hjhornbeck4h ago
Chu 朱

So much I love about this story.

Dudes crying about their rights to harass women....

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/sexual-harassment-billboard-9.7152106

When an airport rejected this sexual harassment lawyer's small ad, she sued. Now she has a giant billboard | CBC Radio

A New York airport authority rejected sexual harassment lawyer Megan Thomas's ad copy and asked her to tone it down, so she filed a free speech lawsuit. The judge took her side, and now she has two massive ads on full display.

CBC
1:30pmWeb
Show threadJeff Mitchell10h ago
@chu Sounds like some dude at the SRAA does a lot of "harmless flirting".
Show threadJoeHenzi8h ago
@squared99 @chu Article mentions a work trip. Those are the ones I was abused on.
Show threadChu 朱7h ago

@JoeHenzi @squared99

Sorry to hear.

Show threadKerry Mitchell 🍁9h ago
@chu I thought it was an interesting ad. I would guess it was perceived as too aggressive, not because it equates flirting with harassment, but because it calls out HR for protecting harassers. It does disparage a profession, although the Authority was apparently reluctant to state this in their argument. Maybe they felt HR was indefensible - Thomas would only have to show examples where HR failed to protect victims.
Show threadCarolyn7h ago

@KerryMitchell @chu HR famously protects companies over employees, especially when it’s women complaining about harassment.

This is only “aggressive” to those who are defending sexual harassment.

Show threadKerry Mitchell 🍁7h ago

@CStamp @chu Yes, I agree. The ad copy doesn’t expressly say “flirting = harassment” it says that if HR is dismissive of your harassment complaint you should call Thomas, a lawyer.

Somebody at the authority took exception to the message, but their choice was to make the argument that the ad goes too far in equating flirting with harassment, and to suggest that the message was disparaging without specifically identifying the disparaged party.

Show threadChu 朱7h ago

@KerryMitchell @CStamp

Probably some dude in HR that got this ad killed. Or some dude who likes to harass women

Show threadKerry Mitchell 🍁7h ago

@chu @CStamp I suspect that whoever reviews ads for the authority tried to apply “within the organization” standards to material for the general public.

It’s ingrained in organizations that HR will deal objectively with complaints, and even people who know it’s a fiction see it as a necessary one to protect the organization from legal actions.

Maybe a really sexist person would misinterpret the ad and feel called out for “harmless flirting” but it depends on a misreading.

Show threadCarolyn6h ago
@KerryMitchell @chu It is quite simple: Women are people. Treat women co-workers and employees as people, not possible conquests.
Show threadIgnazio Palmisano2h ago
@KerryMitchell @chu @CStamp I suspect anyone who feels called out by this ad is not misinterpreting it, they're feeling a cold chill from having been almost caught, and now maybe someone might take a second look at things. And they deserve the discomfort.
Show threadKerry Mitchell 🍁2h ago
@ignaziop1977 Maybe. I wouldn’t say an objection to the ad, even on the basis of a belief that flirting is not the same as harassment, is necessarily evidence that the person objecting has past misdeeds to cover up.
Show threadCarolyn6h ago
@KerryMitchell @chu A big problem is that when one goes to HR to complain about sexual harassment, that person gets labeled as “difficult.”
Show threaddr 🛠️🛰️📡🎧6h ago

@KerryMitchell @chu It doesn't disparage "HR" either. The ad uses a verb tense that appears to refer to a single real case.

It isn't: When HR calls it .... we call it

It is: When HR called it ... we called it

Show threadKerry Mitchell 🍁6h ago
@davidr @chu No - the need for the ad suggests that multiple people will find themselves in this position and want to seek assistance from a lawyer. It’s supposed to be a relatable scenario.
Show threadJohns6h ago

@KerryMitchell @chu HR exists to protect the company, unions exist to protect the workers.

If an abuser is on a higher place than the abused, HR will move heaven and earth to either bury the issue or gaslight the abused.
Only the laws will force them to behave.

I love both the ad and the judge.

Show threadCassandrich8h ago
@chu Very much a "dudes who frequent airports" thing, especially.
Show threadIghostrider8h ago
@chu an excellent result methinks!
Show threadℂ𝕖𝕝𝕖𝕤𝕥𝕖@world: /# 7h ago
@chu To "tone it down"... what part of the ad is supposed to be offensive to anyone?! Like wtf. That's just peak "shut your mouth, woman" mentality by the airport.
So glad the court ruled in her favor.
Show threadAdara Astin6h ago
@chu Between the two employers mentioned in the article (airport, lawfirm), I can tell you which one I'd rather work for.
Show threadMichael Weiss5h ago

@chu There's something I find fascinating in reading the comments. I had to go back and reread the article to make sure I didn't miss a signal.

In no way did the advertisement imply that they're representing women who were harassed by men. Nor did the CBC article.

Yet a significant percentage of the comments assumed it.

I know that it is more common for women to be the victims here than men. And women should absolutely be treated with respect in the workplace that is generally afforded to men. I've seen plenty.

But men are still often the victims of harassment, either by women or by other men. And those who are deserve acknowledgement and support, too.

Reread the article like I did. The only genders mentioned in it are the owner of the business who was putting up the ad, and the judge who issued the ruling. And even then they were mentioned only in the sense of casual pronoun use.

Chu, I am not pointing at you here. You responded appropriately to @JoeHenzi and so I don't want to discount that.

Show threadJoeHenzi5h ago

@mweiss @chu I had to get a protection order. In two Atlanta hotels she's not allowed to be a guest any longer because she came to my room too often (and I had hotel security remove her). The boss was a woman, the HR rep who fired me was a woman. Both of their bosses and the CEO were women. The harassment got so bad that it put my marriage at risk and I attempted suicide - forever changing my life and maybe making me lose my ability to work. I was the one arrested for DV in stopping her from coming into my room in one town (if you tell the cops someone is trying to sleep with you - it's domestic violence to defend yourself if you're a man). The ironic thing is that my boss told me to "step aside" for the women in my firm who were making moves. They kept putting me on trips with this person, even reassigned my employees to them at one point in a power struggle. We worked together well, we were partners. But the culture of drinking often put her on a path of excess and it became an obsession to "be with me". At one point, she was obsessed with making a child!

I'm 100% certain - for gender reasons - this is going to be my fault somehow. I'm pointing out their genders, but not blaming them for it or anything. But because men typically are a problem, I'm not to be believed. I pushed the EEOC, who did nothing in the end.

Show threadflere-imsaho 🇺🇦5h ago

@mweiss @chu @JoeHenzi in general female-presenting people are way more frequently harassed, and that's just statistics.

it does not mean that there's no harassment going the other way or that there is no same-gender harassment going on, of course, but these cases will be more rare.

Show threadJoeHenzi5h ago
@mawhrin @mweiss @chu what is the point of your comment to me right now?
Show threadflere-imsaho 🇺🇦5h ago

@JoeHenzi @mweiss @chu i was replying to michael weiss, and did simply retain the reply list.

think cc:, not to:.

Show threadMichael Weiss4h ago

@mawhrin @chu @JoeHenzi The rarity is part of the point. We're not talking about black swan events, just less frequent events. The flattening creates knee-jerk reactions. It builds stereotypes. It results in marginalization of people like Joe.

And all of that is both unnecessary and unnecessarily harmful. It's not a zero-sum game, where acknowledging that every human is a potential victim means that we cannot protect women, or that we should care less about doing so.

Show threadJoeHenzi4h ago
@mweiss @mawhrin @chu It happens, people need to protect their stereotypes. I've been subjected to this twice. As a minor I worked for the local newspaper's satellite office. There was a woman there who prayed on minors, plying them with alcohol. She took us out for a "Christmas Party" where multiple people got sick, ushered me into her bed and undressed me before taking things further... To this day I'm still blamed for being the aggressor by my (former) friends despite them seeing me being pulled into her room while trying to leave. She even used the incident to try and put distance between me and others who were interested in me romantically. They didn't fire her, though a woman did resign in disgust (only one of the people involved in HR was a man, the bosses were women and the HR reps were women). She then slept with two more minors before being let go. They somehow let the second report slide because he admitted to being willing - though she was the manager and he was 17 years old and illegally drunk. It took 3 reports of sex with children. Anyone else would label her a pedophile like Epstein though she did it with an apartment and drugs/alcohol and not an island and a helpful mistress. In the end, it hurt people all the same. In every case those teens lost the person they were dating when she targeted them.
Show threadChu 朱3h ago

@JoeHenzi @mweiss @mawhrin

Sorry you went through this.

Though the vast majority of the time, the gender roles are reversed, it does happen. It's horrible no matter who it happens to.

And though I applaud this law team for seeking justice, I am skeptical of justice being applied in the bulk of cases.

Show threadJoeHenzi3h ago

@chu @mweiss @mawhrin Hey, you don't have to pretend. Everyone knows what happens, being told over and over that statistics are different is a weird and wild thing. I can't imagine you'd bring up crime statistics to any other victim of any other crime - especially after being told about people having sex with what are children. I'm sure it would be comforting to an arson victim that typically the arsonist is a firefighter.

I'm skeptical of justice too, but for different reasons, one has been playing out since I was 17 and here it is again. What a mistake to share this.

Show threadJoeHenzi3h ago
@chu @mweiss @mawhrin No where did I dispute statistics or bring up anything to make me be told this twice now. I said I support the placement of the ad in airports - work trips are the place these things happen. I know, it was being followed on a trip that made feel cornered and feeling like my only escape was to attempt my own life (there in the airport). Was told to, that there is no escaping the attention I didn't want. I had been through this before, it ruined my relationships. And it did again, I lost everything because of this person who pursued me.
Show threadChu 朱2h ago

@JoeHenzi @mweiss @mawhrin

Sorry Joe if that sounded dismissive.

I am genuinely sorry that anyone has to go through experiences like that.

My own experience with assault nearly ruined my marriage.

My trauma turned into putting my daughter into martial arts at a young age. I hope I don't pass too much trauma onto her and why I am obsessed with her ability to kick where it matters.

I am sure for men, that's not even an option because then you get charged for assault on top of it all too.

I have no answers. But I am genuine that I feel angry this happened to you. Nobody should go through this.

Show threadJoeHenzi2h ago
@chu @mweiss @mawhrin I've deleted multiple replies - people largely are dismissive and it's what got me arrested and them not. I remember sitting in the police station crying that I was there and they were not - it felt wild.
Show threadMichael Weiss1h ago

@JoeHenzi @chu @mawhrin it's hard to share like that. And brave. You may feel that it was a mistake, but it's so very important for stories like yours to be told.

Silence encourages people to believe that these things don't happen. Or that they happen less often than they really do. It's the same thing that happened with women for so long, and it's gotten much better in the past couple of decades. Not good enough, or there wouldn't have been a point in the ad that led to the article. But definitely better.

Show threadAlex Hoffmann4h ago
@chu @wendynather damn that‘s cool.
Show threadJon4h ago

@chu "And thanks to her new ads — a 9.4-by-76 centimetre banner and a 9.5-by-2.9-metre floor-to-ceiling wall wrap — the phone is ringing off the hook.

She says her firm, Megan Thomas Law, has had to hire a new attorney and an intake specialist just to meet the demand.

"We were busy before, but now we're even busier, which is great," she said."

Sounds almost like she learned how to promote her firm from Saul Goodman. 😅