SuzyNov 19, 2022
Druid 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿
I just dipped into Twitter to read the fantastic news that the Snowdonia National Park Authority has voted to use the original Welsh names Yr Wyddfa #YrWyddfa and #Eryri rather than the imposed English #Snowdon and #Snowdonia. It's a massive win for reclaiming our #Welsh cultural heritage. I honestly can't believe the amount of hatred, abuse and racism in the Twitter comments from English people. I've no idea why they are so angry that another country wants to use its own language. #Cymraeg 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿
Nov 17, 2022 at 8:26amWeb
Show threadSue ArcherNov 17, 2022

@druid I think there are many reasons why some English people are so opposed to multilingualism (in any other language). Paranoia (they're talking about me), jealousy (they're doing something I can't), fear (I don't understand), controlfreakery (they should just use English) and snobbishness (English is used worldwide, why would anyone need another language). Any one person can have one or many of these feelings.

Fortunately, we're not all like that!

Show threadDruid 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿Nov 17, 2022
@suearcher Sadly all true I think Sue.
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022
@suearcher @druid It really is the tiny minority that are like that. But they are the ones who shout the loudest, or at all.
Show threadDruid 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿Nov 17, 2022
@Steveb @suearcher I really hope so Steve. One look at Twitter and you're left feeling like it's the entire country. I think Twitter probably tends to attract the shouty types so looks worse than it really is.
Show threadSue ArcherNov 17, 2022

@druid @Steveb I think it's a similar principle to the way bad news travels fast or how we are more likely to complain about a bad experience (eg, in a shop) than share a good one. The bad is always louder, unless we make a big effort to drown it out.

Also, nice people don't like to shout, because we're brought up to see it as brash or rude. Nasty people don't care.

Show threadPaul H 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊNov 17, 2022
@suearcher @druid @Steveb
The late, great Terry Pratchett speculated how useful rumour and gossip would be if it could be modulated with the truth
Show threadthesweetcheatNov 17, 2022
@druid @Steveb @suearcher definitely. Speaking as a sais, I'd hope we're not all like that ❀️
Show threadCathybugNov 17, 2022
@druid @Steveb @suearcher A lot of them are bots/trolls too if you check their profiles.
Show threadStuart EstellNov 17, 2022
@Cathybug @druid @Steveb @suearcher I’m pretty much off the birdsite now. Using it just for announcing stuff. I realised I hadn’t really been enjoying it as a social platform for years now.
Show threadPaul H 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊNov 17, 2022
@Steveb @suearcher @druid Empty vessels make most noise, as the old proverb goes...
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@Steveb @suearcher @druid to an extent, yes. however england voted for brexit, for the tories...
Show threadSue ArcherNov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon @Steveb @druid some of England did, not me!
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@suearcher @Steveb @druid that is true, it is not all english people but it was a jajority who voted for brexit.
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon @suearcher @druid no, it wasn’t. Can’t recall the exact numbers, but about 30% voted for Brexit.
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@Steveb @suearcher @druid 53.4% of those who voted in england voted to leave, that's a majority.
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022

@elizabethveldon Exactly. Of those who voted. Turnout was about 70%.

I'm not entirely sure what you're angle is here. It feels like you are trying to say ALL English people are the same because ALL English people voted for BREXIT. Which we've proved isn't the case.

For the record, I'm dual nationality, English & Irish. I've not lived in England for over 26 years and feel no affiliation to the place.

Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022

@Steveb no, i am saying that england voted by a majority for brexit.

england voted for brexit

Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@Steveb i don't see how this a controvertial statement: we can not count people who did not vote and of those who voted a majority voted for brexit.
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022

@elizabethveldon In which case, again, you're wrong.

Those who voted, voted by a majority, which you have said somewhere. But that is a very different thing to the majority of people in England voted for BREXIT.

I accept to many, there is no distinction, but when it comes to some as contentious as BREXIT, it's important to be super accurate. IMO.

Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022

@Steveb england voted for brexit, those who voted voted for brexit.

you can not assign those who did not vote to either side, you can only count those who did.

Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022

@elizabethveldon Not trying to. Just striving for complete clarity. The majority of English did not vote BREXIT. The majority of the English who voted, did. Thus, the majority of English DID NOT vote BREXIT.

πŸ˜ƒ

Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@Steveb this is the worst argument in the world and does nothing but allow 'liberal' english people to hide from what their country has done.
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022

@elizabethveldon LOL.

What should they do? Campaign for a new referendum? Go on strike? Get into arguments on social media?

😜

Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@Steveb admit that england has become a racist backwater sliding into fascism?
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon Did I ever say differently? I'm not arguing for or against that statement, no matter how much it massively generalises an entire nation. I'm just pointing out the inaccuracies in some of your statements.
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022

@Steveb they are not inacurate, england voted for brexit and i am sorry that this truth maks you uncomfortable.

this conversation is pointless and i now consider it over.

Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon and we were getting on so we’ll too! Bye.
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022

@Steveb when i asked for the conversation to be over i didn't want a retort. blocking you now.

learn to respect other people's bounderies.

Show threadMosstrooperNov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon @Steveb You're right Elizabeth it was the english who voted for Brexit and we're all having to endure it, thanks to them. Scotland was 62% remain and that'll have increased. It was a scam and a majority of Scots knew it.
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022

@Steveb let's distribute that 13% by the result.

oh look, england still voted for brexit.

Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon You mean change the facts to suit a cause? Sure, let's do that, if you want.
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@Steveb no, i want to stay with the facts which are that england voted for brexit.
Show threadSue ArcherNov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon @Steveb You want to seem to blame people like me and my husband, and everyone I know, who didn't vote for it, and who were gutted at the result, for Brexit. Thanks a bunch.
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@suearcher @Steveb no, I am saying that england voted for brexit. you didn't and that's great but england did.
Show threadSue ArcherNov 17, 2022

@elizabethveldon @Steveb

Ok, but I resent the implication here that people who didn't vote for it are somehow to blame, and hiding from what happened...

https://mastodon.scot/@elizabethveldon/109359546533367875

elizabeth veldon (@[email protected])

@[email protected] this is the worst argument in the world and does nothing but allow 'liberal' english people to hide from what their country has done.

mastodon.scot
Show threadelizabeth veldonNov 17, 2022
@suearcher @[email protected] i am saying that those who didn't vote can not be included in any count of the vote. the people i chastise here are those who use this argument to say that england din't vote for brexit. england and wales voted for it and have to face up to that.
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022

@suearcher @elizabethveldon Hello Sue. I can't read some of this now as the other party has blocked me, as she didn't invite my retort.

Draw your own conclusions on that one!

I wouldn't worry too much though, there is always one ;-)

Show threadSue ArcherNov 17, 2022
@Steveb Yeah, she has the honour of being the first person on Masto to wind me up.... Never mind. Move on.
Show threadSteve BNov 17, 2022

@suearcher LOL.

I suspect you are not the first, or the last.

She has a certain way about her ;-)

Show threadDanny MonaghanNov 18, 2022

@elizabethveldon @Steveb well if you want to stay with the facts, the country of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland voted for Brexit.

Your vociferous Welsh angle in your posts is aggressive, unhelpful, and sounds very intolerant.

Show threadPaul RedfernNov 18, 2022
@danlxix @elizabethveldon (if that's who you're referring to) is Scottish or at least based in Scotland (@mastodon.scot)
Show threadDanny MonaghanNov 18, 2022

@redpaul1 Ah my bad, that was me jumping to a conclusion because of the Welsh angle from the OP.

Maybe I should have said 'anti England' rather than Welsh. Other than that, my view on @elabethveldon's tone remains that same.

Show threadDarryl Collins 🚴🏻Nov 17, 2022
@elizabethveldon @suearcher @Steveb @druid no majority where I live. Strong Remain.
Show threadWill is too honest to be an MPNov 22, 2022
@Steveb @suearcher @druid I'm afraid it really isn't a tiny minority
Show threadMariJeanGordonNov 17, 2022
@suearcher @druid That first reason must be the source of that hackneyed myth - 'I walked into a pub and they all started speaking Welsh' ! 🀣
As if.
Show threadDruid 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿Nov 17, 2022
@marijeangordon @suearcher Shhhh... don't tell them it's all true. 🀣
Show threadStuart EstellNov 17, 2022
@druid @marijeangordon @suearcher I’ve been on the receiving end of that - chattering away in Cymraeg with a friend in a restaurant in Aberystwyth and being glared at by all the Saeson… can confirm he and I only ever speak Cymraeg together πŸ˜„
Show threadDruid 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿Nov 17, 2022
@5357311 @marijeangordon @suearcher 🀣 There's some odd folk about. I love hearing any different language spoken.
Show threadSue ArcherNov 17, 2022
@druid @5357311 @marijeangordon Me too. And as a dysgwr, I'm so happy that I'm starting to understand and speak another language!
Show threadJayne πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆNov 17, 2022

@suearcher @druid @5357311 @marijeangordon

One of my favourite internet memes is of a woman speaking Welsh to her daughter (in Wales) and being told to stop speaking "foreign muck" πŸ€¦πŸ˜‚

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/woman-told-stop-speaking-foreign-13598021

Woman speaking Welsh in Wales told to stop speaking 'foreign muck'

Elin Jones was shocked as she was confronted when speaking to her daughter while out shopping in Lampeter

WalesOnline
Show threadDruid 🏴󠁧󠁒󠁷󠁬󠁳󠁿Nov 17, 2022

@TCMuffin @suearcher @5357311 @marijeangordon Ah yes, I remember that. Shocking. This bit made me actually LOL though:

"I have had comments from people saying β€˜go back to your own country’, which is very funny because I am from Aberystwyth.”. 🀣

Show threadJayne πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆNov 17, 2022

@druid @suearcher @5357311 @marijeangordon

πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚

Show threadIdris πŸ’™Nov 17, 2022

@TCMuffin @druid @suearcher @5357311 @marijeangordon

There was a viral story here in America a few years back about a barista chastising a customer to "Speak English!" And the woman responded, "I'm British. I am speaking English."

The absolute fear that some people have of anything different to them is astonishing.

Show threadJayne πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆNov 17, 2022

@RomanticSkeptic @druid @suearcher @5357311 @marijeangordon

That's brilliant πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚

Show threadMariJeanGordonNov 17, 2022
@TCMuffin @RomanticSkeptic @druid @suearcher @5357311
Reminds me of the story in some newspapers here a few years ago:
An Asian woman was speaking to her child in their own language, on a bus (train ?), somewhere in Wales. A racist tells her she should be speaking English, she's in England now. She looks up at him and quietly responds 'I'm speaking Welsh, and we're in Wales.'
😊
Show threadJayne πŸ‡ͺπŸ‡ΊπŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆNov 17, 2022

@marijeangordon @RomanticSkeptic @druid @suearcher @5357311

I’d heard that one too πŸ‘

What makes people feel enabled to comment like this 🀷

πŸ‘πŸ‘πŸ‘πŸ‘πŸ‘

Show threadKara ShallenbergNov 17, 2022
@marijeangordon @TCMuffin @RomanticSkeptic @druid @suearcher @5357311 πŸ†
Show threadSandeha LynchNov 17, 2022

@marijeangordon @TCMuffin @RomanticSkeptic @druid @suearcher
@5357311
And here it was. I don't know the source.

If it should ever happen that someone wanted to know why I was speaking Italian in Wales, I would ask them if they could ask that question in Welsh. I doubt I'd be surprised to find that the person was monolingual.

I would then reassure them that monolingualism can be cured.