Carl T. Bergstrom

Myth: academics make bank flying around giving talks.

Reality: prestigious university invites me out. I fly across the country and speak free. I front the cost and submit for reimbursement. First they lose the paperwork. Then they reject it because of a digital signatures. Now, six months later, they reject it again, because the receipt does not show the last four digits of my credit card so they don’t know if I actually bought the ticket.

They heard me talk. How did they think I got there?

Sep 27, 2023 at 9:56pmWeb
Show threadRosy MathsSep 27, 2023
@ct_bergstrom 😡
Show threadBen PfaffSep 27, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Universities take longer to process reimbursements than anyone else, and apply more ridiculous restrictions than anyone else. When I was a grad student, I hated it.
Show threadOfer KedemSep 27, 2023
@blp @ct_bergstrom Something my grad school (Weizmann) did really well - they would actually give me a cash advance for the whole trip. Afterwards, when I submitted receipts, we'd make whatever small adjustment was needed, in either direction.
Show threadOblomovSep 28, 2023
@blp @ct_bergstrom you got reimbursements as a student?
Show threadBen PfaffSep 28, 2023
@oblomov Yes, I was working on sponsored research.
Show threadOblomovSep 28, 2023
@blp oh you got an early start on the hate. Not sure if I should congratulate you about it ;-)
Show threadLynda DelphSep 27, 2023
@ct_bergstrom lol ‘How did they think I got there.’ Can’t tell you how many times I thought the very same thing.
Show threadJill the PillSep 27, 2023
@ct_bergstrom
Time for academics to start insisting on remote talks: for climate, for the time and fatigue of traveling, for time fighting the paperwork, for covid exposure.
Show threadDavePerrino ✅Sep 27, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Lesson Learned: the next time this institution calls and requests your presence. You tell them, of course, let me know what travel arrangements you’ve made for me. 😉
Show threadColin DanbySep 27, 2023

@DavePerrino @ct_bergstrom
The people doing the inviting are not the same as the people processing reimbursements. It's an interesting question, though, whether they could just buy the ticket for you -- we do it when we fly out job candidates, so it must be possible.

Don't even get me started on the hoops non-US folks have to jump through to get reimbursed.

Show threadDr. ir. Brian R. PauwSep 28, 2023
@DavePerrino @ct_bergstrom letting external party (B) pay for tickets and hotels is not allowed at my institute (A). Something something anti-corruption or so. There is a way to let B pay, but it involves A paying first and organizing everything, then sending a bill to B for payment. That never works and is overcomplicated, so I usually end up paying from our group’s budget just to avoid the ridiculous admin overhead. My time is (very) limited.
Show threadBill HookerSep 27, 2023
@ct_bergstrom I used to lie and say I had no money and no credit card, to force the stingy bastards to pay upfront.
Show threadkfnagleSep 27, 2023
@ct_bergstrom I’ll never forget overhearing one of my students talking about our “fat salaries” 😶
Show threadFaraiweSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom I gather you won't be returning there, then
Show threadMadhu VenkadesanSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Naturally, you mustered a murder of crows to carry you there and back. Who flies in aluminum tubes when you could have the dangling open air experience?
Show threadMekkiSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom One time, I was invited to a talk at a US conference. At the border, the agent, trying to determine if I needed a work VISA, asked, straight faced, "So, are you getting PAID for giving this talk at the academic conference?" I laughed so hard I think the people behind me were worried I was going to get arrested by border agents.
Show threadMegan Lynch (she/her)Sep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Gotta play hardball like Maria Bamford and don't show up 'til they've made out a check. https://ecoevo.social/@ml/111113588351901115
Megan Lynch (she/her) (@[email protected])

Maria Bamford on how she got paid to speak the University of Minnesota. "Normally the college does not pay for commencement speakers" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV5qcto2IRs @[email protected]

ecoevo.social
Show threadCarl T. BergstromSep 28, 2023
@ml That ending!
Show threadMegan Lynch (she/her)Sep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Wasn't that stupendous?
Show threadwhoopallaSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom isn't that from «Surely You're Joking, Mr. Feynman!»?
Show threadNiciHW🦋Sep 28, 2023

@ct_bergstrom that’s utterly absurd

And a waste of your extraordinary brain power

☹️☹️☹️

Show threadLinksySep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom I'm super assertive bordering aggressive in these situations. Imma make sure I get my money lol
Show threadherzbruchSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom I want to quote a former colleague: We‘re partly being paid in fun.
Show threadDr. ir. Brian R. PauwSep 28, 2023
@herzbruch @ct_bergstrom you don’t think fun happens in industry too? 😉
Show threadherzbruchSep 28, 2023
@doc @ct_bergstrom I left academia for a corporate job in 2014. Am being paid in money now, which is kind of nice, and nothing to complain on the fun part 😉
Show threadDr. ir. Brian R. PauwSep 28, 2023
@herzbruch @ct_bergstrom Happy to hear that. I also strongly advise students these days to keep their eyes open towards non-academic careers as the academic career options are very bleak. I only recommend it if you absolutely cannot consider doing anything else than science.
Show threadherzbruchSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom @doc That‘s very sad, in a way.
Show threadDr. ir. Brian R. PauwSep 28, 2023
@herzbruch @ct_bergstrom Oh, absolutely.
But several things will have to change first before it becomes a viable career option again.
The current metrics-driven, limited-term contract nonsense directly hinders doing any sort of in-depth, reliable science. I've seen more good people forced to leave than I'd like. All they wanted to do was to just be able to do science in peace.
Secondly, salaries need to be competitive with industry salaries. 1/2
Show threadDr. ir. Brian R. PauwSep 28, 2023
@herzbruch @ct_bergstrom 2/2 The argument that "sure, salaries are bad, but we get to do what we like" is a poor argument. People in industry can have as much fun as in academia, and I'm sure people with top salaries are also very much doing what they like.
In the eternal words of my partner: "why do you [academics] accept these poor job conditions? I thought you were supposed to be smart!"
Anyway, for me, things aren't bad, but my colleagues are suffering and need a revolution.
Show threadherzbruchSep 28, 2023
@doc @ct_bergstrom I returned into the German system after being at Leiden and Stanford as a grad student. I stayed for 3 years, at 1 point decided the German „you should be happy that we took you so shut up“ is not in line with the shitty system (compared to where I came from). I decided I could go someplace where I don’t have to be grateful for no money no time and - yes - almost no fun. (The quoted colleague was at Stanford, which is fun but not the real world)
Show threadFrederik ElwertSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Same in Germany. It was remarkably different when I taught in Switzerland for a semester: There, admin really gave me the feeling that they were happy to have me, and while there was still a bit of paperwork, they made the process as smooth as possible. I was quite surprised that it's actually possible to handle things this way (which should be the norm).
Show threadMaxSep 28, 2023

@ct_bergstrom I was going to ask if it was Trump University but that closed down years ago and also you said prestigious, so it seems unlikely.

Jokes aside, sounds like a shocker, hope you get paid. It's it the first time you have spoken for them? Does this happen regularly with other places you have spoken at? Pity, it must leave a sour taste.

Show threadCarl T. BergstromSep 28, 2023
@PossiblyMax This happens constantly. The top ivys are often the top offenders. One spent a year trying (not) to process my reimbursement.
Show threadPeter Bowden 🚗🔌⚡ 😷💉💉💉💉Sep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Next invitation accept on the grounds that they pay for transportation up front. What do you have to lose?
Show threadMichael BaudisSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Maybe you shouldn’t use a bird as avatar?</ducks>
Show threadCarl T. BergstromSep 28, 2023
@mbaudis excellent point.
Show threadRevK Sep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom ah, but it won’t if you pay using a phone :-)
Show threadSebastian BuhaiSep 28, 2023
@ct_bergstrom Oh man, I really thought this could only happen in mickey mice universities from, e.g., Romania and such…
Show threadAntonio Páez 🇲🇽🇨🇦Sep 28, 2023

@ct_bergstrom @nilsskirnir

May be you were there talking in your spare time 🤣🤣🤣

Show threadMarshall EubanksSep 28, 2023

@ct_bergstrom Yeah, I had that trouble relatively recently. "Your hotel receipt does not show it was for four nights. We have to assume it was only 1 night, and then it is too expensive a hotel to be fully reimbursed."

I never did get the rest of the $