vkc // Veronica Explains

Me, 20 years ago: "I don't need tabbed browsing. One window per site is fine and dandy."

Me, 10 years ago: "I can run 40 tabs at once, look at how productive I am!"

Me, at present: "I don't need tabbed browsing. One window per site is fine and dandy."

Dec 6, 2022 at 3:55pmWeb
Show threadvkc // Veronica ExplainsDec 6, 2022

Me, 20 years ago: "HTML is fine, with some light CSS. I don't need a bunch of JavaScript."

Me, 10 years ago: "Look at all the jQuery I pumped in this page! It's so sparkly! And Bootstrap makes it look great everywhere!"

Me, at present: "HTML is fine, with some light CSS. I don't need a bunch of JavaScript."

Show threadboojitDec 6, 2022

@vkc yes exactly. I'm making my own little blog CMS and it is just literally taking markdown files off of the file system an throwing a little simplecss at it.

https://simplecss.org/

EDIT: mardown/markdown (oh NOW you kick in autocorrect... WTH?)

Simple.css Framework

A CSS framework that makes semantic HTML look good.

Simple.css
Show threadGreg BrooksDec 6, 2022
@vkc Yas. https://brutaldon.org Web1.0 is fine :D
Brutaldon

A brutalist, web-1.0 web client for Mastodon and Pleroma. Supports text-only browsers like Lynx, older browsers, as well as the latest mainstream browsers. All JavaScript is completely optional and progressively enhances the core application.

Show threadSpace HoboDec 6, 2022
@vkc It definitely helps that CSS took over a lot of display control that used to require JS.
Show thread📄 Mehdi.docDec 6, 2022
@vkc Well, HTML5, web components and modern CSS happened.
Show threadPeter MountDec 6, 2022

@vkc I'm in the same situation. Need to redo the template for my main site but thinking how to make it work with old browsers, Eg retro machines.

Won't work for most but if like to get it to work with them

Show threadRoDec 6, 2022
@vkc LOL same
Show threadMichal NemecekDec 6, 2022

@vkc the website I built* for my mom literally doesn't have a single line of javascript

* read as "modified a decent looking template"

Show threadGrantDec 6, 2022
@vkc
Show threadMOVED to @[email protected]Dec 6, 2022
@vkc me_irl.html
Show thread Paul "CookieMom" F.Dec 6, 2022
@vkc Added note: I make sure I have an extension that can disable javascript because it's so friggin malicious nowadays.
Show threadAnders BorchDec 6, 2022

@vkc haha! Some days I think it's more like "React is fine, I don't need a bunch of HTML" 😜

Oh, and: "Tailwind is fine, I don't need a bunch of CSS"

Show threadDaniel SmithDec 6, 2022
@vkc I keep hoping TypeScript is in a sort of hype cycle.. .I learn it because it is expected with many jobs, but really.. .it's helpful but looks like Line Noise. More clutter on the screen. I suspect TypeScript is a plot by Big Pixel.
Show threadDaniel Howard 🌻Dec 6, 2022
@vkc I skipped the middle part, thank goodness.
Show threadherchenroderDec 6, 2022

@vkc in This is because in 2002 there were only 2 main browsers and everyone was on desktop at 1024x768

Then in 2012 iPhones and Androids were still pretty new and mobile browsers had all kinds of different viewport sizes.

Now browsers are really pretty good at standardizations, and the updated CSS float layouts with DIVs instead of tables make everything nice and clean.

But it was a crazy ride wasn't it?

Show threadKarl AuerbachDec 6, 2022
@vkc All of that javascript and dynamic page construction wrecks havoc on the ability of archives to capture content for preservation.
Show threadthat ordinal personDec 6, 2022
@vkc me with work site "well I guess to do this ticket I need to add six more components and a couple of modules"
Me with personal site "there's over a 3K total asset download here, far too much"
Show threadRey Dec 6, 2022
@vkc Grass is Always Greener ;)
Show threadKroc CamenDec 6, 2022

@vkc I had an early HTML5 website; didn't even support IE at the time (until IE9 came out). No DIVs, no SPANs, no IDs. No Javascript.

I haven't changed the site's code in a decade excepting a small fix for PHP7+ support, that's it.

Anybody using JS is creating a problem they themselves don't want to deal with.

Show threadCher TailorDec 6, 2022
@vkc I love that technique for color-changing text where you just load a REALLY wide gradient and move it across the letters.
Show threadMichelleDec 6, 2022
@vkc The classic design curve!
Show threadJed 🚲Dec 6, 2022
@vkc you described the Second System effect
Show threadCíat Ó GáibhtheacháinDec 6, 2022
@vkc jQuery died for our bad APIs, but resurrected to save us from so much faff, and then passed on because, lo, it's job was done.
Show threadGregDec 6, 2022

@vkc 20 years ago: I can style this page using nested tables and font tags entirely in HTML!

10 years ago: I can layout this page by defining my own CSS classes to keep the page relatively clean and readable.

Now: I can layout this page using nested Tailwind grids and flex boxes and text styling classes entirely in HTML!

Show threadNickDec 7, 2022
@vkc This is the way.
Show threadLocksmithDec 7, 2022

@vkc
Me, 30 years ago: Yes!

Me, 20 years ago: Yay!

Me, 10 years ago: Hm.

Me at present:

Show threadDubiago 💫Dec 7, 2022
@vkc 💯
Show threadVegetable Gremlin ⍼​👻Dec 7, 2022
@vkc i could probably make do with some beads
Show threadCalamity CaitlinDec 7, 2022
@vkc 😂😂😂
Show threadYaoi Box BalloonDec 7, 2022
@vkc I do love me just some straightforward code. *salivates*
Show threadBadtux the Snarky PenguinDec 7, 2022
@vkc Your product manager: "Wait, why does it look so plain? I want it to look sparkly! Give me some Angular or REACT goodness!"
Show threadB-Dad 🇨🇦Dec 7, 2022
@vkc That legal sized yellow ruled pad and nicely sharpened 2B pencil is lookin’ mighty fine right now.
Show threadFiveToedSlothDec 7, 2022
@vkc 0.2 is the answer. http://http02.cat-v.org/
HTTP 0.2 (ie., HTTP 2.0 / 10)

Show threadTimothy SwanDec 7, 2022
@vkc This is my mantra.
Show threadTom HornDec 8, 2022
@vkc 1000x this 😂
Show threadArtemisDec 8, 2022
@vkc Helped a lot that CSS made leaps and bounds (and still making them) while JS kinda... Got some very neat syntactic sugar and then curdled.
Show threadjhvanderscheeDec 9, 2022
@vkc https://www.zengardenwebsites.com
Site title

Site description

Show threadSteve WeintrautDec 11, 2022
@vkc omg! Just started on mastodon and I see this post and realize I’ve found my people! I’ll hang this on my office door for when one of my devs tries to sell me on the latest and greatest framework that’ll they spend 3 weeks trying to do what the could do in 3 days without it.
Show threadSam Thurston Sep 7, 2023
@vkc it's amazing how much stuff we were doing with js 10 years ago has been incorporated into standard, well-supported css
Show threadScot HackerSep 7, 2023
@vkc HTMX FTW
Show threadGMate8Sep 26, 2023
@vkc this toot wonderfully sheds a light on the natural cycles affecting humans as species and the laws of our Universe.
Show threadTanguy ⧓ HerrmannSep 27, 2023
@vkc I totally avoided frontend dev for the last 10 years.
I had to choose between ember (RIP), angular and react. When I learned that angular 2 was around the corner, I was "ok, let's wait".
Very shortly, I learned that angular 2 had nothing to do with angular 1, so you'd have to do nearly a full rewrite.
I noped out of there very fast when I saw this madness.
Show threadTanguy ⧓ HerrmannSep 27, 2023

@vkc I went crazy the other way and started developing my own frontend framework in a non javascript language to still have dynamic page (it was for a video game).

I'm pretty sure developing and maintaining it was still faster than handle all the migrations, change of API, complex build system of all this frontend framework folly.

Which is, very sad.

But anyway, I think I will now use HTMX as it stays simple, as it should have.

Show threadlocnarDec 6, 2022
@vkc with Dual+ monitors, sure.
Show threadserDec 6, 2022
@vkc
I'm still waiting for Tufte to catch on with Enterprise as the Next Big Thing. Even if it's only briefly, I want to experience a readable web again.
Show threadⓂ️👁🔑 · mikey · マイキーDec 6, 2022
@vkc
<s>Bring back Flash™️</s>
Show threadwwarnerDec 6, 2022
@vkc you luckily skipped the Angular step.
Show threadMikeDec 6, 2022
@vkc Due to my colorblindness and my inherent inability to create that resembles pretty, I decided to go backend dev for my career path. (Like, the my first backend language used the extension .php3). I decided not that long ago to look at some of my frontend devs ReactJS code. I'm not sure I've ever felt that out of touch with tech.
Show threadKyle R. ConwayDec 7, 2022

@vkc

I'm somewhat jealous of the idea of running so few tabs. I always suspect there's just some tool (or contemplative personal practice) I'm just too unable to follow. You help show me that it's possible.

On the other side, @mmasnick helps me understand that my multi-tabbed practice is only in its infancy, and has not yet begun to reach its zenith.

Show threadMike Masnick ✅Dec 7, 2022
@K_REY_C @vkc whoever dies with the most open tabs wins.
Show threadKyle R. ConwayDec 7, 2022

@mmasnick
@vkc

Since you added mortality and "winning" into the mix I had to ask. It's an interesting take with much mixed messaging.

Show threadJoé McKenDec 7, 2022
@K_REY_C @mmasnick @vkc I can’t be the only one who’s continually amazed and a tiny bit freaked out at how bloody good this AI is, can I? Yeah, there are usually tells, but … like, this is genuinely creative.
Show threadJamesDec 7, 2022
@joemcken @K_REY_C @mmasnick @vkc creative, yes. But also internally inconsistent. The Creator warns about distraction and endless scrolling, but the one with the most open tabs wins?
Maybe it it were fleshed out and we got an anti-Creator humanist hero.
Show threadvextDec 7, 2022
@vkc Very Zen.
"Before I had studied Zen for thirty years, I saw mountains as mountains, and waters as waters. When I arrived at a more intimate knowledge, I came to the point where I saw that mountains are not mountains, and waters are not waters. But now that I have got its very substance I am at rest. For it’s just that I see mountains once again as mountains, and waters once again as waters."
Show thread~# sudohumanDec 7, 2022
@vkc my new policy is to only PUT .html that’s been coded by echoing from a shell line by line. If something borks you have to start over.
AS GOD INTENDED.
Show threadnurmivasaraDec 8, 2022
@vkc Reminds me of this classic 😛