Mastodawn

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 13, 2023

Biden is old, but capable, honest, ethical, and hard working.

Trump is old, but dangerous, lying, treasonous, and a fascist.

One thing is not like the other.

Please do go away, Mitt Romney. He never could bring himself to admit his party is the worst thing about this country.

Romney: Biden, Trump should both ‘stand aside’ in 2024 |
https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4203104-romney-biden-trump-should-both-stand-aside-in-2024/

Romney: Biden, Trump should both ‘stand aside’ in 2024

Sen. Mitt Romney (R-Utah) said on Wednesday that he wishes President Biden and former President Trump would stand aside and allow both political parties to choose new leadership for the 2024 presidential contest. Romney, 76, made the comment while talking to reporters in his office following his retirement announcement earlier in the day. “I think…

The Hill

Kevin Leecaster Sep 13, 2023

@TonyStark
It's so frustrating that so many non-Democrats get attention for saying what Democrats "should" do.

Second guessing Biden is a mistake a lot of people are making.

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 13, 2023

@GreenFire Bit of a disease this week.

All the flouncy complaining in the midst of a crisis often discourages voter turnout and participation (and often culminates in someone stating they're not going to vote because they're not delighted by the options).

Elections have consequences and it’s only been a couple of years since we’ve gotten Trump away from the controls.

It’s going to be a choice of Biden or Trump. Undermining the Democratic candidate is no laughing matter.

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 14, 2023

@TonyStark @GreenFire I’ve run into at least three “there’s no point in voting” idiots in the last week and a half here on Mastodon. We have got to keep shutting that bullshit down, but man it’s depressing sometimes. How can anybody be that cavalier about other peoples lives that would be destroyed.

Kevin Leecaster

@Pineywoozle @TonyStark
Somehow we've got to make it clear that the people that don't vote because #BothSidesAreBad are no better than are MAGAts.

They're essentially saying that they're privileged enough to not have to worry about what the damage GOP policies cause to people's lives or our planet.

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 14, 2023

@GreenFire @TonyStark We need to tell them in the hopes that someone who follows them will hear it. I’ve been dealing with this garbage since 2016. Most of the small % that push this aren’t going to change, but the people listening to them might. The trick is to inform them & leave that information in their timeline where they can’t hide it from followers, then block the motherfuckers & move the fuck on. Part of their game is to suck up time and energy. #farL

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 14, 2023

@Pineywoozle @GreenFire GreenFire and I have both been here for awhile and it’s a real battle. I’m glad there are more of us now ally up.

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 14, 2023

@TonyStark @GreenFire 👍

@TonyStark @Pineywoozle @GreenFire

It's great to hear there are people who are likewise annoyed by the self-defeating nonsense that is "there's no point in voting"

Even if you think they have given us a twig for a sword of democracy the answer is to use it to poke them in the eye, not disarm yourself and lie down and take whatever comes to yourself and your community.

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 14, 2023

@doctormo @Pineywoozle @GreenFire Well said.

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 15, 2023

@doctormo @TonyStark @GreenFire They actually believe what Sarandon said, that electing a Rethug will make it so bad it will speed the revolution and they will get their unicorn fart version of socialism. And…they think we will join them in their glorious revolution when the reality is brutal fascism will overwhelm us all. We will eventually overthrow it but not for their BS and not without massive suffering and sacrifice.

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 15, 2023

@GreenFire @Pineywoozle @doctormo Pineywoozle- everyone should read this post.

Letting Trump get elected pushed the country further to the right. They were wrong and we’ve all suffered and not that many will admit they were wrong. A lot of the criticism of Democrats still comes that group- the stuff that’s undermining us all right now.

cnkraeh Sep 15, 2023

@Pineywoozle @doctormo @TonyStark @GreenFire

in some states including my own... Biden is sure not to win.. so I feel free to elevate a third party..

its too bad the democrat leaders put us in this position by keeping Biden on... I think he is a sure loser .. we will not have pandemic levels of turn out #politics #uspol

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 15, 2023

@GreenFire @Pineywoozle @doctormo @cnkraeh Nobody falls for bullshit like this here.

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 15, 2023

@cnkraeh @doctormo @TonyStark @GreenFire You don’t know that. You don’t know that your vote won’t have an effect. Even just in the primary. When the votes of all the states are counted there might be a voter in a purple state who sees your added support & that’s the tipping point for them. Maybe your vote is the one that puts it over the edge mathematically & changes how the media reports it. We need EVERY voice raised. #farL #USPol

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 15, 2023

@cnkraeh @doctormo @TonyStark @GreenFire Biden actually isn’t a sure loser. tRump is less popular than he was in 2020 when we beat the socks off him. You’re repeating GOP & Ru talking points and if it’s deliberate shame on you and if it’s because you just don’t realize it then please do more homework. Either way I’m gonna block because I won’t help spread those lies.

Mark Wyner Won’t Comply

@Pineywoozle @doctormo @TonyStark @GreenFire that thinking is SO dangerous. And it’s unreal just how privileged folks are to suggest this. The consequences are real, as you’ve noted.

Art - US Expat in Spain Sep 15, 2023

@Pineywoozle @doctormo @TonyStark @GreenFire Never trust puritanical anarchists. History shows how ineffective they end up being.

Jack the Waterlogged Count Sep 15, 2023

@doctormo @TonyStark @Pineywoozle @GreenFire The symbol of the Haudenosaunee was five twigs, reproduced by the five arrows in the eagle's claw on the great seal of the United States.

Put enough twigs together, nothing can break them.

Sane Thinker Sep 15, 2023

@doctormo @TonyStark @Pineywoozle @GreenFire People should vote, but it is near useless. Getting to the polls it's going to be difficult when they are on fire, or you have to swim to them. If you think voting is enough, you are absolutely wrong. The system has led us to oblivion.

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 15, 2023

@gdeihl @Pineywoozle @GreenFire @doctormo No one is saying voting is all we need to do and it’s super annoying when people roll up and claim anyone said it. It’s ridiculous. And old and tired.

Sane Thinker Sep 15, 2023

@TonyStark @Pineywoozle @GreenFire @doctormo What's getting old and tired is the climate crisis that is going to cause our extinction. Our passivity makes us complicit. One party is fascist, and the other one is inept, not calling for or envisioning the profound changes we need if we are to have a future on this planet.

Tony, Pretty Much Sep 15, 2023

@doctormo @gdeihl @GreenFire @Pineywoozle I’m not complicit and see you’re fairly misinformed, possibly intentionally, looking at your other posts.

I’d say the fascist one is a little more important at the moment. Enjoy your evening.

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 15, 2023

@TonyStark @doctormo @gdeihl @GreenFire I read his TL & I’m just gonna block.

jz.tusk Sep 15, 2023

@Pineywoozle @TonyStark @doctormo @gdeihl @GreenFire

I'm just going to trust your eval, and mute.

Sane Thinker Sep 15, 2023

@jztusk @Pineywoozle @TonyStark @doctormo @GreenFire Way to think for yourself.

Sane Thinker Sep 15, 2023

@TonyStark @Pineywoozle @GreenFire @doctormo Sure, we all participated, but those in power made the lies and Kool-Aid. It's coming to death one way or another, either passively or fighting. The planet has decided.

jz.tusk Sep 15, 2023

@Pineywoozle @GreenFire @TonyStark

I developed a two-reply approach when dealing with them on-line.

1 - "I plan to work getting out the vote for the best chance we have of keeping the fascists out, i.e. the Dem candidate. We'd love to have you join us at any time."

2 - "We are all going to get a pres. admin. in 2024. I hope you enjoy the one we get."

And that's it. Like you say, don't waste any more time or energy on them. Back to cat pics and GOTV.

Daniel Kochanowicz Sep 14, 2023

@GreenFire @Pineywoozle @TonyStark Case in point: Susan Sarandon.

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 14, 2023

@Blueskyfox @GreenFire @TonyStark One of her things is to attack Kamala Harris. Anytime someone spends more of their energy attacking Dems, than attacking the real problem, which is Republicans and fascists, I’m gonna have an issue with them.

Princess Unikitty Sep 15, 2023

@GreenFire @Pineywoozle @TonyStark

Not saying people shouldn't vote but like... it's up to you to convince them. People don't automatically agree with your axioms and point of view. You want more people to vote? Get out there and get them registered. Do outreach. Don't just talk smack online. Liberal outrage isn't cute outside the blue-team echo chambers.

Especially don't say "the non-voters are as bad as the bad-guy-voters" - that's not even how the math works out.

Kevin Leecaster Sep 15, 2023

@unikitty @Pineywoozle @TonyStark
You are wrong about that. Open to reevaluating other positions you hold?

An unusually robust survey of the 2016 electorate. In addition to having asked people how they voted, Pew’s team verified that they did, giving us a picture not only of the electorate but also of those who didn’t vote.

The data also makes another point very clear: Those who didn’t vote are as responsible for the outcome of the election as those who did. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2018/08/09/new-data-makes-it-clear-nonvoters-handed-trump-the-presidency/

New data makes it clear: Nonvoters handed Trump the presidency

A third of nonvoters were under 30. More than half of voters were over 50.

The Washington Post

Princess Unikitty Sep 15, 2023

@GreenFire @Pineywoozle @TonyStark

Can't read the article because of paywall. And sure, in aggregate, if more non-voters had voted the way you wished they did, the outcome could have been different. I'm familiar with the graph I'm including as well.

That said, non-voters being a large plurality doesn't make them as bad as Trump voters on an individual basis. Better they spectate rather than support the other team.

Additionally, consider wondering WHY those non-voters aren't flocking to vote Team Blue. Maybe the Dems aren't delivering what they want and need. Maybe "harm reduction" and "lesser of two evils" isn't a compelling pitch. I vote Dem regularly in my deep Blue coastal state (where it makes very little difference). Meanwhile, the state level Democratic Party has a monopoly but still can't manage to deliver bold or Visionary changes we so desperately need. They actively fight progressive candidates and causes. Maybe the problem isn't just the voters.

Kevin Leecaster Sep 15, 2023

@unikitty @Pineywoozle @TonyStark
Nonvoters are a social scourge in a democracy, #JustSayin

They don't care what happens to other people based on their choices. They'd rather pretend that they didn't cause the problems that they could have helped us to avoid.

They're basically spoiled brats, but there have always been too many of those as far as I can tell so I don't know what to do about them or the harm they cause.

Princess Unikitty Sep 15, 2023

@GreenFire @Pineywoozle @TonyStark

Sure. In a world where everyone agrees that the Dems are the good guys, the people who don't vote look like jerks. Unfortunately we live in a world where Team Blue and Team Red have basically split the electorate down the middle. That cartoon may be accurate from your perspective but it's not convincing to people who don't share it. And FWIW, I do agree at least that the Repubs are quite bad.

Edit to add: don't forget that a Republican strategy is to make it more difficult to vote. In those cases, you're blaming the victims. Dismissing the disenfranchised as 'spoiled' is paternalistic and weird and helps exactly nothing.

If you wanna snark-post about how a majority of [non-] voters are bad and dumb, I'm sure Daily Kos would love to have you.

P.s.: Dems also *aren't* doing enough but that's a separate problem.

Kevin Leecaster Sep 15, 2023

@unikitty @Pineywoozle @TonyStark
"Dems aren't doing enough" 😢

So you're going to let Republicans take away people's healthcare, demonize people with alternative lifestyles, and burn our planet up with unmitigated #GlobalWarming

Sorry, but yes, I do find that to be a disgusting attitude that obviously doesn't care about other people's suffering since they must feel privileged enough to be protected from the suffering.

Princess Unikitty Sep 15, 2023

@GreenFire @Pineywoozle @TonyStark

I said earlier that I vote for Dems even though I live in a deep Blue state and it doesn't matter much. You're not even reading or engaging in good faith. Thanks for your time. Good luck!

@pineywoozle ‘s #3WordNote Sep 15, 2023

@unikitty @GreenFire @TonyStark Maybe you don’t realize that your constant dismissal of Dems as the “almost as bad guys who aren’t doing enough” IS enough to get someone else not to vote. Your words which repeat his propaganda precisely have exactly the effect Putin wants. BTW Dems’d do all the things you want if they could get a fully functional Congress their full terms That requires votes from as many people as ANY of us can persuade. #farL

Princess Unikitty Sep 15, 2023

@Pineywoozle @GreenFire @TonyStark