Mastodawn

Technology Connections

One thing I'm noticing here on Mastodon (mostly through observing experience of others, to be fair) is that there seems to be a point at which catering to people with, let's call it, overly-particular needs seems to embolden those people to foist those needs onto others and it devolves into a mess of opinions real fast.

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

One of the reasons Trader Joe's is successful is that they limit choices.

Do you really need to have two dozen varieties of peanut butter? Probably not. So they just stock a few. Gets people in-and-out very quickly, makes the stores smaller, and it's a very enjoyable experience for many despite being objectively quite limited.

Choice-overload is a real thing, and I think those steering this ship need to sit with that for a while.

EddiKat Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify There is actually a term for choice overload. Look into the "paradox of choice." Its fascinating stuff.

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@EddiKat I'm using Trader Joe's as an example of this as it's a well-known case study of this very phenomenon! It is legitimately a huge part of their success.

I could also compare Linux/Windows/MacOS in a similar vein but I won't because dear god

EddiKat Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Probably for the best. Down that road exists only pain.

@EddiKat @TechConnectify

...and FREEEEDOOOOOOOMMMM!!!

(Largely self-caricaturing, but hey ;)

NoHomers Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify @EddiKat Trader Joe's only works because you trust their brand will be high quality. If there was no choice and it was low quality it would have failed by now. So I'd say it's both limited choices but the ones there are are quality.

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@NoHomers @EddiKat that's very true! And the same would happen for a store that offered many many choices, but none were of good quality.

As with many things in life, it's about striking the right balance.

Right now, I'm not sure Mastodon/fedi more broadly has got it.

Laux Myth (aka Martin)Apr 25, 2023

@EddiKat @TechConnectify Also seen with Costco. Another element of this is called internal competition. If you have 12 brands of cereal and a customer buys one, they did not buy all the others taking up space.

Chris Apr 25, 2023

@EddiKat @TechConnectify it’s even alternatively called “supermarket syndrome.”

minecraftchest1 Apr 26, 2023

@EddiKat
Analysis peralazysis.
@TechConnectify

it's B! Cavello 🐝Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Costco, famously, as well

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@b_cavello Well, except their stores aren't exactly well-known for being small and easy-to-navigate :)

it's B! Cavello 🐝Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify ahh, good point. (I actually tend to find the layout of Trader Joe’s confusing, but maybe if I went more frequently, that wouldn’t be the case 😅)

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@b_cavello They definitely vary from location-to-location quite a bit, but once you go to the same one a few times I think you get a good sense of where everything is.

You can basically cover my store's entire footprint with five aisle-laps, but it's an older and small location.

RebekahWSD Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I know this is about choices, but all I can think of is "Man I want a Trader Joes near me, I once had one of these little pizzas with feta cheese and olives on it from there, and I am sad about them now"

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@RebekahWSD I fucking love TJ's and proximity to one was a significant factor in my house hunting

RebekahWSD Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify There are some within the state, but none nearby, and the closest suffers from their parking lot problems.

One day. Maybe one day they'll move into the abandoned deli we use to have on our street, and I can once again walk to groceries instead of having to drive!

Chris AD Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify The people steering the ship set it up to cater to the groups traditionally ignored by traditional social media, including the disabled and the neurodivergent.

Paul McGrane Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Do you ever visit grocery stores that have *only* the house brand? Aldi in USA is what I'm thinking of, but maybe Whole Foods is a bit like that too.

The choices are simpler, but the brand I am used to is surely not there.

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@pmcg Trader Joe's is basically that! I rarely shop at Aldi but I'm never one to be brand loyal.

I will happily buy the generic version of almost any product (I only have a few exceptions), and TJ's has a ton of variety when it comes to frozen foods.

But when you drill down to one specific food item, particularly commodity products like flour, sugar, butter, they'll have just a few choices. And gosh does it make shopping easy.

Paul McGrane Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I have only been to those stores a few times but I reckon I could get used to it. I don't quite follow your analogy toward Mastodon, but it is interesting to muse about it.

BaconDragon Apr 25, 2023

@pmcg @TechConnectify Fun Fact: Trader Joe's basically is the American Aldi. They are owned by the same Family foundation.

Paul McGrane Apr 27, 2023

@BaconDragon @TechConnectify There's two German companies called ALDI. And thus there are two in America. One is TJ and the other is called ALDI.

Jon Kunkee Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify @pmcg You've read the crazy history of Aldi and Trader Joe's, right?

MyMiloCat+MydogNoodles Apr 25, 2023

@jkunkee @TechConnectify @pmcg Indeed I was in Germany in 08 to assist my brother while he had surgery - there was an Aldi near the hospital that carried a few Trader Joe's branded items (California peanuts !) - also, in Germany, the brothers who owned Aldi had split the company between them - Aldi Nord/Aldi Sud.
That said, TJ's is the only place I know of that carries Saint Andre triple creme brie for less than an arm and a leg...

Jernej Simončič �Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify @pmcg Isn't Trader Joe owned by Aldi Nord (while Aldi in the US is Aldi Süd)?

Paul McGrane Apr 25, 2023

@jernej__s @TechConnectify I know for sure one is owned by one and the other by the other. It's hard to remember which is which.

Jersey Gryphon Apr 25, 2023

@pmcg @TechConnectify
It makes me laugh when you see those “I moved to Germany but why don’t shops have the same choice as the US” YouTube videos.
In Europe, the choice is often between the biggest of all (say) Cornflake brands and the stores own-brand one … beyond a certain point, choice leads to unhappiness.
Also, if I want good bread, I’m going to the boulangerie, not the warehouse.

Paul McGrane Apr 25, 2023

@jerseygryphon @TechConnectify that may be the case but not for me. I live near Raleigh and I believe the host lives sort of near Wisconsin.

ocdtrekkie Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Mastodon developers are definitely aware that like... picking a server is the biggest hard choice, and people are asked to make it way before they know what that choice means for them. I think the best case is to just get people on a server... any server... and then let them move elsewhere later if they want.

Michael Graham Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify That might be one of the reasons I like the "Little Dillons" near my house so much (besides the fact that it is near my house)

Mintz🍹🦌Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify That's why I pretty much only shop at Aldi's anymore.

Mintz🍹🦌Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify

Grrjessi Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I'm so stoked I'm moving to a place in walking distance after two years cold turkey. It's also the best place to shop while single

Drew Mochak Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Who gets to choose what brands get picked? What standards make that decision? Are they public? How do we know someone didn't get paid, using our purchasing power as the collateral?

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@objectinspace Virtually everything in Trader Joe's is a house-brand product.

Drew Mochak Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify INteresting--so they're the Kaiser Permanente of grocery stores?

Raven667 Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify @objectinspace there is a fun little subculture of people who try to work out who actually manufactures TJs house brand items. Sometimes you can tell by taste/texture/looks, or packaging or by comparing nutritional info. It's a little mystery

hörb Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify @objectinspace That's because they are actually Aldi behind the scenes, right? (just the other half of Aldi)

skoot Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify this is honestly one of my favorite things about shopping at Aldi lol

Alessandro Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify reminds me of Peter Griffin at the "Specific store" trying to buy nuts of an increasingly specific kind, ultimately finding out that they don't have any of the specific size. Then goes next door to the General store and "Do you sell stuff? - Yeah!"

Lexi Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Agreed. I was at Trader Joes today and had the exact same thing occur to me.

Don Whiteside Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify But that sort of thinking doesn’t let you play auctioneer with slotting fees. The very act of showing you too many options is a money maker.

Virtue signal 💉💉💉🇺🇸 🇺🇦Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify

TJ peanut butter is probably a bad example, at least if its organic. I must prefer the Stop & Shop organic pb because it doesn't have the oil slick.

Their dairy all seems to come from California and has like 1 week left on the Use By date.

jeffeb3 Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I thought trader Joe's was just trying to save cost, while marketing it as a benefit to customers.

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@jeffeb3 no, there are case studies on this very thing. It's a deliberate strategy, and profit per square foot of retail space is much higher for them than your average grocer.

A lot of people view shopping as a chore, and choice paralysis is one of the reasons. TJ's, perhaps partly by accident, discovered a great way to alleviate that. Not everyone likes their stores or products, but for those that do - it's a perfect match

Technology Connections Apr 25, 2023

@jeffeb3 just to give an example, if I have a list and stick to it, I can be in and out of TJ's in 5 minutes.

Even if I want to wander the store and look at all of their offerings, it takes perhaps 20 minutes. I don't know how you could spend a half hour at my local Trader Joe's.

That sort of turn around is great for them, and a lot of customers (including me) appreciate the speed.

Sadly, they are missing just a few staples so they can't be my only store...

Kazriko Apr 26, 2023

@TechConnectify @jeffeb3 I can do that in a traditional grocery store though, because my family has nailed down which product to buy first, which to buy second if that's out of stock, etc.

mictter Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify The most successful supermarket chain in Spain (Mercadona) is like that but taken to the extreme: they only carry their house brand except for very very few products (like Coca-Cola). Most people (me included) don't trust brand names, just want to buy their milk/toothpaste/whatever and get on with their lives.

Kazriko Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify There's only one variety of peanut butter among the 20 or so at the store that I enjoy that also has low sodium though. I suspect at Trader Joe's there would be 0. I don't know though, they aren't open anywhere near me.

Hypertalking Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify it also makes life much simpler and more pleasant for the people working in their stores. Easier to stock, easier to organise the stock, etc see Zeynep Ton’s brilliant research https://hbr.org/2017/01/how-4-retailers-became-best-places-to-work (also formed the inspiration for my frontline jobs startup, Breakroom.cc)

How 4 Retailers Became “Best Places to Work”

They realized culture matters as much as wages.

Harvard Business Review

Emily Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify amused by this thread! I actually disagree with your point but people are so enjoying talking about Trader Joe's that it would be churlish to go back to it.

Everton Favretto Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify you just reminded me of the pain that was choosing a washing machine a month ago

Rev. GothAlice Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify No, happiness and confidence is greatly improved by restricting choice. https://www.ted.com/talks/malcolm_gladwell_choice_happiness_and_spaghetti_sauce

Malcolm Gladwell: Choice, happiness and spaghetti sauce

TED

Old Ain't Dead Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify I agree. I often go there because walking a lot is hard for me and I can manage the size better.

Jeff Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify The success of Trader Joe’s doesn’t mean there isn’t a genuine need for those other stores. People have a variety of preferences and dietary requirements. I am fortunate that Keto fads mean that moderate-sized stores and chains like Giant Eagle carry low sugar-low carb options that are a better match for my T1D needs. Something seemingly as trivial as only 2 varieties of peanut butter, would probably mean I simply wouldn’t get to have convenient peanut butter. (1/3)

Jeff Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify With software a lot of the time it isn’t that there are a lot of options as much as those options are poorly organized or “too accessible” which leads to choice overload. It’s a lot easier to have an ever expanding junk drawer of checkboxes and drop downs than it is to separate out and present those which are useful to the majority vs those for the users who enjoy a very “selective” experience. Apple is very good about doing this without most people even noticing. (2/3)

HeppyCat Apr 25, 2023

@TechConnectify Opinions, on the internet?

Nihl L'Amas Apr 25, 2023

@heppycat @TechConnectify https://youtu.be/YozC8yFrZKI

Internet: On computers now

YouTube

Joshua Doll 🤷‍♂️Apr 25, 2023

@heppycat @TechConnectify my pops used to say opinions are 💩holes everyone has at least one.