Normalize this

(Updated: I changed Twitter to X and User to Profile. I intentionally left out Bluesky because their approach to profile naming doesn't fit this paradigm and precedent.)

#X #Threads #Fediverse #News #Media

@jon It still bothers me that @matrix did not adopt this scheme.
@fell @jon Hot take but I like how Matrix uses colons, it distinguishes the types of software at a glance, so you never have to specify which one is the chat app and which one is the social media

@luna i like "/", because its like "on" if you say β…ž as "7 on 8". @user/example.site

but the ship has totally sailed so it'll probably be @...@... forever

@irina Considering the colon is sometimes used as a division symbol, that may be what Matrix was going for?
@irina @luna This looks much better than the two ampersands though. The two ampersands looks really bad and that’s been hard for me to get past!!
@irina @luna `@` is `at`, so it is `user at example.site`. IMHO the `@` at the beginning is more problematic.

@hauleth
Without it it is an email address… remember xmpp and emails sent /dev/null by ppl just because it looks the same?

@irina @luna

@irina @luna the other problem with / is that it's precisely opposite to how / is used in URLs β€” as in example.site/user
@luna @fell @jon I like the colons more because it differentiates between pseudonym and server name
@fell @jon I /think/ that @user@domain wasn't a thing when we created Matrix in 2014. the double at looks ugly; colon is prettier :P
@matrix @jon That's what I call an official answer! Fair enough, a lot of people seem to pefer the colon.
@fell @jon the best thing is you can pronounce it "at matthew colon matrix.org" and then abbreviate 'colon' to 'on', so it becomes "at matthew on matrix.org". Whereas "at matthew at matrix.org" just sounds confusing ;P
@matrix @jon I mean, in my opinion "matthew at matrix.org" like #XMPP would've been perfectly fine. But whatever works.

@matrix @fell @jon The double @ is superfluous. You can use normal user@domain addresses on fedi, too.

The idea that those didn't exist in 2014 is ludicrous. E-Mail being the obvious example. XMPP another one.

@jon Focus on the user and the NAMESPACE.

While mastodon.social is likely to continue using the Mastodon, ActivityPub federation is agnostic to which app the user accesses their account and the namespace (instance) may migrate from mastodon to another application.

@jonahstein right, but the namespace becomes secondary. There's no longer the decision to choose Twitter over another, which has been the norm up to this point. Media can be agnostic.
@jon In the context of Twitter, I agree. Moreover, I think it is really important that we normalize user accounts on social media being @domain just like an email addresses.
@jon Noβ€”only do this for platforms which are actually federated. Continue to use the platform's name and the non-federated username for monocentralized platforms (e.g. β€œ@elon on Twitter”). This includes Facebook Threads, which has an end goal of being monocentralized.

Monocentralized services do not have federation-parts, and frequently they do not have open protocols either. Treating them the same way gives the illusion that there is some choice or freedom, which is not true. Do not do this.
@polychromata @jon They give the opposite idea to me, they make them seem highly locked down for not being able to interact with everyone else. But even if this specifically isn't widely adopted, something has to be done about the power companies get out of @ usernames, they all want to own them, for people to assume @user refers to their platform
@jon what service makes posting to all of them at the same time easy?
@jon i think [email protected] looks better because 2 @'s looks weird
@sinphy @jon unfortunately everything interprets that as an email address and would try to open up the email client to send an email.
@sinphy @jon requesting thefuck tld please
@jon they won't :-( People just can't seem to get over the idea that everything has to be owned by some brand, backed by someone's interests. The idea of a network being separate from an app is just so foreign it must be socialism or something...

@isagalaev Even if it belongs to a brand there's still a difference between [email protected], [email protected] and [email protected] ...

So namespacing does make sense. Even without socialism πŸ˜‰

/cc @jon

@heiglandreas @jon it's not me who you need to convince, you know…

@jon Easy to convey why this new way with now more than one social network doing the whole thing Twitter used to be alone in.

You don’t email: president. You email: [email protected]

We’re out of the days off CompuServe style microblogging. There’s more than a major player now, time to do what we did once CompuServe needed to do more than 71234,56.

I get why press still put @ exampleusername and assume everyone will just think Twitter but that thinking is becoming dated.

@jon That's how Fediverse already works. If Twitter or Threads use the same naming scheme, it wouldn't change much if they do not federate with Fediverse.
@jon Nobody think this is strange when it is regarding e-mail. But for chat and other social media it is for some reason unthinkable.
@jon or you could just leave Twitter to continue its death spiral without you.
@jon
πŸ₯₯ Normalize it, Jon?
I don't even understand it. πŸ₯₯
@jon wait Twitter is federated now????
@jon Gets too complicated with obscure Mastodon instance URLs.
@frumble @jon And yet they'll interview CEO John Smith about their company name collision with an app which is a common word misspelled slightly differently from a dozen other apps based on the same word, and which uses as a Libyan or Indian Ocean TLD, and has no Google clout.

@jon

or vomit on the commercial data collectors and propaganda turds.

@jon ironically #Threads is somewhat normalising that already. Every account there appears with the host showing (of which there of course currently is only one, threads.net). I think that shows they have been intent on joining the Fediverse. Business realities may yet change that (we will have to wait and see).
@jon how does this work with Bluesky, whose handles are arbitrary domain names without a user?
@jon Anything is possible except MUSKIISM!πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚

@jon
An amendment I would add is the notion indicate whether this is is wenfingerable or not.

Alternatively, let the universal id be an HTTP URI. After all that is what ActivityPub standard calls for, as well.

@jon posts like this really make me miss tagging people in a retweet.

There is plenty of MSM in this platform - but they are mostly transmit only

@jon One great way to leverage this common sense solution is to contact the people responsible for widely used style guides.

For example, readers can contact the Chicago Manual of Style and ask them about this, pointing out this suggestion as a very good idea.
https://www.chicagomanualofstyle.org/qanda/submitaquestion.html

@jon (Chicago Manual of Style was kind of my Bible when I did technical writing. It's also influenced other industries and forms of writing, no doubt, and is a good place to start. I do suggest that anyone who knows of other style guides suggest them in the comments, though, so they can also be contacted.)
@jon This, but also de-emphasize the domain.
@jon
Fuck this! Pre-@ was invented by lazy unfederated service developers to ease text parsing.
The only correct form is 'email-like' account@server. I use it for proprietary services too. You can contact me via Xenocephal@Telegram
@jon honestly though, I kinda wish we could have domain name user names, like a domain name searchable by mastodon that would point to my profile like bsky
@skymtf @jon if you host your own instance you basically can have that lol
@hopolapopola @jon the way bsky handles this I think is it just flat out looks up the DNS and finds your profile in the txt records.
@hopolapopola like every bsky username is just a flatout domain name