Mastodawn

Sybren A. Stüvel

@metin I find it weird that https://european-alternatives.eu doesn't have a category for creative software.

I'd suggest it to them, but then you need to create an account first 😿

European Alternatives

We help you find European alternatives for digital service and products, like cloud services and SaaS products.

European Alternatives

Metin Seven 🎨1d ago

@sybren Good point. That's a bummer indeed. 🫤

Ejner Borgbjerg 23h ago

@sybren @metin I have an account, I can suggest it to them. But TBH I think it might be better to be more specific. What is meant by creative software?

Sybren A. Stüvel 23h ago

@metin @ejner1 Blender originated in NL, and Blender HQ is in Amsterdam, so I’d put Blender on the list. Krita is also based in NL. That’s the kind of creative software I was thinking about.

Thanks for the offer, appreciate it!

Metin Seven 🎨23h ago

@ejner1 @sybren Thanks! I guess creative software would refer to any tool you can use for creation, such as graphics and music.

Sybren A. Stüvel 23h ago

@metin @ejner1 yup, that's what I mean :)

https://blenderartists.org/t/adobe-autodesk-canva-maxon-alternatives/1522359

Metin Seven 🎨23h ago

@sybren @ejner1 👍 You could have a look at this list for possible entries, though there are also non-European tools in the list:

Adobe / Autodesk / Canva / Maxon alternatives

Adobe, Affinity (Canva), Autodesk, Maxon and the like are all very commercial corporations, with pricy subscriptions and increasingly prominent (de)generative AI functionality. In case you want to have a look around for possible replacements, here’s a list of free or reasonably priced alternatives… 📅 Most recent edit: March 22 ➡ Latest additions are marked with 🆕 ↕ Order = alphabetical 🔠 3D creation / CAD 3D-Coat Blender 🐵 B...

Blender Artists Community

@sybren @metin I made a suggestion for a new category, "Film and Music Creation Software". There are 40+ suggested categories pending, so I think it will need some upvotes to make it to the actual pages.

@ejner1 @metin Is it necessary to get so specific? I mean, Blender is also used for 3D printing, medical visualisation, and pizza designing, just to name a few examples. It's definitely not limited to filmmaking.

@sybren @metin when suggesting a new category, the site guidelines say to be specific. E.g. "productivity software" is too vague.
Creativity software is also, IMHO too vague.

@ejner1 @metin Ok, fair enough.

@sybren @metin the site guidelines also require to mention examples both European and usian competitors. I wrote Blender, Krita, and as a competitor, Adobe (various products).
Maybe "graphics" should be added to the category title.
I did check the existing 43 category suggestions - there was nothing similar (surprisingly).

@ejner1 @metin 'Graphics' could be a good category for sure.

As for non-EU software in the same category, Procreate is from Australia. GIMP originates from the US, but as it's Open Source and developed by a wide range of developers, I don't know if it's fair to put it in the list as "from the USA".

@sybren @metin FOSS software should be fine in my view. By its very nature, it isn't bounded by any geographic limit. But I am not sure how the website sees that. TBH they look a bit too commercial-ish for my taste. (european- alternatives.eu I mean, not gimp 😄)

@ejner1 @metin Hahaha yeah nobody has ever described GIMP as "too commercial looking" 😹

@sybren @metin 🤣

Metin Seven 🎨20h ago

@ejner1 @sybren Hahahah! 😆😆

And thanks for the pizza design tip, Sybren. I knew there were areas of Blender I hadn't touched yet. 😆

Sybren A. Stüvel 20h ago

@metin @ejner1 that was a presentation at bcon a few years ago. They even have a “bake” button, to bake texture & shadow maps 😹

Metin Seven 🎨20h ago

@sybren @ejner1 😆 Brilliant!

@ejner1 @metin btw, it looks like you set your language setting to Dansk, even when writing in English. I'm not bothered, but it might be something to keep an eye on, as it does mess with the 'Translate' link under each message.

@sybren @metin oh... I didn't know that. Thank you for the heads-up 😊

CmykStudent 18h ago

@sybren @ejner1 @metin The current maintainer of GIMP @zemarmot is based in Europe. I think the original American creators were around for only a few years before the community took over the project.

ZeMarmot

2h ago

@CmykStudent @sybren @ejner1 @metin Not only are we in Europe (France), our co-maintainer @mitchfoo is as well (Germany). We've been contributing since 2012. Mitch since 1997.
His own previous co-maintainer was also German AFAWK. I think that GIMP has been mainly developed in and led from Europe for a few decades now. Just the 3 of us, we account for over 50% of the number of commits in GIMP.

The main developer of GEGL/babl @pippin? Norway.

Anyone saying that GIMP is from the US is mistaken. 🤣

@CmykStudent @sybren @ejner1 @metin @mitchfoo @pippin

ZeMarmot

2h ago

As for the original authors, they stayed for 2 years then disappeared without a word AFAWK. From 1997 and onward, the software has been entirely community-led (and mostly in Europe, as we just showed).

Thanks for liberating their code through a license initially, but apart from this, thinking that just because these 2 people are originated from the US, it would make the whole software US-based is just funny. 😛

Simon 37m ago

@zemarmot @CmykStudent @sybren @ejner1 @metin @mitchfoo @pippin
Yosh (based in the US) has been maintainer of gimp for quite a while before the role moved to sven and mitch. That was way in the 2000's afair, I've met Yosh at several LGMs.
While I consider it wrong to label gimp as US based it is true that its origins were in the US and a lot of important contributions do originate there and shape Gimp to this very day.

It is a shame that this seems relevant.

Feral 3D 19h ago

@ejner1 @sybren @metin BLENDER!

Metin Seven 🎨19h ago

@Feral_3D @ejner1 @sybren Haha. Category: Blender. Only entry: Blender! 😁

Sybren A. Stüvel 19h ago

@metin @Feral_3D @ejner1 😹

Feral 3D 19h ago

@sybren @metin @ejner1 the first time I flew to Amsterdam, I was under the impression that everyone in NL knew what Blender was, and was super pumped about it..... imagine my disappointment 😞.

Sybren A. Stüvel 18h ago

@Feral_3D @metin @ejner1 pfff for years I studied a few streets away from the previous location of Blender HQ, nobody mentioned it so I guess nobody knew.

Feral 3D 18h ago

@sybren @metin @ejner1 HOW! How does that happen?! Also I used to tell everyone about Ton and Blender in NYC. I naively thought that people cared about 3D as much as me. Turns out... not so much.

BUT then I start telling a molecular biologists and scientists..... and whooooo baby....

Metin Seven 🎨18h ago

@Feral_3D @sybren @ejner1 When I was still a 3ds Max guy in the 2000s, I was intrigued by Blender, but the pre-2.5 UI didn't appeal to me.

Around the time 3ds Max went the subscription way (± 2012), Blender 2.5 with a revamped UI was released, and I jumped onto the Blender train. Never looked back. 👍

Feral 3D 18h ago

@metin @sybren @ejner1 yes! That's how I converted people at Marvel, the 2.5 update with vertical menus made the biggest difference, and the zip folder delivery.

You were what I used to call BI-curious.

Metin Seven 🎨17h ago

@Feral_3D @sybren @ejner1 😁 BI… Sweet memories of the Blender Internal renderer. I still miss it sometimes. It was like a missing link between EEVEE and Cycles, and had its own distinctive look. 💚