JohannaK
Steve BTwo pictures that both show about 30 people getting a coffee.
We have to break #carculture
⁂ Fish Id Wardrobe@Steveb I'm willing to bet that the coffee shop in the first picture is too far from anything for people to walk to it.
We could start by not letting companies build like this. If you want X's coffee and you're out of town – get it delivered. At worst, that's three cars instead of thirty. (But it could be scooters or bikes.)
Elon Musk stick@fishidwardrobe @Steveb willing to bet it also makes shit coffee
@masterdon @Steveb well, maybe. But all those people in the queue were willing to pay for it, so, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@fishidwardrobe @Steveb the mystery of Starbucks. Glad I live in one of the few parts of the world never sullied by that sewerage in a cup
@masterdon @Steveb There's no mystery. Taste is subjective. Different people like different things, and what tastes great to you tastes crap to others and vice versa.
I'll give you that it's a lot to pay for what is mostly hot milk!
@fishidwardrobe @Steveb yeah, but Starbucks is shit coffee. That is a fact.
@masterdon @Steveb No, mate. That's just your subjective opinion. They may use cheap beans – that's a fact – but how it tastes is subjective. There are folks out there for which Starbucks is the exact taste they want. It's their best coffee. Everyone's taste buds are different; everyone wants something different.
There is no "right answer" here.
@fishidwardrobe @Steveb nah. Whoever started Starbucks should be hauled up before The Hague
Gareth Kitchen@masterdon @fishidwardrobe @Steveb I think it's their business model that's shit. Ultimately, they destroy communities by sucking out disposable income to overseas shareholders. Yet they pay no next to no tax to support the services needed by those communities. Their business model is parasitic by design.
@gruff @Steveb @fishidwardrobe yeah. And the coffee taste like rat semen that has been left in a hot car for a few days.
Alex@rtnVFRmedia Suffolk UK@gruff @masterdon @Steveb @fishidwardrobe its also an indictment on the current (American?) pace/way of life - if the drivers had the time/inclination to sit down and drink their coffee, there are ample parking spaces to deal with all the cars in that queue, without also causing the traffic jam outside...
Steve Hill 🏴🇪🇺@fishidwardrobe @Steveb I wouldn't wait in a queue like that myself, but if you ban out of town coffee shops, how would you get a coffee when en-route between one out of town location and another? Not everyone lives and works in a town, and those who do don't necessarily live and work in the same town.
plepe@fishidwardrobe @Steveb
I would think, that distance isn't so much of an issue. This place is totally designed for cars. There are no sidewalks at all, and even if there were, it would not be pleasant on a stroad like this.
I'm surprised that everybody uses the Drive-In. Wouldn't it be faster to park the car and go in?
Wouldn't it even be more pleasant to sit down at a table? I mean - time shouldn't be an issue, as waiting in queue takes time too ...
I would think, that distance isn't so much of an issue. This place is totally designed for cars. There are no sidewalks at all, and even if there were, it would not be pleasant on a stroad like this.
I'm surprised that everybody uses the Drive-In. Wouldn't it be faster to park the car and go in?
Wouldn't it even be more pleasant to sit down at a table? I mean - time shouldn't be an issue, as waiting in queue takes time too ...
Rickd6@Steveb the fifteen minute city at the bottom vs the 50 mile one at the top.
@Rickd6 to be honest. I suspect those in the que would still use a car to visit a cafe in a 15min city. I don’t believe this is about people having to drive to get the coffee/snack/whatever. It’s about a preference to take the car no-matter-what.
dragonfrog
Aaron In Minnesota@dragonfrog @Steveb @Rickd6 I want to believe it's not a preference, but a close to home anecdote leaves me unsure. A few years ago a new walk / bike path on my street was put in that came along with a new shared mailbox instead of individual boxes at the end of each driveway. All my neighbors use their cars pretty consistently to pick up their mail & often drive on the bike path in the process.
Walking is an easy, obvious, and safe option they avoid
Sensible Crone@Steveb @Rickd6 lol! Not if there were zero chance of parking said car. Less available parking is how you get a more walkable community, as distances get shorter when you don't have large parking lots surrounding destinations. That top coffee shop is designed for cars, and no one would choose to walk to it, even from the next business over. Dangerous and unpleasant walk. Check out the trees in Paris. Makes you want to walk.
@Steveb @Rickd6 I know of which I speak... I lived less than 10 minutes walk from this cafe for a time, and didn't go to it much because there were closer cafes! I could also get to the cafe in the Louvre in less than 15 minutes, if I didn't pause too long on Pont des Arts. Shabby day in Paris, get thee to the Louvre cafe. Be a member, and there is a secret entrance, no lines. It is always sunny in the Pyramide.
rapaz@Steveb @Rickd6 they would not, even if they wanted to, because there's no space for cars in walkable cities. not enough parking space and not even enough *road* space; people choose to walk/public transit/cycling because they get tired of being stuck in traffic and then not finding anywhere to park
@kageRapaz @Steveb so we invent self driving cars that keep going around the block until we get back into them. LOL
Kevin B@Steveb <shrute> False, the top is waiting for coffee, the bottom is drinking coffee.</>
Steven Barnhart@StevenBarnhart @Steveb Several differences:
- no gas-burning vehicles idling just to get coffee
- not taking up an acre of land, and a public road, just for a drive-through
- if there's a waiter, there's no line at all
- no gas-burning vehicles idling just to get coffee
- not taking up an acre of land, and a public road, just for a drive-through
- if there's a waiter, there's no line at all
@StevenBarnhart @Steveb Look at the picture again, troll, and tell me how many don't burn gas and how many spilled onto the street.
Susan, Abbey and Finnegan@Steveb we loved the culture in Paris and other European countries. Everyone walks, visits and eats outside. It was so healthy and fun.
@susan77 sane in Spain. I live part-time in a small village in the south, you can’t even get cars into most of it. Few own cars, everyone walks to the cafes. Different way of life there to the UK and US.
@Steveb and Canada. Except for a few areas, our sidewalks are empty, certainly all winter.
frasier@StevenBarnhart @susan77 @Steveb
every morning people walk up to the coffee shop across the street (spain) and pick up a cup for work - no cars involved - there is actually a walk-up window for takeaways
every morning people walk up to the coffee shop across the street (spain) and pick up a cup for work - no cars involved - there is actually a walk-up window for takeaways
sabik@StevenBarnhart @noonan @susan77 @Steveb
Yeah, that's a policy choice, championed largely by people who sell cars and gas and tires
Yeah, that's a policy choice, championed largely by people who sell cars and gas and tires
@StevenBarnhart @susan77 @Steveb
it is not "privilege" - it's the result of policy choices - the people stopping by for coffee do not necessarily live close by, there are reliable busses and a metro, also the result of policy choices
when we lived in the u.s. my wife & i both had cars & needed them- now neither of us have one
@StevenBarnhart @susan77 @Steveb
so you're limiting you observations to the u.s? -
not acknowledging that the situation is the result of policy choices is one way to insure a lack of change
so you're limiting you observations to the u.s? -
not acknowledging that the situation is the result of policy choices is one way to insure a lack of change
DanS@Steveb It strikes me that the Slow Food movement is working on this same puzzle from a different angle.
Miragee@Steveb Perhaps it is because I live ten miles from the nearest Starbucks, but I cannot imagine driving to the coffee shop, waiting in line with my engine idling, when gas is over $4.00/gal. A French Press can be picked up at a Thrift Store for $4.98. Freshly ground French Roast in a French Press makes great coffee.☕️
Tim Staines@Steveb I don’t disagree with your point, generally, but there’s a 99% chance that the cars pic was taken during peak covid, when that was the only option. In normal times at least half of that line will choose to park in a spot and walk inside…still driving of course.
Threadbane@Threadbane @Steveb oh come on. Disabled parents exist.
This toot is directed at what seems to be a bot, @EJJames, but still...obviously, there'd be allowances made for the handicapped, but the women (never men) I see dropping off and picking up their kids are driving the biggest SUVs available (one woman, one kid per vehicle) waiting in line with the school buses, making people late for work gumming up the traffic flow.
The school buses are equipped with mechanical wheel chair lifters around here, BTW.
@Threadbane @Steveb hi I’m not a bot, I just don’t post very often. I am a teacher and a parent, and would love to see more walkable schools. The parents are not the root of the problem. Our urban planning (or lack thereof) is. And FWIW my daughter walks to school.
@EJJames @Steveb
Happy to hear it! 8^)
At this local school, it's the parents' fault. Handicapped accessible buses go door to door. This practice of transporting children to and from school individually, one per SUV, long precedes covid. Riding to school alone robs kids of an opportunity to interact with other kids without adult supervision and develop social skills. I'd have HATED to ride to school with my mother!
Sorry, but with only three posts, and no personal info, you looked bottish!
Happy to hear it! 8^)
At this local school, it's the parents' fault. Handicapped accessible buses go door to door. This practice of transporting children to and from school individually, one per SUV, long precedes covid. Riding to school alone robs kids of an opportunity to interact with other kids without adult supervision and develop social skills. I'd have HATED to ride to school with my mother!
Sorry, but with only three posts, and no personal info, you looked bottish!
dyanam0
JR Buckley 🏳️🌈⚛️@Steveb The people in the bottom half look like they're have much more fun.
contranym@megaslippers thot u mite like thissern
Notiondump@Steveb Dieser DriveIn Fetisch wird mir wohl immer verborgen bleiben: Wie kommt man auf die Idee sich mit seinem Auto irgendwo freiwillig anzustellen nur um bloß keinen Schritt zu Fuß gehen zu müssen... #einRätsel
Da Scritch@Steveb there is no bike on ghe second picture. People came by walking or public transportation
Eva Chanda@dascritch @Steveb You don't know that. Bikes may be parked out of view.
British Tech Guru@Steveb I have to drive to get lunch. I get an hour give or take most days. If I drive, I'm there within 5 - 10 minutes. If I walked... it'd take 20 minutes each way. Not worth my time.
@Steveb I know which one I'd choose: the café in Paris!! But I'm not sure which one most Americans would pick…
k cavaliere@Steveb I live in the mountains. Please feel free to bike up and down the mountain roads. At night. With wildlife. We didn't blast out the mountains for our convenience. We go around, up and down them. What flat-land there is was farms. Some still exist. Fair trade, really. We have waterfalls, creeks, streams, rivers and lakes everywhere. We rarely flood.
Yes, the single occupant, decorative, giant truck/SUV problem is real.
James@Steveb Is that car culture or is that just people with no respect for coffee?