Mastodawn

Sonny Mar 10, 2024

About the true purpose of systemd

I've been involved with #GNOME, #KDE, #freedesktop and #postmarketOS, ...

I've met @pid_eins and other prominent figures behind closed doors

I can confirm from first-hand experience that systemd is indeed a conspiracy to make better operating systems with Linux

#systemd #Linux #postmarketOS

Show thread

okanogen VerminEnemyFromWithin Mar 10, 2024

@sonny @pid_eins
Define "better".
I would define "better" as more stable, predictable, fast with minimal disk and hardware, easily installed quickly and customized, easy to troubleshoot, secure, compatible with the tools I've been using for decades.
I get all this out of a systemd free OS, so this is a fix for a problem I never had.
Although, now I DO have problems because many packages are now dependent on systemd. Why? Why the desperation to drop support for other init systems?

Show thread

Wolfgang Mar 10, 2024

@Okanogen @sonny @pid_eins Same reason why we’re doing away with Xorg and switching to Wayland.

Because despite the old-school init systems being touted as simple, elegant, stable and just way better than systemd (by some people, anyway), you don’t see a lot of people rushing to maintain and develop them.

OpenRC is pretty much the only viable modern non-systemd init system for general use, but it’s being developed with Gentoo in mind.

Show thread

okanogen VerminEnemyFromWithin Mar 10, 2024

@notthebee @sonny @pid_eins
Who is "we"? And if something doesn't work for you, good for you, don't use it. I'm not forcing you to use i3WM, am I?

Show thread

mil Mar 11, 2024

@Okanogen @notthebee @sonny @pid_eins I would like that “we”, for educational reasons, to be forced to use a tiling WM like i3 or xmonad until proficient. There is more than one way. Wayland & systemd kill this polyculture. Most users are used to remote managed desktop - a problem if your wm or compositor is nested - which one gets my Window switch key sequence? How do I control that? “Better” Architecture looses to Muscle memory,

Show thread

Wolfgang Mar 11, 2024

@mil I for one would like to force (for educational reasons) people who oppose things like Wayland and systemd, to spend some time maintaining the X.Org or init.d/upstart/etc. codebase

Show thread

okanogen VerminEnemyFromWithin Mar 11, 2024

@notthebee @mil
Upstart? Lol. There's a reason I use -Ubuntu in searches.

Show thread

mil

@Okanogen @notthebee I am open to different Init & UI systems. I also understand that Xorg is falling appart due to old age. I have seen Inits come and go. “Better” must be seen from the application/user perspective too. Applications differ. One size cannot fit all. What happens if the only way to do something cannot possibly work for a certain application? I oppose creeping monoculture eg. Systemd’s modularity is an opinionated one-way street.