 There was a throwaway bit in a recent Neal Stephenson book about a neoprotestant movement who burned crosses to show their rejection for Jesus because he was too woke.

Didn't expect that bit to actually happen.

Show threadJohn ShirleyAug 12, 2023

@octorine They never understood Christianity in the first place.\

They're idiots.

Show threadXenofact (he/him)Aug 12, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 @octorine and Jesus said unto them "Did I stutter?"
Show threadXenofact (he/him)Aug 12, 2023

@octorine @JohnShirley2023 what's oft missed is they want an excuse to be terrible people in the form of a God. Christianity has been used as that excuse, despite its own contents.

Now they're feeling very edit-y on the consumer level

Show threadJaime RobertsonAug 13, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 Living in Colorado Springs, home of Focus on the Family, New Life Church, and other conservative Evangelical orgs, it’s been obvious for decades that they aren’t actually Xtian in any meaningful way.
Show threadelectronichienAug 13, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 @mmu_man Flexi-christianism! How funny 😍
Show threadJeremy GibbonsAug 13, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 Jesus was subversive in his time. No surprise that he is still so.
Show threadglynAug 13, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 As a Brit, I always have to remind myself that evangelical, in a US context, doesn't have its normal (at least in the UK) meaning of Bible-believing.
Show threadJohn ShirleyAug 13, 2023
@underlap It depends, many factions here.
Show threadEarthshine --> movedAug 13, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 just replace "Donald trump" with "the anti-christ," and anyone who's actually read the book of Revelation should be like "ohhh... yeah, that makes sense."
Show threadyanndegatAug 13, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xSORIDw1Sg ;)😂
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Show threadBoneHouseWasps🔶🇬🇧🇪🇺Aug 14, 2023

@JohnShirley2023 I'm a little surprised they finally got there. Secular folks have been snarkily pointing out for years that Evangelical Christians ain't that Jesus-y anymore and it looks like they finally agree with us.

Time to stop calling them Christian at all, I think.

Show threadPaul HouleAug 16, 2023
@JohnShirley2023 there’s a rumour that somebody asked people if certain quotes came from the Sermon on the Mount or the Communist Manifesto and that even people who claimed to be Christians, Communists or both had a hard time