Mastodawn

Anon Opin Oct 13

Growing up, the main bus in my town was every 10 minutes and always packed. I didn't worry about timetables I just left the house and knew it would be there. Now it's every half hour and completely deserted. This is no coincidence. Fund buses properly and people will use them.

Estarriol, Terrorist Dragon Oct 13

have them reliable and plentiful and people use them.

Mike Taylor 🦕Oct 13

@Thebratdragon @anon_opin But also: as usage falls off, running routes becomes unprofitable, so companies run the buses less frequently. It's a vicious circle.

Entertainment Porpoises Only Oct 13

@mike @Thebratdragon @anon_opin have you considered that not everything should be required to run at a profit?

Mike Taylor 🦕Oct 13

@pikesley @Thebratdragon @anon_opin Yes, I have considered it and agreed the heck out of it.

The real question is whether the companies running these routes have considered it. I doubt it.

Entertainment Porpoises Only Oct 13

@mike @Thebratdragon @anon_opin ok, I'll go you one further: have you considered that none of this should be in private hands?

Mike Taylor 🦕Oct 13

@pikesley @Thebratdragon @anon_opin Yes, I have considered that and agree the heck out out it. But I don't see how to fix it.

Jon Wood Oct 14

@mike @pikesley @Thebratdragon @anon_opin the right people just have to want it. After that it’s quite simple, the council buys some busses and starts running routes. For extra value the council says to the current operators they’re going to do so, and asks if those operators fancy selling their busses and cutting their losses before their routes are abandoned because they cost 10x as much and run worse.

@jon @pikesley @mike @Thebratdragon @anon_opin buys some busses, buys a depot, employs mechanics to maintain them, employs admin staff to do the DVSA paperwork as a bus operator, pays the insurance, competes with the big cos who gets interested all of a sudden. Buying buses and setting up the stuff to run them isn't a 'quite simple' Friday afternoon jolly. Sorry I forgot about employing anyone to drive them/train drivers. Deals with Reformheads objecting to the depot, forgot that.

Entertainment Porpoises Only Oct 17

@hicksy2 @jon @mike @Thebratdragon @anon_opin

BETTER THINGS AREN'T POSSIBLE well done you

@pikesley @jon @mike @Thebratdragon @anon_opin I didn't say impossible, I was just being realistic.

Mike Taylor 🦕Oct 17

@hicksy2 @pikesley @jon @Thebratdragon @anon_opin Exactly. For councils to do this (which I would welcome), incentives need to be aligned. And I have no idea how to make that happen.

Entertainment Porpoises Only Oct 17

@mike @hicksy2 @jon @Thebratdragon @anon_opin

To speak in terms of "alignment of incentives" is to accept the Capitalist framing which has led us to our present hellscape where the only thing that matters is that The Money is comfortable

Mike Taylor 🦕Oct 17

@pikesley @hicksy2 @jon @Thebratdragon @anon_opin Well, not really. But if you think you can do this WITHOUT aligning incentives, I'll be happy to hear how you plan to coerce people to do things they don't want to do.

@mike @pikesley @jon @Thebratdragon @anon_opin what does 'aligning incentives' mean? Sounds very mealy-mouthed. I don't like that idea.

Mike Taylor 🦕

@hicksy2 @pikesley @jon @Thebratdragon @anon_opin I think it's a pretty clear concept. It means arriving at a situation where we all (the council, the bus users) want the same thing. For example, if the council could be shown that reducing or eliminating bus fares would result in more local rather than online shopping, befitting the area financially.

Entertainment Porpoises Only Oct 17

@mike @hicksy2 @jon @Thebratdragon @anon_opin

WHAT DO WE WANT?

Centrist tinkering

WHEN CAN WE EXPECT RESULTS?

We have to work within the constraints of the existing, obviously-rigged systems

Mike Taylor 🦕Oct 17

@pikesley @hicksy2 @jon @Thebratdragon @anon_opin

You say you want a revolution?
Well, you know.
We'd all love to see the plan.