George Takei 
🏳️🌈🖖🏽No mercy for this bozo.
cqd_sos@georgetakei
I wouldn't hesitate to support his (single use plastic) straw rule though, for men, women and children alike, as they're a major contributor to marine plastic pollution across the globe.
trenchworms@cqd_sos No. They aren't.
@trenchworms
Regarding the numbers, straws and stirrers are 8th on the list in the US, 9th globally.
https://oceanconservancy.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/09/ICCAnnualReport2024_Digital.pdf
Regarding the numbers, straws and stirrers are 8th on the list in the US, 9th globally.
https://oceanconservancy.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/09/ICCAnnualReport2024_Digital.pdf
AccordionBruce@cqd_sos @trenchworms
Depending on the numbers, and left out of that survey of beach plastic
If we want to include large floating plastic debris, #Greenpeace says at least 10% of all plastic in the ocean is abandoned fishing gear
So straws are low hanging fruit at best, and lead to abuse of #disabled people who need them at worst
https://www.sinergiaanimalinternational.org/single-post/2019/11/12/85-of-the-rubbish-at-some-parts-of-the-oceans-is-fishing-gear
85% of the rubbish at some parts of the oceans is fishing gear
A new report released by Greenpeace has concluded that lost or deliberately abandoned fishing gear is one of the biggest plastic polluters in the oceans, representing up to 85% of the rubbish on the seafloor on seamounts and ocean ridges, and in the Great Pacific Gyre. This number confirms the results of another study showing that fishing nets account for 46% of the trash found in the Great Pacific Garbage Patch, and the majority of the rest is composed of other industrial-level fishing gear. T
(a) Those numbers are all estimates, which focus on the gyres. Whereas the ICC numbers reflect what they actually collect from beaches and waterways.
(b) There are alternatives to single use plastic straws. For a suggestion, see image. (You brought a poor example, because sippy cups are actually in common use among the elderly and disabled).
@cqd_sos If your argument for straws being a major component of marine plastic pollution, globally, relies on a paper that assesses by count and on coasts alone, and does not mention FISHING NETS, which actually account for a major part of marine plastic pollution, then it's extremely hard to take you as a credible source in this conversation.
Straws make up 0.025% of the total plastics that enter the ocean. Treating them like a unique priority is like complaining about the flammability of an empty matchbox while your house is on fire.
People will genuinely twist themselves into knots about straws to save marine life but will not stop eating marine life to save marine life. Make it make sense?
@trenchworms
Source? If you're referring to the Greenpeace report, that's been addressed in my response to the other dude already.
You know, the oceans are large, which is why getting precise figures is so difficult. In fact, the only hard figures we have come from the ICC, whose 2024 report I previously mentioned.
@cqd_sos "Trump bad" is indeed true but it's indicative of an utterly captured neoliberal mindset to pretend like this is meaningful. Biden could have achieved a thousand time more impact just by approving fewer drilling permits himself.
Straws are a distraction and making them a priority is such classic ineffectual liberalism it will no doubt be studied for years to come (while our world implodes from actual meaningful threats that are ignored in favour of unhinged individualism).
@trenchworms
Bit of a rant, isn't it. Nobody said it was a priority, only that it was a problem. Addressing multiple issues at once is what we do all the time in modern societies, I would think.
Bit of a rant, isn't it. Nobody said it was a priority, only that it was a problem. Addressing multiple issues at once is what we do all the time in modern societies, I would think.
@cqd_sos You literally called them a "major contributor". Do you actually believe in anything you're saying or were you just tripping over yourself to agree with Jesse Watters as quickly as possible?
@trenchworms
Yes. Major contributor to marine pollution, according to ICC figures. Rank 8 in the US, 9 globally, if you don't mind me repeating what I told you already. Now show me the reputable study that says those figures were irrelevant.
Yes. Major contributor to marine pollution, according to ICC figures. Rank 8 in the US, 9 globally, if you don't mind me repeating what I told you already. Now show me the reputable study that says those figures were irrelevant.
(edit: numbers in pounds, revising)
(edit2: actually this study is unhinged and confusing -- the numbers add up to the pounds value, but their words imply that straws are counted per-item:
"STRAWS AND
STIRRERS = 415,957
That is enough plastic
straws and stirrers for
every Galapagos
penguin to have
346 each."
There are 1500 - 4700 Galapagos penguins in the wild; 1800 if we just go by Wikipedia. If those numbers are in pounds, then even the highest estimate puts it at 88 pounds of straws (i.e. 4400 straws) per penguin. So my only takeaway is that they are counting straws per-item.)
Which means my initial numbers were right:
3.6 million kgs of plastic waste recovered
416,000 straws recovered, weighing approx 0.5g each = 208kgs of straws recovered
Straws recovered were therefore 0.0058% of total.
So yes.
By your own cited study.
I am happy to say that I find 210kgs of straws -- less than 1% of 1% of the recovered plastic -- is pretty fucking irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
And that's WITHOUT counting fishing debris. The Greenpeace study you have a problem with literally calculates straws to me MORE of a problem than your study. And it's STILL. FUCKING. IRRELEVANT.
Can/should we get rid of single use plastics when possible? Yes.
Are straws the place to agree with right wing ghouls for this purpose? Absolutely the fuck not.
@trenchworms
No, it's correct. The numbers for the individual categories are items collected. They don't add up to the total of items because the top 10 categories aren't exhaustive. Meaning there's a lot of other stuff they picked up that doesn't fit those categories.
No, it's correct. The numbers for the individual categories are items collected. They don't add up to the total of items because the top 10 categories aren't exhaustive. Meaning there's a lot of other stuff they picked up that doesn't fit those categories.
@cqd_sos Then my second edit definitely stands.
Is 0.006% of the world's marine plastic really worth saying "Um actually, this right wing monster is technically right?"
Get your priorities straight.
@trenchworms
Show me your calculation, please, based on the numbers from the report. Seems you're having a minor problem with basic arithmetic.
Show me your calculation, please, based on the numbers from the report. Seems you're having a minor problem with basic arithmetic.
From the report:
Total waste in kgs: 3,612,215 (pg 21)
Total straws/stirrers (I'm happy to assume these are all straws): 415,957 (pg 15, pg 21)
Approximate weight of 415,957 straws at 0.5g each (rounded up from 0.42 grams): 207,978.5g = 207.9785kg
% of straws in total plastic: 207.9785kg / 3,612,215kg = 0.00575764454%
What am I missing?
@trenchworms
You're missing that you can't use weight, because you only have a weight total that includes all sorts of stuff, not just plastic. That, I thought, was implied when I said those categories aren't exhaustive.
Mind you, those are volunteers who're cleaning up beaches and waterways, extensively keeping protocol along the way, for our all benefit. They don't just throw something back into the water when they find it isn't plastic. Might be wood. Might be metal. All part of the total.
@cqd_sos I don't know what to tell you.
If you think that 210kg of plastic on a global scale for a year of collection -- out of MILLIONS of kgs of other refuse being collected -- is relevant, then I don't think anything I do will convince you otherwise.
Enjoy screaming into fedi threads to support right wingers who would see you choke to death on smog for a laugh, I guess. You do you. I hope it serves you well.
@trenchworms
It is extremely relevant, because it helps us extrapolate. Plastic doesn't vanish, you know, it only becomes smaller and smaller in the oceans' grind, until it enters the food chain and, eventually, your precious body.
The invaluable work those volunteers do helps us understand how much more waste might be swimming out there, helps us understand that, at some point for certain, action will be required. Better sooner than later, to buy us time for better technologies to arrive.