Sorry, but you can't convince me that the test of a reusable rocket system is supposed to involve destroying the launch siteโ€”which was reusable on every prior generation of space flight technologyโ€”and launching debris thousands of feet away.

#SpaceX is not a serious company, it's a clown show, and it should not have a single dollar in government funding, much less billions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ViAb3vYIh_8

The Damage To Stage 0 After Starshipโ€™s First Launch

YouTube
@maxkennerly
The worst part, to me, is its siphoning of funds from actual governmental groups such as NASA, a drain which is crippling the future of space travel and exploration in pursuit of wacky, pie-in-the-sky ideas. That's billions of dollars that could, for example, go into the teaching of STEM, but which has instead been earmarked for people who are already billionaires and want to play a round or two of real-life Kerbal on everyone else's quarter.
@theogrin @maxkennerly Musk is a horrible human being, but SpaceX is *cheaper* than any other launch provider NASA uses. And if the Starship system works (a big if), it will offer huge increases in space travel and exploration capabilities at even lower cost.
@michaelgemar @theogrin @maxkennerly
The belief that private companies will provide vital public services "cheaper" than the government has been quite the successful disinformation campaign from corporations for sure.

@GreenFire @michaelgemar @theogrin @maxkennerly

I just read a study report on that.
It only seems to have been true for the telecommunications industry.

@HistoPol @GreenFire @michaelgemar @maxkennerly

Only to a certain extent, at that. We're in the midst of a group of cases in the US and Canada where there is typically only one telecom for internet and phone in a given area, due to an elaborate strategy of noncompetition, which allows prices to be set at a whim. I have my doubts that my landline, for example, something which I need, is worth $70/month, but that's how much I have to pay for it.

@theogrin

I agree with you on this. However, at any time when there is no competition, the rules of the market cannot apply.

USD 70 is outrageously high and seems to be the drawback of living in a remote area.

I see this as an outlier problem, from a market perspective. This is highly unusual for most consumers, I'd say.

IDK, what are the costs of a satellite phone in your region?

@GreenFire @michaelgemar @maxkennerly

@HistoPol @GreenFire @michaelgemar @maxkennerly

I live smack-dab in the middle of a university city in south-central Ontario, Canada -- not exactly the boondocks. And this is from Bell, who used to be the name in US/Canada telecoms. And we're fortunate - in some areas like St. Catherines and the Niagara region in general, Cogeco has a stranglehold on the market. We get to choose between Bell and Rogers here.

Basic cell phone? Local calls, no data, a handful of texts? $40/mo.

@theogrin @GreenFire @michaelgemar @maxkennerly

Huh, then this duopoly sounds like a severe issue of failed anti-trust legislation/enforcement.
That is awful.
Sorry to hear that.

@HistoPol

It's just how things are, we drink our tea (or coffee, as many prefer) and muddle through. When the majority of politicians are beholden to corporate interests, they have little incentive to pass or uphold any antitrust legislation, and one of the bitter political realities is that those two companies have such a hold that they can - in deed if not name - exact reprisals over any politicians who don't fall in line.

@theogrin

IDK much about #Canada, is there something like the #CitizensUnitedVsFEC #SCOTUS ruling that lets corporations and billionaires virtually "buy" politicians, like in the #US?

@HistoPol
Hate to say it, but Citizens United only codified into law what was already extant, just sequestered. That being said, political financing is on the surface heavily regulated in Canada.

Which is why the media outlets buy hockey stadiums, arenas and other sports outlets instead, for example.

@theogrin

The #CitizensUnited decision was only possible because there aren't campaign-financing laws with sufficient teeth in place in the #US, which is why I had been (in vain, of course) pushing for "reversely codify" Citizens United.

I am glad to hear that at least the regulatory framework is better in #canada.

It feels difficult to believe (I do not doubt you, though) that a mere sports arena (etc.)...

@theogrin

...would sway a politician's opinion. I know Canadians love ice hockey, but supporting a candidate merely because he enables a new arena but has all the "wrong policies"?

@HistoPol
Okay, I'll admit, I was being snide more than anything with regards to that. Even if we do get the occasional hockey riot.

More notably, Doug Ford, the provincial MP and big name in the Conservative Party of Canada, has recently opened plans for the Greenbelt, a previously limited area of land, to be developed as urban sprawl. His ties to various developers provides an excellent illustration of the corruption in play on various levels, even if not a direct campaign finance issue.

@theogrin

What is "snide"?

I have stumbled about #DoughFord several times over the past weeks. I do need to read up on him some time.
I think I remember something about a shady investment firm, too.

Examples like these show that my middle-school history teacher was absolutely right: the noblest right and obligation of a citizen is to vote in an election. Every time.

I think e.g. English people have learned this lesson with #Brexit the very hard way.

Elections are always not what you want..

@theogrin

...but the alternative outcome can be so much worse.

That said, I am so glad that the Dems did not get clobbered in the last midterms, as the ruling party usually is. :)

@HistoPol
Mostly I just don't do sportsball or icepuck, so I was doing the snooty, 'Canadians and our sports' thing. Just for fun, mind!

Doug and his brother, Rob, now long gone, were responsible for some of the most ridiculous and self-serving policy and funding decisions in Toronto. The entire family practically oozes 'conflict of interest'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Ford_conflict_of_interest_trial

Rob Ford conflict of interest trial - Wikipedia

@theogrin

I see. So why does the majority vote for him?--I imagine you do not have "gerrymandering" or similar election-bias issues in #Toronto?

@HistoPol
Surprisingly, Ontario has a very large constituency which is Tory, especially in the classic low-pop areas where people tend to lean right, but also in the 'comfortable suburbs'. Visited Bruce and Owen Sound a year and a bit ago, and it gave me the screaming willies.

No doubt there are other factors in play, though. Municipal voter turnout in Toronto was a mere 29% last year. Here in Kitchener, it was 20%. Makes me ashamed, TBH.

@theogrin

"'Let He Who Is Without Sin Cast the First Stone" - usually don't use bible quotes, but I feel the (objective) urge to say: yes, that is shameful.

I don't want to deep-dive. The nxt logical question is, though, why people either a) do not care or b) have the feeling that their vote doesn't matter anyway...