Mastodawn

❄️May 24, 2023

literally the only correct update Nintendo could've released for the 3DS was one which opened up the firmware at least a little more, and/or removed restrictions to playing games (I'm almost sure that there are still cross-region restrictions, and so removing them would be the correct option)

When a device is past its end of its lifecycle like that you don't lock it down more, you give people the tools to still re-use it

You're just making more E-waste otherwise

Literal Jesus fucking Christ

Evan Keeton May 26, 2023

I wish large influential bodies like the EU would actually go as far as to make this law; once a product is no longer supported, an update should be released that allows full access to its boot components, to allow consumers to be able to develop or flash custom firmware for it at any time

No computer chip is sacred enough to demand full industrial secrecy, especially when you're selling those chips to consumers, that's not secrecy, that's artificial scarcity, and in some ways, planned obsolescence

All of this wastes the abilities and capacities of the high-tech fabs we've built to churn out chips, the only EOL destination it sees is a dispassionate throw into a garbage dump, literally the most wasteful you could ever be with a high-energy product like this

Not to mention the incredible disservice and apathy that does to the sourcing of the materials, which often come at high cost, and not just money

Literally everything about this makes me angry

☃️karolherbst☃️May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan there are some people which advocate for this on the EU level, but sadly the industry has a higher weight on that matter 🙃

There was a discussion around OpenWRT and internet routers, but sadly nothing came out of it either. Maybe in the future (tm), dunno.

Rairii May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan i heard that MS destroyed all their copies of (HSMs storing?) firmware private keys for their windows phones

Ibly 🏳️‍⚧️

@Rairii @ShadowJonathan talk about going a step and beyond, that's really fucked up

Andrew May 24, 2023

@EeveeEuphoria @Rairii @ShadowJonathan imagine if some random ex employee discovers they have a copy of that key and now they're the only person in the world who can make custom ROMs for those phones, not even Microsoft can stop them

Rairii May 24, 2023

@andrewt @EeveeEuphoria @ShadowJonathan nah, MS knows proper key management in HSMs, etc, they have a whole department (Product Release and Security Services) for that kind of stuff

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@EeveeEuphoria @ShadowJonathan @Rairii Indeed there’s a benefit when corps push the limits of evil: it provokes corrective action. /cc @andrewt

Rairii May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan i just wonder what will happen to the Sentinel HASP protection dongles (yes, really!) that Nintendo decided to use as HSMs for 3DS (and DSi).

they went back to using Proper HSMs for switch, although some of those are AWS Cloud HSMs (they used AWS a *lot* for switch including S3 buckets containing all Switch games. I wonder how large their AWS bill is?)

Shawn K. Quinn May 25, 2023

@Rairii @ShadowJonathan sounds like a very Microsoft-like move. Wouldn't surprise me in the least if they would do something like that just to sabotage efforts to reuse the hardware.

miki May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan This is unrealistic for a couple reasons. Firstly, a product going out of support doesn’t mean that all the chips it contains are out of support too. Some of those chips (think eInk display controllers, WiFi/Bluetooth chips, GSM modems, DRM chips etc) almost always come from third-party companies. Those chips have their own firmware, and it wouldn’t be easy to legally define what exactly needs to be unlocked. The reality is that those third-party companies are, for better or for worse, extremely protective of their IP (and sometimes legally forbidden from unlocking their chips, due to radio regulations for example), so some of those companies would probably disallow selling their chips in the EU market. Secondly, the reason why a lot of devices go out of support is because the companies making them don't exist any more, and then there's nobody to release the update.

❄️May 24, 2023

@miki let me put it like this:

i dont care.

i dont care if they're going to "have trouble" complying to such a rule. fuck them.

hiding behind third-party chips is not an excuse.

when devices go out of production and are not supported anymore, they should be opened up, no matter how many exclusivity contracts the company has made, because that just gives them an out.

capitalism is not an excuse.

☃️karolherbst☃️May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan @miki the bigger argument here is, that companies won't move unless there is such regulation. They'll figure it out, because they want to stay in business and make big bucks.

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@karolherbst @miki @ShadowJonathan Agreed. But I have to say it really is a shame that consumers as a whole are not wise enough to drive this. If consumers prioritized ethics above stupid esoteric factors like how much storage a device has, consumers would move the market in a better direction. But we’re all screwed b/c consumers are pushovers.

miki May 25, 2023

@koherecoWatchdog @karolherbst @ShadowJonathan Maybe most consumers just have different priorities than you do. That doesn’t mean they’re stupid, they just don’t care about the thinks you personally want them to care about.

☃️karolherbst☃️May 25, 2023

@miki @koherecoWatchdog @ShadowJonathan which is totally fine, but that's why we _require_ regulation so that we organize certain things to minimize the damage we as consumers or humanity as a whole do.

Relying on "the market" for "things just getting perfect" is on the other hand stupid, same as "but the people don't care about this".

We should have politics so they explain why doing unpopular things in order to achieve higher goals is critical (like protecting our planet).

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@karolherbst @ShadowJonathan @miki Indeed. Countless consumers readily admit to not having self-control. I can’t tell you how many respond to “stop driving a car… #fuckCars” with “the oil/car industry should be regulated more… the gov should have designed my city better… it’s not on me to relocate to a cyclable city”, etc.

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@miki @ShadowJonathan @karolherbst It’s true that regs are needed to get climate under control & in fact it’s precisely because most consumers are greedy (like corps). They consume w/reckless disregard. Theoretically regs would not be necessary if consumers as a whole had a certain level of wisdom, discipline, and ethical integrity.

LisPi May 26, 2023

@koherecoWatchdog @karolherbst @ShadowJonathan @miki Tbh it doesn't help that there are like... 3 cities that are cycleable without it requiring being at least a bit suicidal in my country.

That bumps up the cost a lot (in other words the poor & precariat are fucked, we have very little public housing).

SFH zoning & #CarCentric development has been an unmitigated disaster.

If like me you can just work remotely then that's good, but otherwise you're mostly out of luck.

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@miki @ShadowJonathan @karolherbst I didn’t actually say consumers are stupid but I’ll say it now: we are surrounded by consumers making stupid decisions. Buying shavers & phones w/soldered in batteries, travel appliances w/non-linear PSUs, printers, coffee machines, etc, with total in-the-dark naïvety about the consumables. “oh shit, the cost of replacing my HP ink exceeds the cost per unit of human blood”.

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@karolherbst @ShadowJonathan @miki And yes, the masses have fucked up priorities on top of it. That was my point. “Nevermind the degrees of freedom in that license… nevermind that the supplier was caught swindling consumers with various dark patterns, tricks to sell you features that should be included, & snooping; but is the case shiny? Are the corners round?”

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@miki @ShadowJonathan @karolherbst It is precisely because of these dimwitted consumers that the market is flooded w/garbage that exploits consumers. Products are /designed/ to exploit consumer’s deficiencies; both their lack of wisdom & also their underdeveloped priorities.

LisPi May 26, 2023

@koherecoWatchdog @miki @ShadowJonathan @karolherbst What's the bit about PSUs?

censored for “transphobia”May 27, 2023

@lispi314 @karolherbst @ShadowJonathan @miki PSU→ power supply unit. There are shavers for example that include a PSU in the 110—240v range so you can use it anywhere in the world. These are also more energy efficient b/c they do not get warm & use power even when the device doesn’t need it. Then there are vampire bricks (transformers), which only work on the voltage of the region. I think some jurisdictions ban them.

censored for “transphobia”May 27, 2023

@miki @ShadowJonathan @karolherbst @lispi314 Some ppl call transformers “vampires” b/c they constantly suck power like a parasite. Some ppl call them “bricks” or “wall warts” b/c they are often bulky, heavy, and ugly. So I call them “#vampireBricks” to bring in all the concepts.

LisPi May 27, 2023

@koherecoWatchdog @miki @ShadowJonathan @karolherbst I see. The linear vs non-linear terminology is what I am somewhat unfamiliar with.

Is it what causes wall-warts to constantly consume power the way they do?

censored for “transphobia”May 27, 2023

@lispi314 @karolherbst @ShadowJonathan @miki I just realized I inverted the term “linear” in my original mention of it. Linear is normally what you do not want, but it does have some advantages¹ over “switching” PSUs (e.g. the power output is cleaner thus easier on sensitive appliances). ① https://www.actpower.com/educational/linear-vs-switching-power-supplies/

Linear vs Switching Power Supplies - Advanced Conversion Technology

What is a Linear Power Supply? Linear power supplies are designed for low noise and are often considered quiet since there is no high-frequency switching. They are used anywhere that excellent regulation and/or low ripple is required as well as needing low electromagnetic emissions and excellent transient response. Linear power supplies can only step down […]

Advanced Conversion Technology

censored for “transphobia”May 27, 2023

@lispi314 I have some linear PSUs from the days when I was naïve about them, as well as some due to sellers neglecting to disclose that. So I typically plug them into a power strip or extension cord with a switch so I’m not wasting power when the appliance is off. Otherwise there is a coil of wire inside that gets warm due to induction.

censored for “transphobia”May 27, 2023

I probably shouldn’t have mentioned wall warts, because I think some people consider /all/ AC→DC adapters to be wall warts regardless of size. But at least all linear PSUs are indisputably wall warts that leech power.

censored for “transphobia”May 25, 2023

@ShadowJonathan @miki Bingo. The protectionist path was taken for max profit. If protectionism became more costly than being transparent from day one, that’s even better yet. It’s the ideal situation. If a supplier who only knows how to be protectionist opts out of the EU market, good riddance. It leaves a better market that makes room for better suppliers. /cc @karolherbst

Aknorals⚑Ⓐ 🏴May 26, 2023

@ShadowJonathan @miki
Shit like what Nintendo did is why I think violent /destructive anti-IP action is morally justified.
They use their position of power to take away agency from users, /precisely because/ they won't be able to make any money from that device?

That should be a dangerous move on their part.

☃️karolherbst☃️May 24, 2023

@miki @ShadowJonathan the EU market is big enough that if they disallow selling in the EU they can also just close their business.

@ShadowJonathan You should sign this open letter to the EU. They want exactly this but not by waiting until EOL.
https://fsfe.org/activities/upcyclingandroid/openletter.en.html

Open letter for the right to install any software on any device - FSFE

Free Software Foundation Europe is a charity that empowers users to control technology. We enable people to use, understand, adapt, and share software.

FSFE - Free Software Foundation Europe

❄️May 24, 2023

@Reina signed it

CoolBlenderKitten May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan
Yes!

༒ ɐɥɔǝʇɐɯ ʍǝɹpuɐ ༒May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan 100% agree with everything you’ve written here and elsewhere in the thread. forced obsolescence should be illegal worldwide. as usual, individuals’ rights are not respected when it comes to industry and “the economy”.

Nafeon the Bear May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan I like this. My boyfriends smartphone has android8 and is now end of life for most apps, but it works very well.

arkywarky Jun 3, 2023

@ShadowJonathan @NafiTheBear sorry to be that guy, but y’all should look into lineage OS or something, it’s really not safe to have a phone with that old of an OS

Nafeon the Bear Jun 3, 2023

@arcade @ShadowJonathan I'm usually all down with that, but this smartphone bricks, if you try to unlock it. so again there should really be a law, that you can actually unlock it first.

arkywarky Jun 3, 2023

@NafiTheBear oh damn that sucks @ShadowJonathan

Clayton May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan Good, it should make you (and everyone) angry!

Now here's a shameless plug for #postmarketOS 😄

JamesAkers May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan This would be wonderful! Right to Repair folks are routinely calling for companies to reveal their blueprints and schematics. It's almost like an editing of design copyright? Like after 8 years phone and appliances go public? You could sell companies on that by quicker refresh cycles on their planned obsolescence- it's good for them in the short term.

anniethebruce May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan At the very least a bar on enforcing lockdowns on it.

@ShadowJonathan that would be so fricking cool

Seiðr May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan It is absolutely spiteful and wasteful on the part of the corps, specially if one compares to patent law and the maximum of 20 years, but this is fucking the customers, the common public, and the environment with a scorched earth policy that will provide them negligible profit if any at all.

FreddyB Aviation Photography May 24, 2023

@ShadowJonathan Wow this should be a world wide adoption actually

DJDarren May 25, 2023

@ShadowJonathan I would *love* to see this become a thing. Imagine how much more life you could squeeze out of a phone if we could install a lightweight Linux-based OS on it once it stops receiving official support.

WiredBun May 26, 2023

@DJDarren @ShadowJonathan hell imagine getting a freedos based os onto something like a tablet, definitely alot of potential but unlikely we'll see the day

WiredBun May 26, 2023

@ShadowJonathan
omg i have been thinking about this so much the last few years, mainly in the context of game consoles. like how is a company like sony and microsoft going to stop supporting a piece of hardware and not even offer a real modern alternative to that hardware but then get pissy when dedicated modders make your obsolete trash usable again.
its should work like the patent system where companies get a set time to profit and then its turned over to the public domain

@ShadowJonathan +9001%

I think that the #EU and all the other big governments should #outlaw #PlannedObsolescence & #ReducedLifecycle as the #EnvoirmentalCrime|s they are and also strip #Abandonware of any #IP rights protections like #DRM...

Also any infringement on #ConsumerRights is bad, including shit like "locking down firmware" to "enforce spectrum compliance" or whatever bullshit figleaf they make up...

@ShadowJonathan

Worse are only #AntiRepair designs like #GluedIn - #Batteries [or #DRM in #Batteries!], #SolderedDown #RAM and espechally #SolderedIn-#SSDs.

Both batteries and SSDs will INEVITABLY FAIL OVER TIME!!!

This is why I refuse to buy products that don't allow me to fully replace RAM & Storage and don't allow me toolfree removal and swapping of batteries!