Bread and CircusesMay 2, 2023

It can be argued that electric vehicles are an improvement when replacing ICE vehicles.

But that misses a much bigger point — which is that the very best car is *not* an electric car. The very best car is no car at all!

Building electric cars requires massive use of fossil fuels, including petrochemicals for the manufacture of plastics. In addition, mining of lithium for batteries as well as trawling for other minerals in the deep ocean is environmentally disastrous, killing biodiversity while polluting our water, soil, and air.

LITHIUM EXTRACTION — https://www.euronews.com/green/2022/02/01/south-america-s-lithium-fields-reveal-the-dark-side-of-our-electric-future

DEEP-SEA MINING — https://climatejustice.social/@breadandcircuses/109814016209990908

The kind of “Green Growth” championed by capitalists and politicians, which features more electric cars, a bit of solar, and a few wind farms — along with continued use of fossil fuels — is not a good answer. It does not solve any of our problems, and in fact only makes them worse.

Say NO to more cars, of any kind. Push instead for active transportation and for improved public transit.

Continued economic growth is unsustainable. Period. The only logical choice for us and for the biosphere is de-growth.

#Environment #Climate #ClimateChange #ClimateCrisis #ClimateEmergency #Degrowth #WarOnCars #BanCars

South America's 'lithium fields' reveal the dark side of electric cars

Demand for lithium-ion batteries is unprecedented - but is mining the chemical harmful to the environment?

euronews
Show threadBread and CircusesMay 3, 2023

I like this quote:

“The problem is that electric cars are popular with politicians precisely because they provide an excuse to avoid doing harder things, like rebuilding our cities, or changing the habits of lifetimes. Persuading people to switch from their old gasoline car to a shiny Tesla is much easier than persuading them that they can live without a car. Hence governments are pushing electric cars, often with incentives that make no sense.” - Daniel Knowles, author of Carmageddon

Show threadMatijaMay 3, 2023
@breadandcircuses
Living without a car though... If I can get by with public transport for most needs, sure. But in Toronto where I live, this is a pipe dream. I know, public transport is on that list too, but it takes time. In the meantime, I think that electric cars do help. Do you disagree?
Show threadDashJul 8, 2023

@moormaan @breadandcircuses
By progressively managing our transport consumption downwards, we are currently at about 3000 miles pa. That works out to about 700kg CO2 in the 14yo Toyota Yaris we already have.

A new electric car is going to produce CO2 equivalent to *well over a decade* of further use of our current car before it rolls off the forecourt.

Buying an electric car for us would be saying "I am not prepared to strive towards not owning a car, even over that timescale".

Show threadLotneuv

@dash @moormaan @breadandcircuses While you keep your Yaris for 10 more years you would be financing FF industry for 10 more years. How do you think they would use that money?

Electric cars are a tactical solution in a strategical aim of reducing FF industy's power so we could one day (hopefully soon enough) attack it head on and kill it.

Electric bikes are excellent but they don't support that goal.

Jul 8, 2023 at 10:26amTusky
Show threadDashJul 8, 2023

@lotneuv @moormaan @breadandcircuses

The extent to which one "finances the FF industry" is equivalent to the amount of energy you use.

To cause an electric car to be made is to put a decade's worth of financing in their hands right now, then continue paying in use. While simultaneously perpetuating the motor industry.

We need to end the FF industry *and* massively diminish the motor industry this decade.

Show threadDashJul 8, 2023

@lotneuv @moormaan @breadandcircuses Another thought for you...

Imagine the damage it would do to the FF industry if everyone who owns both a car and a house took the £20k+ or equivalent finance payments to switch their current car for an electric one, and instead spent it on measures to reduce the energy use of their home.

Show threadLotneuvJul 8, 2023

@dash @moormaan @breadandcircuses That depends on the house probably. I'm sure there are plenty of calculations available to see what us the most effective way to reduce FF use (not necesserily energy use) with 20k£.

Long ago my parents' house was warmed with ~1200 litres of some oil derivative. They also drove 40k kilometers a year consuming ~4000 litres of gasoline. If EVs had existed then their (direct) footprint would have decreased 77% with an EV.

Show threadLotneuvJul 8, 2023

@dash @moormaan @breadandcircuses

"""The extent to which one "finances the FF industry" is equivalent to the amount of energy you use."""

This is incorrect. Fossil fuels are energy stores. Burning them is just one way of creating energy.

There are many ways to produce energy. If I buy and consume electricity produced with wind power FF industry will get nothing. Not a cent.

And why should electric motor industry be downsized? FF engines ofc need to go but why electric too?

Show threadDashJul 8, 2023
@lotneuv @moormaan @breadandcircuses Could you explain "electric bikes don't support that goal"?
Show threadLotneuvJul 8, 2023

@dash @moormaan @breadandcircuses In most cases electric bikes don't get bought to replace ICE cars. They *do* replace trips done with ICE cars (a plus side) and thus decrease FF consumption but they are at most an annoyance to FF industry.

Mostly electric bikes replace regular bikes and public transportation trips (a minus side). Thus net effect is unclear.

I'd like to be proven wrong on this however.