MbinguSep 12, 2024
jwz
Neither Elon Musk Nor Anybody Else Will Ever Colonize Mars: Mars does not have a magnetosphere. Any discussion of humans ever settling the red planet can stop right there, but of course it never does. Do you have a low-cost plan for, uh, creating a...
https://jwz.org/b/ykZC
Mars

Neither Elon Musk Nor Anybody Else Will Ever Colonize Mars: Mars does not have a magnetosphere. Any discussion of humans ever settling the red planet can stop right there, but of course it never does. Do you have a low-cost plan for, uh, creating a gigantic active dynamo at Mars's dead core? No? Well. It's fine. I'm sure you have some other workable, sustainable plan for shielding live Mars ...

Sep 12, 2024 at 3:02amjwz.org
Show thread❓ucblockheadSep 12, 2024
@jwz At best Mars will be like Antarctica. A research base that people spend significant time at, but where no one stays permanently and all supplies are shipped in
Show thread🅺🅸🅼 🆂🅲🅷🆄🅻🆉:~$ ▓Sep 12, 2024
@jwz Still hoping that Musk will go there himself with a one way ticket. The world would be a better place the second he left.
Show threadPeter KrausSep 12, 2024
@jwz I think that's a bit disingenuous. Musk is not the only one "working" on the Mars problem - ESA does some research on it too. The doctoral students working on/with Mars Regolith simulants in our department are not dumb, they know anything built there will have to use local materials and provide radiation shielding. Just because fusion is not going to happen in the next 50 years, we don't stop researching it - and we learn from the things that don't work. Materials science is the same.
Show threadmmbySep 12, 2024

@pkraus @jwz yes but it's also part of this research to figure out what is possible and to identify further challenges if they arise - e.g. if it turns out that breathing in Mars dust will reduce life expectancy by 50% I believe ESA will take that into account and hedge expectations accordingly

while for venture capitalists that is not a research/development problem, it's a paragraph in terms of service and liability waivers

Show threadMastodon MigrationSep 12, 2024

@jwz

One other big problem with Mars colonization that very few people talk about is that there are perchlorates everywhere, which is very poisonous to humans and very tough on equipment. Perchlorates are basically bleach, and if you injest even a little bit it wrecks your thyroid. So, to live on Mars, humans will have to figure out how to live in a devilishly poisonous place.

https://www.space.com/21554-mars-toxic-perchlorate-chemicals.html

Toxic Mars: Astronauts Must Deal with Perchlorate on the Red Planet

The toxic chemical perchlorate may be good news for the possibility of life on Mars, but it will pose a danger to exploring astronaut crews.

Space
Show threadGaladSep 12, 2024
@mastodonmigration @jwz As I recall NASA is actually working on this exact issue.
Show threadMatti JärvinenSep 12, 2024

@jwz there's this NASA idea on how to create a magnetic shield, but it's way beyond humanity to achieve for a long, long time.

https://astrobiology.nasa.gov/news/how-to-give-mars-an-atmosphere-maybe/

NASA Astrobiology

Show threadLucy🍉 antifascistSep 12, 2024
@jwz don't worry, he's doing his best to make Earth as inhospitable as Mars is.
Show threaddiskySep 12, 2024
@jwz Yeah. Imagine what could be done here, with all of that dumb money.
Show threadxs4me2Sep 12, 2024

@jwz

Still it would be great if Musk went there!

Show threadMadies ScythianSep 12, 2024
@jwz A few billion years ago, before the smaller size of Mars made it cool down & solidify, Mars probably did have a magnetic field & was able to retain more of an atmosphere. When Mars cooled, solar wind removed most of the atmosphere.
If we're going to build a base away from Earth, at least build it on the Moon, where we'd be able to assist Matt Damon in a few weeks.
Show threadLanda Sep 12, 2024
@madies I think no matter where it is built the most important thing is to never send Matt Damon there ;)
@jwz
Show threadThe Retro Timer 💾Sep 12, 2024

@jwz We might, in the far future and at great expense, have outposts on other planets. I still believe in this, although I'll never live to see it.

What I find comical (or sad, or worrying) is how often Mars is mentioned in the context of Earth's climate degrading...

No matter how bad Earth gets, it will always be orders of magnitude better than any other planet.

Show threadKennethSep 14, 2024

@carlosefr
True. A wrecked biosphere (our own doing, and by own standards) would still be chugging along after our current mode of civilization is gone. And greenhouse gasses would virtually cease...! All of which is to say... Earth Abides.

@jwz

Show threadMark MifsudSep 12, 2024

@jwz

This reminds me of the idionut I once interacted with claiming that it's imperative that we colonise Mars.

Even if Mars had a magnetosphere, it would still be impossible to colonise.

There's no oxygen. There is no extractable fuel source. Air has more toxic, abrasive dust than anything.

It's even totally useless to send 2 people, let alone colonies.

Show threadQuark MakerSep 12, 2024

@jwz Maybe he, like his hero, has concepts of a plan.

I'll second (or third, or fourth) the recommendation Musk go to Mars and stay there. I know about 112 million folk who can also go there and be his neighbors. Permanently.

Show threadJessica 🏳️‍⚧️ (she/her)Sep 12, 2024
@jwz Well according to actual scientists, human being can only last maximum of 4 years on Mars. And I really hope Elon get to go there, even if he comes back earlier than 4 years, he will have cancer due to radiation from the sun.
Show threadJon PENNYCOOKSep 12, 2024

@jwz
I'm hoping Musk goes bankrupt trying.

I'm sure I'm not the first to mention this, but even if colonisation was practical, due to the conditions, the society would have to be either communist or a feudal/slave/serf society - presumably the latter would appeal more to Musk than the former, but where would he get the slaves/serfs from?

I think Musk would be more in favour of the Total Recall model where oxygen is earned and can be turned off.

Show threadMoose Jolly HolcombSep 12, 2024
@jwz if we ever intended to make Mars habitable it probably requires planning on the millenia scales, or at least a large number of centuries. We can't even plan most software projects out more than like 2 to 4 weeks right now. So yeah not happening any time soon.
Show threadbluGillSep 12, 2024
@jwz mars is the most human life friendly after earth so it is the best choice if you want a colony. However there are a lot of unsolved problems to solve before we attamht it.
Show threadPatrick Morris MillerSep 12, 2024
@bluGill @jwz Remember what Bill Hicks said about the big drop-off after the third largest army in the world? On the human life friendliness graph, there is Earth and then there is *nothing*.
Show threadjwzSep 12, 2024
@bluGill And bleach may be the most human-life-friendly beverage after kerosene. So fuckin' what.
Show threadJef PoskanzerSep 14, 2024
@jwz