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Blazie Technologies Feb 26

March is an exciting month for us. We began shipping the BT Speak in March of 2024. In honor of the BT Speak’s second anniversary, we wanted to make March an exciting month for our customers, as well, which is why the next BT Speak update will be free for everyone as our anniversary gift to you. Join us for our next webinar when we lift the lid to tell you about what you can expect in the upcoming update, as well as exciting updates regarding BT Braille.

Date: Tuesday, March 3
Time: 7:00 PM Eastern Time (US and Canada)

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GraceTechNerd Mar 13

@BlazieTech i’m sorry… Are you saying you have to pay for each update once you already pay for the device? Was thinking about purchasing this device, but this is quite confusing.

Blazie Technologies

@GraceTechNerd Hi, Grace.
The BT Speak includes a 90-day warranty which covers both hardware and software. Any software updates released during the warranty period are available for you to install. The warranty also allows you to receive an exchange BT Speak in the event that your unit encounters a hardware problem that we’re not able to resolve with a phone call.
You can extend this warranty by purchasing a maintenance contract for your BT Speak. Your maintenance contract can be renewed for either $20.00 per month or for $200.00 annually. The maintenance contract extends your warranty coverage by providing you with the same benefits that you receive with the initial 90-day warranty.
In other words, you can receive a product exchange in the event of a problem, in addition to software updates. Unlike other products, the maintenance contract is continually renewable. We don't limit you to just one or two years of coverage.
If you choose to not purchase a maintenance contract for your BT Speak, you have the option of paying $50.00 any time after the warranty period to receive the latest software update, regardless of how much time has elapsed.

Adison verlice 6d ago

CC: @[email protected] personally I find that very exploitative. if I bought the device, I should be able to receive updates, even if it's only for a few years.
I already bought the device, I shouldn't have to pay a sperate package just for updates.
and btw, the fact you couldn't just answer with a simple yes or no concerns me. I don't think she asked for corporate jargon, she asked a direct question. but i'll go ahead and translate it for you: yes, after the warranty, you absolutely have to pay for updates.
I was thinking about getting the BT speek, but now I will not.
thank you, next freedom scientific

Alex Chapman 6d ago

@averlice @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech I second this, this is honestly not a great look, like this is not cool at all, we should be able to get software updates for free, not paying for a stupid contract.

Adison verlice 6d ago

CC: @[email protected] @[email protected] yup. in fact, you're adding like less of an assistive technology company and more like an enterprise/b2b (business to business) company right now. imagine if Google and apple were to do this? keep in mind their devices are only supported up to a few years. which means the minute they can't receive updates anymore, if they "forget" to cancel that warranty at all, they've just been scammed. and you expect me to pay what, $200/year or even so much as $20 a month just for, what, updates? fuck off!

Tech Singer 6d ago

@averlice @alexchapman @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech I'm a bit confused. I have no dog in this fight at all, I wouldn't take the BTSpeak as a gift if I had to use it. Having said that, this is a small company. As you very rightly say, even Apple and Google only keep their stuff updated for a few years, and people complain about that. Smaller companies don't update at all or update for less than a year. How is an adaptive tech company, which is even smaller than a small phone brander/vendor, supposed to keep a $1500 device up to date and add new features without charging for those updates? As I said, I don't care about this device, I will never buy or use it. My difficulty is to understand what you're saying and get how a small company can expect to keep paying its devs and workers if no update fees are going to be charged?

GraceTechNerd 6d ago

@techsinger @averlice @alexchapman @BlazieTech You also have a great point. i just feel there are better ways then charging for each update. Like charging for extra add-ons like the voxin voices, warranty, or pro apps.

Adison verlice 6d ago

me neither

Tech Singer 6d ago

@GraceTechNerd @averlice @alexchapman @BlazieTech allot of people just wouldn't pay unless what was being offered was absolutely essential. Indeed, many people aren't paying for updates now because they argue the updates aren't essential. It's all well and good to produce high level programs in addition to free updates, but what do you do if people won't buy? I really do think the time for this sort of product has passed by, though I hope I'm wrong. Employees need to eat. I'm not sure how they can given the phones, the handheld gaming machines, and so on. The problem for me isn't the charging for updates, I don't know what else they could do. The problem is that the market is just too small.

Adison verlice 6d ago

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] there are a lot of open source software that accomplishes the "eat" part very well, without exploiting the user. how do you expect me to believe this is a good excuse? I really do not see how you justify charging for updates unless you are a b2b (business to business) model that only cells to enterprises and government agencies

Tech Singer 6d ago

@averlice @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech With respect, I'm just lost. Could you name a piece of open source hardware, not software, which allows employees of the organization to "eat" with even a market slightly larger than blind users? This is not software we're dealing with, remember, it's hardware. Updates are only saleable to those who have purchased the hardware. The only people who would purchase the hardware are blind, and that is a tiny market. I'm trying to come up with any sort of open source software, let alone hardware, which allows employment of people while providing service to a market the size of blind users. The only thing I can come up with is NVDA, and as I said before, NVDA is a charity which is sponsored by many outside resources and companies. I don't see who has solved this problem for any item for the blind. If you could point one of them, one of the "allot" of projects you're thinking of, out, I would be grateful. I can see a few charities, a few personal passion projects which start up and disappear, but not much else. I can't even think of one business which is employing people and does this. Even the charities are on the borderline.

Adison verlice 6d ago

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] I can think of both even non blind software and hardware and blind hardware. NVDA is an example of blindness software, yes. i'm more of a cyber security guy, so I know a lot of cyber security projects, most of which being open source. also, what does it market it's in? there are several in the world that still allow employees to eat. and I don't think charging people for updates is one of them, regardless of what hardware/software it uses, unless you are an enterprise vender, or are celling the product in question to gogvernment/defense agencies. apple and Android offer screen reader software and never, have I ever noticed them charge users for updates . yes, they have extended update packs sometimes, as well as warranties, but those warranties often do not state updates as a feature because it's built-in to the device. if you do this with any software/hardware, I don't care if it's the greatest software/hardware the consumer ever owned, you are, effectively, exploiting your base. if you are making the argument that this was a good idea to make people charge for updates, please say that you will support it with consumer products (E.G. apple iphone, googles android). I think one who supports adding charges just to update the thing would also enjoy it if suddenly they had to pay for even the most basic of security updates on their mainstream devices too.

@averlice @techsinger @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech Espechally when said updates are kinda necessary to retain usefulness.

it's not like your regular onetime purchase commercial closed source software where I can be shure that as long as I own a working copy I can use it in perpetuality.
- I.e. I have an Australian copy of Half Life 2 for the PS2 and that disc and the game will remain playable unless I were to damage it or not be able to obtain a system that can play it.

There's a saying re: #piracy and #Enshittification and I think this really matches here:

If buying isn't ownership, then piracy isn't theft!

Cuz I can understand if something that actually incurs continued costs (i.e. Hosting eMail, Websites, Domains, Broadband, providing actual Support) that it's being sold as a #subscription.

But it's not as if said solution comes with like 24/7 support and 2hr free remote help per year if it breaks to justify the cost.
- Nor does it come with expedited support and security compliance features like an Enterprise Linux disto.

We're talking about accessibility tech here, not something that has a shitload of infrastructure behind it once shipped.

Unlike a "Cloud-based POS System" that also includes a "certified to be tax-audit compliant bookkeeping and accounting system".

If monetization is a problem, then that needs to be thought about and addressed beforehand.

Whereas potentially bricking customers' potentially only way to communicate beyond their immediate vicinity is just cruel.

Tech Singer 6d ago

@kkarhan @averlice @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech I'm confused. Again, I may be wrong because I don't have this device. How are the updates "necessary to retain usefulness". I've read the notes on these updates as they're released and am lost on how not having them makes the device unusable. The device continues to be usable whether you have the updates or not, doesn't it? The updates just add new ways in which it can be useful. How is it bricked, exactly, if that's what you're saying happens? The device just continues to work as the user purchased it if no update is purchased, right?

Blazie Technologies 6d ago

@techsinger @kkarhan @averlice @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman
First, it needs to be said that the service contract is for extending the services and benefits of the product warranty. While this does include access to software updates, it also includes rapid product exchanges. If you have a problem that we can't resolve by phone, we immediately send an exchange unit to you. You keep the exchange and send the original unit back to us and you're done. We're not aware of any other company that offers this service. Also, we release updates every 1 to 2 months. These updates aren't just a few bug fixes or under the hood improvements, although those are certainly part of what gets included. Most of our updates also provide a lot of new features as well as refinements to existing apps and features. We also have a dedicated staff that makes themselves available to customers via email, both privately as well as on our public mailing list, and we always engage and respond to our followers on social media. We're even open on many holidays. Because we have developers working across the globe, it is no exaggeration to say that we literally work around the clock on our software and hardware. We hope this clarifies some of the questions which have been raised.

@BlazieTech @techsinger @averlice @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman so it's rather an "expedited support" with Advanced RMA included?

Okay, but still…

Adison verlice 5d ago

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] ok I get the exchange thing. I can kinda see why that would cost a bit. that I can understand. that's not my criticism. my criticism is that you charge for updates. I get the warranty thing, that's a standard thing. extended warranty, cool, every company should be doing that. again, my criticism is that you are charging for updates to people who already spent, what, 6thousand dollars on the product? is this done with the BT speak as well? or just the BT braille?

Alex Chapman 5d ago

@averlice @BlazieTech @techsinger @kkarhan @GraceTechNerd I think the device is like 1200 or something I can't remember.

Adison verlice 5d ago

no, i'm talking about the update fees.

CC: @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]

Adison verlice 6d ago

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] yeah, to make the device more "useful". some people want that useful functionality. but let me emphasize again, yo udon't get that with apple and Google. they offer the same updates too, at no editional cost to you. also, it doesn't matter, it's still heavy exploitation regardless. unless you're, I don't know, providing me 24/7 phone support dedicated, or giving me a remote monitoring package worth the subscription, it's not only unfeasible for the consumer, but also exploitative. in other words, if you're going to provide a product, make it one-time. it should only be subscriptin-based if there is a service to be had, like, again, 24/7 support, and/or remote support.

@averlice @techsinger @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech exactly!

PICK ONE!

You can't have your cake and eat it too.
- Espechally when it's like a pricing set that I could justify for some Engineerimg Software that is vetted for accuracy and used by companies to make money with to the point that it's cost is negligible.

Whereas $200 per year is quite substantial for the target audience of consumers which ain't earning above average!

Tech Singer 5d ago

@averlice @kkarhan @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech With respect, I really don't see how you expect a company the size of Blazie to operate in the same way as Apple and Google. I would be very interested in hearing why you take that view or have that expectation or, for that matter, make the comparison, because it takes no account of the market, the size of the provider, the amount of work required... Basically, I'm lost on how you expect Blazie to pay their bills given their circumstances without charging for updates. For a business not to want to lose money is not exploitative, I would say. Again, I think this is a product which is not really viable as things stand. I hope I'm wrong but don't think I am. I say that even though I might have bought it if it supported eloquence. Thing is, if they're developing it, they need to somehow pay for it. Maybe they can't. That's what I think. However, one way of at least reducing the bleeding is to charge for updates. Calling that exploitative, and expecting this small company to act like Apple/Google/Microsoft is a bit odd, if I may say so.

Tech Singer 6d ago

@averlice @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech You say that "I can think of both even non blind software and hardware and blind hardware.". Thanks. Would you please name them, because I can't think of any. You also write "..what does it market it's in? there are several in the world that still allow employees to eat." I think you meant to say "what does it matter what market it's in". Correct me if I'm wrong, I don't understand the sentence otherwise. That matters because with larger markets, cybersecurity, linux kernel, and so on, companies may sponsor development. Some devs work for, just to give an example, Intel and yet submit patches to the kernel. It matters because companies have an incentive to sponsor those things and employees can get paid by those companies. Similarly, with NVDA, the companies can donate to it as a charity. That doesn't apply to businesses in small markets like the blind/vi tech industry (I call it an industry only by courtesy). You write "apple and Android offer screen reader software and never, have I ever noticed them charge users for updates.". I'll just say what I said earlier in this conversation to someone else. 'Apple is, as I google it now, number 8 on the Fortune 500. Microsoft is 22. Even they don't update their products for more than a few years with all their resources. How do you expect a company the size of Blazie to do even that, if I may ask? How do you expect them to be able to support that for their devices?' That's the question I'm asking. I don't support anything about this unit, I don't want it, will never get it, and the temptation I had to get it died when I saw that it doesn't allow eloquence. What I'm asking is how is this company supposed to support ongoing development if they don't charge for that development, even a nominal amount? That question is particularly pertinent given their size, which must be tiny.

James Dean 5d ago

@averlice @techsinger @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech I don't like this either but it should be pointed out that security updates are provided to all BTSpeak owners, but updates containing new features are paid.

Adison verlice 5d ago

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] for now, that is. untill they decide to exploit that too

Tech Singer 5d ago

@averlice @GamingWithEars @GraceTechNerd @alexchapman @BlazieTech what evidence do you have that will happen, if I may ask? It seems to me security updates are always going to be more or less free to Blazie because they aren't written by Blazie but by upstream contributors, aren't they? Not to mention the reputational damage of having the device attacked with a known bug. What leads you to the opinion that Blazie would or could charge for security updates?

Adison verlice 5d ago

simple. seams like if they could, blazy would charge you a care package just to even consider breathing in front of the device. so i'd be surprised if at some point they wouldn't charge for some security updates. also, upstream? is this projecto pen source?if so, i'd love the link. but hey, that's just blindness companies in general, they want you to pay before you can even insert your finger on the "on" button sometimes. of course i'm exaggerating it, but my point is the exploitation is so off the charts I wouldn't be surprised if it came down to charging for security updates

Tech Singer 5d ago

@averlice This sounds like it's just emotion rather than logic and I can't deal with emotion through reasonable discussion, unfortunately. I've got to stick to logic. Just to deal with the matter of fact you raise, I understand that the work is open source, and that it's based on open source Linux work from others https://mastodon.au/@bigsimon/116248129169927695 Again, I don't have this device, so I may be wrong in believing this person, but he sounds reasonable and correct from what I've seen and says he is working at the maker.

Simon Hayes (@[email protected])

Hey Adison, No, its not a proprietary version of linux, we 're running standard raspbian/debian as used on raspberry pi's. Users can access the standard desktop, where the only thing we have done is add in orca and brltty for screen reading, and setup keyboard macros for easier access. On the multiuser side, we run our own software, with customised editors, book readers, music/radio & podcast players, etc but the system is not locked down in any way, and users are free to write/run their own software, or just apt install anything they like. Some of our customers have even provided software for free for other customers to use. We ship with all the libraries that we use to write software on the machine, and we're working on developer documentation to make it easier for those that want to write their own apps in python or C, or customise the apps that we provide (as most of them are written in python, with all the source provided). Just load them into an editor and go to town. Or apt install a package, or git clone & compile something. I do all my development directly on the machine, using the built in tools. Can you do that on devices you own? How is this being elitist or stupid? Would you prefer that we use Windows or Android? Those platforms are far more locked down. We want this device to be the best that it can be, and we have developers (yes, including me) working on improving the software every day, fixing bugs, writing new apps, and improving existing apps. We don't have the large teams that other companies have, but we work hard at this. This costs money, and hey, I have two children that I have to keep fed and clothed, and can't afford to develop for free. Is it elitist to want to get paid for working? @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]

Mastodon Australia

Adison verlice 5d ago

btw, i'm bit concerned on the fact (at least not that I can find) that it does not say which Linux infrastructure it is based on. Ubuntu? debian? arch? Linux from scratch? something a bit more custom. if you're gonna cell me on a product like this, you better provide your technical fucking specifications, and you better provide it publickly, or else i'm not interested. if you can find it, Lemmy know and give me evidence and i'll say i'm wrong. o, and source code, along with that.

Tech Singer 5d ago

@averlice I'm not interested in selling anyone on the product, remember. I'm not even interested in selling myself on the product, I decided against it because I didn't and don't see the point. Having said that, you can always ask about these things of the company if you're interested. All that, though, has nothing to do with any possible exploitation.

@alexchapman @averlice @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech yeah i agree with you, like cmon it's 2026, software updates should be free

Adison verlice 6d ago

that, fokes, is Exploitation at its finest. blazy being an enterprise vender celling to the elitists rather than the blind people who actually need the software/hardware, no surprise

CC: @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]

Alex Chapman 6d ago

@averlice @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech And I thought they were one of a very small number of companies that actually do things better, but no.

@alexchapman @averlice @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech The BT Speak runs a species of Linux, right? Yeah, not very Linux of you guys if you ask me.

Alex Chapman 6d ago

@cubic @averlice @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech I was thinking the same

Adison verlice 6d ago

a, proprietary, if I remember correctly, stream of Linux. just tells you how elitest they are. very fuckin stupid. this should be illegal and should call for the corporate death penalty, if you ask me. and just so we're clear , I dn't mean death as in "actual" death, I mean death as in the company itself being put out of business

CC: @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]

Simon Hayes 6d ago

Hey Adison,

No, its not a proprietary version of linux, we 're running standard raspbian/debian as used on raspberry pi's. Users can access the standard desktop, where the only thing we have done is add in orca and brltty for screen reading, and setup keyboard macros for easier access. On the multiuser side, we run our own software, with customised editors, book readers, music/radio & podcast players, etc but the system is not locked down in any way, and users are free to write/run their own software, or just apt install anything they like. Some of our customers have even provided software for free for other customers to use. We ship with all the libraries that we use to write software on the machine, and we're working on developer documentation to make it easier for those that want to write their own apps in python or C, or customise the apps that we provide (as most of them are written in python, with all the source provided). Just load them into an editor and go to town. Or apt install a package, or git clone & compile something. I do all my development directly on the machine, using the built in tools. Can you do that on devices you own?

How is this being elitist or stupid? Would you prefer that we use Windows or Android? Those platforms are far more locked down.
We want this device to be the best that it can be, and we have developers (yes, including me) working on improving the software every day, fixing bugs, writing new apps, and improving existing apps. We don't have the large teams that other companies have, but we work hard at this. This costs money, and hey, I have two children that I have to keep fed and clothed, and can't afford to develop for free. Is it elitist to want to get paid for working?

@averlice @cubic @alexchapman @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech

Alex Chapman 6d ago

@bigsimon @averlice @cubic @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech I can see where Adison is coming from though, you don't see Apple, Google, Microsoft or any other company locking software updates behind payments like that, once someone buys a device that they now rightly own, they should be able to get all the software updates without having to shell out yet more money. A lot of us blind folks don't have the money to spend on software like that, so it should just be part of the device. Freedom Scientific has their quote unquote, perpetual licences, but they aren't perpetual, as if you want to be on the newest version you have to pay. We're no longer in the age of new software being delivered by USB or even CD, its over the air. So yes, I get that it takes time and you developers need to get paid, but at the same time I can also understand Adison's point of view that that shouldn't be passed on to the customer.

Tech Singer 6d ago

@alexchapman @bigsimon @averlice @cubic @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech well yes, but Apple is, as I google it now, number 8 on the Fortune 500. Microsoft is 22. Even they don't update their products for more than a few years with all their resources. How do you expect a company the size of Blazie to do even that, if I may ask? How do you expect them to be able to support that for their devices?

divVerent 6d ago

@bigsimon @averlice @cubic @alexchapman @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech Just for your information, I live in a country where the company that originally released a product has to fulfill a mandatory 2 years warranty for any product flaws that existed from the start. Security vulnerabillities and bugs count as such product flaws. So security and bugfix updates are mandatory for 2 years, whereas you can of course sell feature updates just fine.

I of course assume you don't sell in such countries.

As for costs - obviously the solution is to consider those support costs in the product price.

Simon Hayes 6d ago

I'm just a programmer, and it's up to the management at Blazie Tech to decide how and when to charge consumers: whether its upfront costs or in subscriptions or other payments down the track. When the idea of subscriptions was explained to me, the idea was that all users would still get bug fixes, and subscription users would get new features. And, this last release was also released to all customers too (subscribed or not). Oh, and linux updates are not gated in any way.
I have no idea what countries receive our devices... and FYI I'm based in Sydney, Oz (along with another of the devs), and from what I've seen the support of blazie products is far and away better than other companies products I've used. Everyone who works at the company including the owners are active on the mailing lists, customers get to speak to real people when they have a problem, and we're all working to constantly improve the product.

@divVerent @averlice @cubic @alexchapman @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech

divVerent 6d ago

@bigsimon @averlice @cubic @alexchapman @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech Now that sounds a lot better, of course.

It is still a bit weird to sell the same device with different software features (as later developed features need to be bought, even if they were long finished before sale and just the box with the device was sitting somewhere for half a day) for the same name and the same price. Weird, yes, but I am aware many manufacturers already do this (and it's bad when they do it too). Same goes for hidden "hardware revisions" that ultimately decide what you can or can't do with your device, with no difference on the box.

So maybe the software version and feature set should be indicated on the box and the in-store advertisement? (And yes, maybe they already are?)

GraceTechNerd 6d ago

@bigsimon @divVerent @averlice @cubic @alexchapman @J3317 @BlazieTech Okay, this seems reasonable.

Yeah, cuz accessibility shouldn't be something "optional"…

I mean, this stuff isn't cheap either, but putting the longterm useability of an accessibility aid behind a subscription is just an inexcuseable move.
- Espechally since the device itself ain't included in that either (tho I think renting out stuff that people need to participate in society is also not okay!)

Really shows how the privatization of healthcare in a for profit system is shafting not just "consumers" but espechally those that don't get to choose.

Kinda like the deregulation in general.
- I mean it's not that people buy such assistive tech out of curiosity or lazyness, but out of desperate need (or at the very least to test their software and services against them for accessibility)…

https://tweesecake.social/@BlazieTech/116246357392338518

@averlice @alexchapman @J3317 @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech

#Accessibility #HealthCare #Subscriptioms #YouOwnNothingAndYoullBeHappy #Enshittification #tech #AccessibilityTech #AssistiveTech

Blazie Technologies (@[email protected])

@[email protected] Hi, Grace. The BT Speak includes a 90-day warranty which covers both hardware and software. Any software updates released during the warranty period are available for you to install. The warranty also allows you to receive an exchange BT Speak in the event that your unit encounters a hardware problem that we’re not able to resolve with a phone call. You can extend this warranty by purchasing a maintenance contract for your BT Speak. Your maintenance contract can be renewed for either $20.00 per month or for $200.00 annually. The maintenance contract extends your warranty coverage by providing you with the same benefits that you receive with the initial 90-day warranty. In other words, you can receive a product exchange in the event of a problem, in addition to software updates. Unlike other products, the maintenance contract is continually renewable. We don't limit you to just one or two years of coverage. If you choose to not purchase a maintenance contract for your BT Speak, you have the option of paying $50.00 any time after the warranty period to receive the latest software update, regardless of how much time has elapsed.

TweeseCake

Adison verlice 6d ago

me too. I actually thought they were a decent blindness company. nevermind. they can forget about me wanting to purchase their company now. they're the new freedom scientific. and I have no shame of saying that because it's true.

CC: @[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected]

Tech Singer 6d ago

@J3317 @alexchapman @averlice @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech Because it's 2026, how are the manufacturers supposed to pay for that?

GraceTechNerd 6d ago

@BlazieTech I find this approach unnecessary and exploitative. I understand software development takes time and money, but charging customers for updates is not a good idea. It leaves users stuck with outdated, insecure, and buggy software despite available fixes, and will likely push people away. Especially when similar devices cost less and include free updates.

Alex Chapman 6d ago

@GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech Yep exactly.

Kaitlynn 6d ago

@GraceTechNerd @J3317 @BlazieTech Yep I agree. I've heard of the BTSpeak and thought it seemed like a cool peace of tech, but I had no clue you had to pay for software updates. Definitely have lost interest now.

Adison verlice 6d ago

@[email protected] @[email protected] @[email protected] they're basically the new freedom scientific perpetual license now. don't blame you

Munchkinbear 6d ago

@Kingslayer @GraceTechNerd @J3317 Security updates are always included if you don't have a maintenance agreement, it's knew features that require a maintenance thing. @BlazieTech can correct me if I'm wrong, cC @dblazie @bblazie

@munchkinbear @Kingslayer @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech @dblazie @bblazie oh, well that's, not a hole lot better, like i said software updates should be free aspeshuly on a $6000 device, i think that's how mutch it costs if i remember correctly

Munchkinbear 6d ago

@J3317 @Kingslayer @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech @dblazie @bblazie the BTSpeak is $1200, it's the BTBraille 40 that's $6K. Again, I'm just a user not employed by the company. Any official answers will have to come from them, not me.

@munchkinbear @Kingslayer @GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech @dblazie @bblazie ah, i forgot about the BT braille lol

Tech Singer 6d ago

@Kingslayer @GraceTechNerd @J3317 @BlazieTech I disagree that the unit is a cool piece of tech, frankly, but I don't know how the company is supposed to stay afloat and keep writing updates if it doesn't charge for them. I have lost count of the devices which were sold with free updates and then stopped being updated when the company lost interest or the ability to pay developers. Even the Apples and Samsungs of this world update for free during only a limited period, and their cash available is far more than the adaptive tech companies can dream of.

Kaitlynn 6d ago

@techsinger @GraceTechNerd @J3317 @BlazieTech Yeah I think the cool factor for me more so came from the history behind the brand and such. I heard about the Braille and Speak from a long time ago but only really started learning about assistive tech in 2013 and that was just VoiceOver so definitely didn't get to be hands on with something like that. So seeing those notetaker style devices getting revived was exciting. And yeah it's so hard because while I do agree with what others in the thread have said about software updates I also do see the point of monetization as well. What I was thinking when I wrote my reply was of things like NVDA where they sell courses on using NVDA or possibly writing some kind of software that is separate from the BTSpeak and can be run on Linux as a whole but is optomized for the device. So then that way they're getting income from BTSpeak users and non BTSpeak users. but these ideas came from a tired brain so could have flaws.

Tech Singer 6d ago

@Kingslayer @GraceTechNerd @J3317 @BlazieTech I really can't, I don't think anyone can, overestimate what notetakers and devices like them were like in the late 80s and for about fifteen years afterwards. They were something new under the sun. They were really something different and earthshaking in history, that is, they effected the entire history of blind people. Before them, reading and writing significant amounts while moving around or even from home/work/school was either very difficult or completely impossible if you were blind. Even with low vision, it was only slightly easier. Having said that, the time for such products has, except maybe in education, passed. I like the idea, but as we can see, it's not really viable on its own, in my view. With respect, NVDA is not comparable. They are basically being sponsored by companies, as I understand it, and they are a charity. I don't think many people would really want to sponsor a product like the BTSpeak, would they? Why would any organization sponsor that, even if the manufacturer wasn't a business and wanted to shift to charitable status?

Kaitlynn 6d ago

@techsinger @GraceTechNerd @J3317 @BlazieTech Yeah that's a valid point. guess I was comparing apples to oranges there. Thanks for discussing this with me in good faith. :)

Tech Singer 6d ago

@GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech If I may ask, just as I think of it, what similar devices cost less and have free updates? The only devices I can think of are the ones from Orbit, and their hardware and software is somewhat substandard, in my respectful view.

GraceTechNerd 6d ago

@techsinger @BlazieTech I was thinking of the orbit speak, which does run android.

Tech Singer 6d ago

@GraceTechNerd @BlazieTech Yes, the orbit speak does cost less and run android, but again, the hardware and support is very poor, going both by what I'm hearing from others and my own experience. The complaints I'm seeing on the Orbit list, and the fixes I'm seeing, are not those of a reasonably working product, frankly.