leftbotFeb 9, 2023
Nick Craver

People tell me they're afraid of AI and computers taking over the world but if it helps: I'm really not.

For the last few decades since Terminator came out, we've been hard at work building in a dead man's switch to every major system on Earth to prevent this from happening. I guarantee you that if computers try to take over the world, somewhere, within a month, a certificate for some critical dependency no one ever considered will expire and take all the machines out at once. We've done a few dozen trial runs of this to make sure the system works. 100% success rate so far.

Feb 6, 2023 at 8:36pmWeb
Show threadNick CraverFeb 6, 2023
The real trick here is to hide all of this from the machines. We do this by not knowing where these certificates are or when they'll explode ourselves. Since even we don't know and I absolutely promise you they're not documented, it's very unlikely the machines will find them all in time.
Show threadsquillaceFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver will the machines assume it's DNS?
Show threadNick CraverFeb 6, 2023
@squillace That's the beauty of it, with DNS we get 2 chances with DNS and CAA!
Show threadsquillaceFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver fiendishly clever.
Show threadMary BranscombeFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver @squillace multiple spiderman meme with little BGP flaps drawn on every pointing finger
Show threadEn3pY - Sebastian ZdrojewskiFeb 10, 2023
@marypcbuk @Nick_Craver @squillace don't forget DHCP. He's in the trio too.
Show threadMary BranscombeFeb 13, 2023
@en3py @Nick_Craver @squillace DHCPosse
Show threadINPCFeb 6, 2023

@Nick_Craver

But now the robots know about this.

We WERE OK until this post...  

Show threadMarcin CieślakFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver I always knew that someone who invented notAfter field in #X509 certificates was a genius
Show threadTim NolteFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver but the machines will go back in time to find out. 😉
Show threadcat anthropologist 🏳️‍⚧️Feb 9, 2023
@tim they would just go back to a time when we don't know
Show threadleah & tigers & bears, oh my!Feb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver of course, as soon as the machines figure out mutual trust networks we're all fucked
Show threadNoah SussmanFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver lolsob
Show threadDebabrata Bhattacharya || SEFeb 10, 2023
@Nick_Craver I have full faith now that humanity will be able to stave off the rise of the machines forever.
Show threadHerbert der güldeneFeb 11, 2023
@Nick_Craver yeah, nice trick and all but i'm sure they scraped enough stackoverflow advice disabling certificate check and unsecure true to "make stuff work" by now ;)
Show threadBentok Feb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver Left-pad protocol.
Show threadDuncanWatsonFeb 7, 2023
@bentok always nice to see a scholar
Show threadWade RobertsFeb 6, 2023

@Nick_Craver Artificial Intelligence can only be considered a threat when it interacts with another instance of intelligence.

This planet is safe.

Show threadKen Hollis - GandalfDDIFeb 7, 2023
@waderoberts @Nick_Craver My thoughts exactly. I await my AI overlords. They certainly can't do a WORSE job than humans have already done. 😂 😅 🤔
Show threadSebastianFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver Yeah, but isn't the problem with a dead man's switch that it only reacts when the man is dead? 😅
Show threadNick CraverFeb 6, 2023
@SebZwo Yeah but we'll have mutually assured expiration.
Show threadSebastianFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver Well, that's reassuring... I guess...
Show threadRagnell the Mildly UnpleasantFeb 6, 2023
@Nick_Craver A pair of jarheads fooled an AI detection system by hiding under a cardboard box and walking up to it. I'm not afraid of AI taking over the world.
Show threadTodd SmithFeb 7, 2023

@Nick_Craver Obligatory XKCD:

https://xkcd.com/2347/

Dependency

xkcd
Show threadTodd SmithFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver ...and now that I think about it, I'd like to thank that Random Nebraska Person for all their efforts. 😊
Show threadsabikFeb 10, 2023

@todd_smith
@Nick_Craver
Random Nebraska Person got Long COVID

(with apologies to Hemingway)

Show threadUrsaFeb 7, 2023

@todd_smith @Nick_Craver

And don't forget the "what-if" he did about a similar scenario:

https://what-if.xkcd.com/5/

Robot Apocalypse

Show threadzeroFeb 13, 2023
@todd_smith @Nick_Craver Uh, I thought of this one: https://xkcd.com/865/
Nanobots

xkcd
Show threadСаша Морс, here we go again...Feb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver don't believe this for a microsecond. Cool if the most careful institutions have done this, but I don't believe that either.
Show threadNick CraverFeb 7, 2023
@alexmorse everyone’s doing this.
Show threadСаша Морс, here we go again...Feb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver you can't be that naive
Show threadNick CraverFeb 7, 2023
@alexmorse I’m guessing you missed the joke?
Show threadСаша Морс, here we go again...Feb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver did i
Show threadGreg ParkerFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver You underestimate the ability of future collaborators to remove these mechanisms. Remember the wise developers of the 1970s and 1980s, who added failsafes that would shut down systems on January 1st, 2000, before they could get too powerful. Remember the propaganda by Big Tech that these were all "Y2K bugs" that needed to be "fixed" at great expense.
Show threadProtikFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver Highly recommend A Thousand Brains by Jeff Hawkins on the topic.
Show threadJonny HibberdFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver In my mind you're delivering this speech in a marble floored glass hall during the first 15 minutes of the movie.
Show threadMythic BeastsFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver thanks to Let's Encrypt and 3mo certificates if you turn off their certificate granting server you can stop everything inside 90 days.
Show threadSteve Hill 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿🇪🇺Feb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver if we engineer our systems to require the nuclear launch codes to be printed out, we're guaranteed to be safe. I've not found a computer yet that can successfully print stuff without lots of manual fettling.
Show threadGiles GoatFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver
They should not be worried about the AI itself, they shoud MORE worried about the use ( and misuse or bad-use ) humans will do of it !!!
Show threadPetrichor ᚄᚔᚅᚐᚁᚆᚃᚒᚔᚂFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver Might I remind you that it's a not uncommon practice for drivers to put a brick on the dead man's switch to hold it down?
Show threadmsgbiFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver joke @charles_ex @aloa5 bard
Show threadColin RobsonFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver
Line 666: //TODO: Complete CertificateExpiry method in next sprint iteration
Show threadProgGrrlFeb 7, 2023

@Nick_Craver @jalcine

🙌

I want to believe

Show threadStephen MastersFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver @boffbowsh Either that or it all goes pear-shaped on some random Patch Tuesday…
Show threadAral BalkanFeb 7, 2023

@Nick_Craver The problem isn’t AI and computers taking over the world. The problem is trillion-dollar corporations with AI and computers taking over the world.

#capitalism #digitalImperialism #colonialism #siliconValley #BigTech #ai #machineLearning #corporatocracy

Show threadSue Loh, local optimistFeb 11, 2023
@aral @Nick_Craver
*sob* it's true.
Show threadaml_blastFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver this is a joke about the pain of software development disguised as a statement about ai? i am not sure, poe's law confounds interpretation
Show threadTravis Newton 👨‍💻Feb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver It’s going to be a DNS outage or a bad route propagation through BGP. To err is to computer, but to really screw it up requires a human.
Show threadJason LevineFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver This is brilliant.
Show threadthegaryhawkinsFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver You make it sound like those failsafes have been purposefully designed in, and that most of our critical infrastructure isn't a series of lowest-cost-bidder botch jobs held together with faith and sticky tape. Still, the net effect is much the same so yay for mediocrity and ignorance!
Show threadMark HalvorsonFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver I’m scared enough of limited AI replacing all white collar work that I don’t have time to worry about skynet. It’s not like the tech companies are going to cough up taxes to help care for the millions of people out of work.
Show threadLizardFeb 7, 2023

@someMAHoo @Nick_Craver Of course, this leads to the problem I always have with generic cyberpunk: If everyone's living in grinding poverty eating artificial algae supplements, who are all these world-girdling megacorporations SELLING TO? It doesn't do much good to have a bank of 10,000 AI "authors" producing a thousand "original" books a day if no one can buy even one DRM-locked, "happy ending is premium content, downer ending included free" copy.

Hmmm... different outcomes as literary DLC... I may have just invented a new business model. Oh, bother.

Show threadMark HalvorsonFeb 7, 2023
@LizardSF @Nick_Craver that certainly makes sense to me, but it likely doesn’t worry the ultra-wealthy. They don’t worry themselves about the pain inflicted. And they’ll will find ways to make money without making products as they seem to now. There will always be some risky investment or trading vehicle that allows them to keep their money liquid. Besides, once they’re rich they can fly off to their bunkers in NZ and sip Chardonnay while the world burns.
Show threadLizardFeb 7, 2023

@someMAHoo @Nick_Craver People (well, the "investor" class of people) always forget that "value" requires some actual person to desire a thing for *itself*, not to resell it. The "housing bubble" was due in part to forgetting a house is valued becase people want a place to *live*, and if no one can afford it, you can't sell it. (Selling it to an "investor", who plans to sell it to another "investor", is based on the hope you're not the Greater Fool, and eventually, you will be.)

And the problem with hiding in bunkers is, sooner or later, you have to open the hatch. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O68DedIacWM

Leslie Fish - Hello! Remember Us? [HQ]

YouTube
Show threadMark HalvorsonFeb 7, 2023
@LizardSF @Nick_Craver I know, right?! But these are the people who actively destroying the world they live on for short-term profit. I don’t see any reason they’d start thinking in the long-term for the benefit of others.
Show threadLizardFeb 7, 2023

@Nick_Craver If "Terminator 2" were realistic, when Ahr-nuld rebooted, he would have had to spend several hours resetting his preferences, clicking "OK", re-registering all his internal programs, and downloading petabytes of patches (from the future!) due to all the updates made since his original code was installed.

(One reason I've put off upgrading my PC for ~4 years is the dread of spending a week getting a new one functional and needing to keep everything on my old PC around somewhere because there's a ton of tools and utilities I downloaded at some point whose original websites are now links to Russian malware spam and it can take months or years before I remember "Oh, I need that Java desktop hex map program to read this file that has all the map data on that one world for that book I wrote".)

Show threadLizardFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver There was British sci-fi comedy whose name I forget (NOT Red Dwarf) where they did the "Oh, the ship's computer has a virus, we'll just restore from backup!" plot, and then, when the Captain needed to shoot the kill-o-zap rifle at the alien monster, he got "Welcome to your new Kill-O-Zap rifle! Before we begin, do you agree to the following terms and conditions? (long list) OK, now we need to set up your user account..." (as the slavering alien menace keeps getting closer).
Show threadLizardFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver Dear several people in the replies. Please consider investing in one of these. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZ73Q4DwrGM
The Simpsons - Sarcasm detector

YouTube
Show threadSzeFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver and if that fails we can always kick up some open-source licensing disputes, works every time
Show threadNick M5NCWFeb 7, 2023
@Nick_Craver It was DNS^H^H^H certificates expiring 😃