JA Westenberg
Every "future of work" startup is trying to fix Slack which was built to fix email which was built to fix meetings. At some point you have to consider the possibility that it's not the software. Maybe work is just like this. Maybe the meeting could've been an email and the email could've been nothing.
Mar 7 at 6:04amTypefully
Show threadMastodon MigrationMar 7

@Daojoan

PowerPoint was the original sin. It's been all downhill since then.

Show threadHubert FiguièreMar 7
@Daojoan aren't they fixing email with chatbots? Chatbot write email, chatbot summarize and reply to the email. No Human Involved....
Show threadLuci Bitchface AngerfootMar 7
@hub @Daojoan is the problem lack of pomp and ceremony?
Show threadpedro 🍉Mar 7
@Daojoan gotta love all the tech bros asking Anthropic and OpenAI to create a replacement for Slack when there are like 10 open source alternatives to it.
Show threadJeff SmithMar 7
@Daojoan nothing beats a whiteboard or a napkin
Show threadCyberFrogMar 7
@Daojoan as a self proclaimed future thought leader on this subject I think forcing everyone back to a physical meeting is actually innovative now

mostly because it has been a generation since we did that
Show threadBenoît JonesMar 7

@Daojoan
I think the problem with a lot of work is that the objectives are intangible and nonaligned. This leads to interminable and inconclusive emails and meetings.

I work in construction, on a construction site. Everyone in our team knows what the (very tangible) objectives are (to build the tunnel safely and to the specified quality) and we all agree on that. Our meetings are as short as possible and very focused. Some are 2mins, some are 10mins, some are 45mins, but rarely longer.

Show threadOpen RiskMar 7
@huxley @Daojoan there is a name (even a book) for a lot of such work: Bullshit Jobs. It is not an attribute specific to the digital era but it's interesting to think how it might mutate in the age of "AI" - the ultimate bullshit generator.
Show threadBenoît JonesMar 7
@openrisk @Daojoan I have read Bullshit Jobs by David Graeber, and it makes similar arguments about 'meaningful work' but I think my point was slightly different in that it highlighted the need for aligned objectives.
Show threadOpen RiskMar 7
@huxley @Daojoan yes, there is a broad cluster of pathologies. I suppose you mean phenomena like internal organizational politics and such, that manifest in all hierarchies. Ultimately the incentives people have to participate, how their individual aspirations align with group objectives etc. "Digitizing" this mess has not the slightest chance of changing the dynamics 🤣
Show threadBenoît JonesMar 7

@openrisk @Daojoan
Yes, first, values need to be aligned. Then also metrics and incentives need to be aligned, otherwise people are trying to do the right thing against their self-interest, or selfishly doing the wrong thing.

There is another book called 'The subtle art of not giving a f*ck' by Mark Manson, which explains why it is better to first focus on values and metrics, rather than objectives and goals.

Show threadBenoît JonesMar 7
@openrisk @Daojoan
And you are right that digitising or using a different app doesn't change the underlying climate that drives behaviours.
Show threadOpen RiskMar 7

@huxley @Daojoan

In my unapologetic optimism I think there *is* great hope in digital tech.

While some fundamentals about our nature will never change, almost everything else society builds on top is malleable: conventions, contracts, means of book keeping etc., All these social behaviors are using whatever information technologies are available - and are in turn shaped by them.

But we are still in the phase of breaking things fast (and doing broken things faster) rather than building new.

Show threadShiri BailemMar 7
@Daojoan makes me think of the pattern where everyone once in a while the tech bros get together to try and "fix" transportation... and then disappear when they realize they've basically invented the bus.
Show threadPeter BryantMar 7

@Daojoan I read a Medium post a few years ago called “Meetings are the work”.

I think about that title all the time.

Show threadPeter BryantMar 7

@Daojoan Found the link

https://medium.com/@ElizAyer/meetings-are-the-work-9e429dde6aa3

Meetings *are* the work

Wherein I take aim at the common tech trope that people need to limit meetings to get work done.

Medium
Show threadShawnT 🔧🐀Mar 7
@Daojoan This email could've been [knocking on cube "door" frame] "Hey, sorry to interrupt, but what're your thoughts on..."
Show threadSammiMar 7
@phaysis @Daojoan I do think a lot of the crap can be solved this way. Just meet, have a coffee, kick around a few ideas then go do. We all used to do this back in the day.
Show threadDNAvinciMar 7
@SamanthaJaneSmith
In my consulting work I drop into a lot of different app ecosystems. Somehow I managed to avoid any Slack ecosystem until this very year.
1. Slack is legit terrible. It's worse than email. It has actually been eclipsed by Teams. That's wild.
2. People who do exactly as you said, or the DM equivalent, are the actually successful pattern.
@phaysis @Daojoan
Show threadSammiMar 7
@dnavinci @phaysis @Daojoan I hate teams!!!! Lol
Show threadJaanaMar 7
@Daojoan Or maybe, just maybe, we could have the damned meeting and be over it.
Show threadRobotistryMar 7

@Daojoan I don't think the problem is tools. I think the problem is that some people are good at being efficient with whatever tools they're given, some people can't figure out what counts as "wasting other peoples' time" and what counts as "necessary", other people don't care, and another group just likes being social and will use whatever tools are available to socialize instead of working. I have been all of those people at different times.

Meetings can be essential - status update meetings at the team lead level can surface potential project/level integration problems and allow mitigation before they escalate into crises. Emails can be essential - "wait, what did they say needed to be in the document?" Texts can be helpful - "The boiler's leaking again and I've already called emergency services to come cope with it." And sometimes phone calls are needed - "Our boiler's leaking for the third time this month. What, precisely, is the hold up in getting someone out to fix or replace it?"

Show threadFish in the PercolatorMar 8

@Daojoan is this regarding the Fivetran CEO post (won't call it "insights" as they did on the page) https://www.fivetran.com/blog/anthropic-please-make-a-new-slack ?

If so, I start to have some inkling why recently the interactions with that company went down the drains (with their code and system quality, and support agent interactions - some proxy to how the company generally operates).

Anthropic, please make a new Slack | Blog | Fivetran

Slack will be the Waterloo of closed data.

Show threadEFMar 8
@Daojoan there is nothing wrong with email. It is a tool and like all tools, it has limitations.
Show threadVlad 🇺🇦Mar 8
@Daojoan People forgot how to write long-form, with context and with clarity. That takes time but I guess it’s time nobody has anymore due to the pressures of work (must be faster always faster)