Mastodawn

My son bought a second-hand Windows 11 PC for games, and has been having BSOD issues with the graphics card since he got it. Out of desperation he tried installing Bazzite on it, which I encouraged, but was also trying not to get his hopes up, telling him that the some things might not work. But he reports that "absolutely everything works better than Windows".
I suggested he use KDE for the desktop, and he is blown away about how good everything looks, and how easy the user experience is. He has used Linux for a bit probably 7 or 8 years ago when he used a salvaged laptop at uni that had Ubuntu on it, and he remembers that being a bit janky and frustrating, but now he's decided that he'll wipe the Windows partition and stay with Linux.
So keep it up, clever people that are making Linux distros and software, you're winning.
#Linux #Bazzite #KDE #Steam

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Nazo

@stib It's worth noting too that Ubuntu is GNOME-based and he probably just didn't like that.

Though I won't deny that things have very definitely improved pretty quickly in the Linux world. I too recently finally tossed out Windows even as a long time gamer. I've been with MS since MS-DOS 6.22 and some Windows 3.1 for gaming, so for them to make me finally declare that Windows is completely beyond redemption and that I will never ever install it on my machine again kind of says something I think. I didn't stick with it because it was great. I put up with all their crap to a point. But Windows 10 was already pushing past what I would tolerate and then they made 11. I hope Microsoft goes bankrupt.

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Nechesh Feb 23

@nazokiyoubinbou @stib gnome ui is actively hostile to most users. I genuinely don't understand why anyone uses it these days.

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Nazo Feb 23

@nechesh @stib It's made to resemble Apple systems, so I suppose that those trying to escape Apple's grip probably find it more comfortable.

On the one hand, I'm ok with easing Apple users over. On the other hand, does it have to be so bloated and the default on so many things?

Sometimes it feels to me like GNOME has actually taken Apple's whole way of thinking. "We'll decide for you what's best so don't do any thinking for yourself anymore."

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stib Feb 23

@nazokiyoubinbou @nechesh Can confirm. As a rcovered MacOS fanboy I like the look of Gnome, when the look works and doesn't randomly chuck some light-themed windows in my fastidiously dark themed world because it seems impossible to consistently theme GTK apps without it being a full time job. KDE was always too windows-ish for me. I have begun to overcome my allergy to Qt though.
But these days I prefer ultra-minimalist tiling WMs like Sway. If I need widgets or control panels I'm happier using the terminal or a TUI app.

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Nazo Feb 23

@stib @nechesh Sadly the theming stuff seems to be hard on everything I guess. I think it's this sort of issue: https://xkcd.com/927/

They all do it a bunch of different ways and since no one seems to be able to agree on it it's just resulting in any attempts to fix it just adding to the problem instead.

Well, it's weird you're fine with QT since it's sort of the same system KDE is built on, just much more minimal. I've given LXQT a shot a few times and it's not bad though! It doesn't have much configuration, but it still gives the user more control over some basics than XFCE4 does. (I definitely can't get behind Sway though. Too minimal for me!)

But in the end, yeah, if I'm introducing an Apple user to Linux I'd tell them GNOME and if a Windows user I'd tell them KDE.

Standards

xkcd

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stib Feb 23

@nazokiyoubinbou @nechesh I think that's why I like Sway. All the configuration is more or less left up to you, and the whole ecosystem is designed to be tweaked by the user so the process is generally straightforward and well-documented.
Of course the downside it that all the configuration is more or less left up to you, so if you have more in your life than making your user interface on your lappietappie just perfect then you need to re-prioritise. But if I wasn't fiddling with dotfiles I'd probably be out doing crimes and making a ruckus so there's that …

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Mike

Feb 23

@nechesh @nazokiyoubinbou @stib to be fair. If your needs align with gnome. It's fine. I daily drive gnome I can customize the few things I want. And everything else just works out of the box.

I want to like kde but I'm always frustrated by it.

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stib Feb 23

@codemonkeymike @nechesh @nazokiyoubinbou Gnome seems to have copied the Apple philosphy of "we'll make everything really nice, but you won't be able to customise it because we know best", which works, until it doesn't. I'm a tweak-freak so eventually something about the desktop environment will enough me until I end up breaking things trying to fix it (for Gnome it was the way all the corners are getting rounder and rounder until the whole thing looks like it was designed by Fisher Price so that toddlers don't cut themselves on any sharp edges).
I mean I used to run Litestep on my XP machine. I modified the shell so much that I managed to completely remove explorer.exe. It was great, but not, in hindsight, the best use of my time.

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Mike

Feb 23

@stib @nechesh @nazokiyoubinbou meanwhile KDE (the most customizable DE ever) can't handle Alt + Tab properly.

You should be able to Alt + Tab. (keep holding alt) see all your icons... then hover over the icon you want to switch to.. and when you let go of alt, it switches to it.

Gnome, cinnamon, MacOS, Windows, etc all work like that.. yet somehow Plasma.. its not possible.

So yes.. even they seem to be silly opinionated

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stib Feb 23

@codemonkeymike
Wait, I'm pretty sure KDE has a task switcher, and it's invoked with alt+tab by default ...?
https://userbase.kde.org/System_Settings/Task_Switcher

@nechesh @nazokiyoubinbou

System Settings/Task Switcher - KDE UserBase Wiki

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Nazo Feb 23

@stib @[email protected] @nechesh It does indeed do that with alt-tab and you can configure a lot about the alt-tab behavior. I guess they want very very specific functionality (namely specific handling of mouse hovering,) but I think it can do all that in fact.

EDIT: They can't see my message though I guess. I see they're on fosstodon which I have blocked.

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Mike

Feb 23

@nazokiyoubinbou @stib @nechesh trust me.. i've been throuhg it a million times..

Alt tab can be configured to look ok.. but you mouse hover won't switch the app.. only click, tab or mouse wheel.

I know its a silly thing but workflow thing that other major DE's have and it's a big flow thing for me. I'm always shocked there is no way to make Plasma do it..

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stib Feb 23

@codemonkeymike
Ah, OK. Gotcha.
@nazokiyoubinbou @nechesh

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stib Feb 23

@nazokiyoubinbou It was probably also the hardware, it was a pretty underpowered old laptop he'd had at high school.
I've been on Windows since XP, since I switched from Mac when I had to start paying for my own computers when I went freelance, and Windows gave you far more bang for your buck with 3D animation and editing. Never really *liked* it, but it got the job done, and the software I used meant that the choice was really only Mac or Windows.
Then got employed again in a studio where we all used Macs, so went Mac again for a few years. Then when hardware upgrading time rolled around I did the maths and went back to a PC.
In the meantime the software I used changed from Lightwave and Adobe Premiere / After Effects to Blender and Resolve / Fusion, both of which can run, and indeed run much more snappily on Linux. So I bunged in an SSD and added a cheeky Arch partition to it and basically never used Windows again unless there was a legacy project I had to work on in an Adobe app.
That computer got worked to death and while I'm waiting for the wheels to turn I'm back on a Mac, and not liking the experience. In the years since I last used it MacOS has gone from being a great OS, albeit only on expensive gear, to being just meh, albeit only on expensive gear.