Kerim Yasar
ShoqWe are at most, a few months away from apps with content and sharing mechanisms just not possible on Twitter or other centralized, closed-source platforms. That's when the momentum will really start to build for Activitypub and other protocols supporting federated networks. We have stop talking about it being a twitter "alternative" and start talking about is as an evolutionary step forward in global social networking. Because that's what it is.
When you can get content and engagement here that you cannot get there, that's when we'll shake things up and the old-school twitter model will start to feel stilted and dull.
Democracy Dies in Dumbass@shoq I think that because of people and organizations being able to curate their own local instances this will be a lot more common.
I can't wait to see if any momentum comes of the suggestion to allow people to follow another server's entire local timeline. I'd love to be able to follow *@nasa.social for instance.
John Harrold@ShredderFeeder @shoq @skastodon
I'd love to be able to follow @skastodon.com but I don't really want to change to that instance.
SkastodonNo worries! For how, you can just follow the hashtag #ska, and go through our directory to find some good people to follow.
Also, see if your admin wants to set up a relay to Skastodon.
No worries! For how, you can just follow the hashtag #ska, and go through our directory to find some good people to follow.
Also, see if your admin wants to set up a relay to Skastodon.
...hukka@shoq - You forget that one important difference between commercial social media and the Fediverse is that there are no algorithms suggesting posts, only people. That's sort of like talking "quality time" regarding social media.
Scott@shoq I’m already getting more engagement here, and the engagement I get, even when people disagree with me, has been respectful and constructive. It already “feels” better here. Looking forward to advancements in the apps and the server leaving the monoliths in the dust
Levi Sauerbrei@ShekinahCanCook I think a more important question is "How do we keep it at a grassroots level"? I can run my own instance for less than Twitter Blue would cost me. Ignoring the technical know-how required, I've been wondering why Twitter doesn't just set up their own instance, bridge the two services and effectively monopolize the #fediverse. Or why doesn't Disney? Or AT&T? Or any of the existing corporate monoliths? The Fediverse will always be free, in the way the internet itself has always been free. But corporations will eventually figure out how to drown out smaller voices. And then we start the battle over again.
@shoq @jeffjarvis
@shoq @jeffjarvis
Jeff Jarvis
Deus+1 to Jeff. It’s about having the freedom of choice. As @elk - the latest Mastodon Web Client in town - replied to me in another thread, “It’s great to be able to choose.”
https://mastindia.co/@[email protected]/posts/ARJH4mRatKDbjdwJrU
Olav@levi what would these monoliths do? I mean, I can see an edge case where Disney or Amazon might spin up a public instance (that people could join) but other than spamming their home feed there's just not a lot of value. News org's.on the other hand have everything to gain
@olavf News orgs are a perfect use case for a corporate-owned instance. But right now the data-collection and advertising model is the dominant business plan. I can 100% imagine Amazon hosting their own instance and injecting ads into the feed. Specifically, making an activity pub post using their user's accounts. So if I am following that user, I see the ad. It would be in their ToS and everyone would begin to accept it. Ug.
Grandpa Don@shoq
Yes!
The bird app is a toy for exchanging cat & dog pictures & telling other kids you are at the mall.
That it ever got adopted as a tool for serious communication by governments, corporations, & politicians is absurd. Decent publishing tools for presenting information in an organized, instructive format got abandoned for 140 char sound bites. They added threading, increased message size but those were desperate attempts to be marginally serious in an otherwise sophisticated world.
#🐔💩
Yes!
The bird app is a toy for exchanging cat & dog pictures & telling other kids you are at the mall.
That it ever got adopted as a tool for serious communication by governments, corporations, & politicians is absurd. Decent publishing tools for presenting information in an organized, instructive format got abandoned for 140 char sound bites. They added threading, increased message size but those were desperate attempts to be marginally serious in an otherwise sophisticated world.
#🐔💩
@dbc3 I have nothing to add.
Cykonot@shoq ActivityPub goes brrrrr
Mike 🍁✔@shoq Are there any of those so far you know of?
@ravensview Besides my 2, 1 other. But by conservative extrapolation, I figure that means dozens are out there. At least.
@shoq Will be interesting to hear about them when released.
MWT@shoq I'll look forward to the moment when I can replace Facebook.
Ericka Simone@shoq twitter could never do what this place is set up to on its best day.
Paranoid FactoidWhy is anyone using an app to access a #freesoftware project like #Mastodon that's free and doesn't track users or violate #privacy?
Wouldn't it make more sense to focus that effort on #mobileweb and let everyone use the same interface regardless of platform? The way the web intended.
Imbolc@ParanoidFactoid @shoq The individual web UIs of the Mastodon servers will probably never be able to fix the cross-server follow/boost/like usability barriers that exist now, because of cross-server web/JavaScript security barriers.
Native third-party apps don't have these restrictions.
Though, as a compromise maybe third-party web apps like Pinafore or Elk, can also solve these problems.
Joel de Bruijn@ParanoidFactoid @eob @shoq
No is a browser thing in general.
If I click a profile on another instance I cant follow because I am not logged in there.
No is a browser thing in general.
If I click a profile on another instance I cant follow because I am not logged in there.
Wait. I'm on Mastodon.social. if I load the url:
Https://Fosston.org/joeldebruijn
I will not be logged in at Fosston.org and will be unable to follow. Correct?
But if I load:
Https://mastodon.social/@joeld[email protected]
I will get your profile and I can follow from my home server.
What's the problem?
@ParanoidFactoid @eob @shoq
The problem is:
- knowing the steps you mention and juggling urls for mainstream users versus their skills
- the friction it adds
The problem is:
- knowing the steps you mention and juggling urls for mainstream users versus their skills
- the friction it adds
@ParanoidFactoid @joeldebruijn @shoq Well, probably not actually the Kerberos protocol, as it requires a trusted third party, i.e. a centralized server, which of something you cannot have in a decentralized system like Mastodon.
But maybe you could build something on top of the OAuth or OpenID protocols.
@ParanoidFactoid @shoq Both mobile and desktop browsers have the same restrictions. In general they store data for each web site separately in a way that makes it hard to write browser-only apps that seamlessly talk to multiple web sites.
Because each Mastodon server's built-in web UI is at a different web site, it is hard to create frictionless user flows that span across different Mastodon servers.
Kalhan@ParanoidFactoid @shoq this is a good idea. I always thought that one day one app will cover everything, and if enough organizations do it, it will be the web browser.
R Provost, PhD@shoq
Will it meet the requirements of journalists? They join, try to operate here, struggle and then leave behind static accounts.
Will it meet the requirements of journalists? They join, try to operate here, struggle and then leave behind static accounts.
Flaming Cheeto
Brexton 🌹@shoq A lot of people (myself included) don't want a new network, we want a Twitter replacement. Imo Twitter lasted so long because the formula was so good. Short messages, broadcast to everyone, allowing replies that are equal to posts (in terms of replying, retweeting, etc.).
I don't care about the future of social networking, I've only ever extensively used Twitter because it's better for me.
zeruch@shoq I don't disagree, but that means some kind of "alternative" to the "Alternative to twitter" use case needs to start being broadcast. Something pithy that folks can grasp (read: tech journalism can't casually malign due to status quo relationships and more general audiences can wrap their heads around with a de minimus of effort).
Not impossible, but I'd argue still not facile.
oshy@shoq What do you mean by sharing mechanisms?
Ivan Sagalaev 
@shoq could you give an example of what you have in mind about those mechanisms?
OpenDNA⚙️@shoq IMO, we're in an unusual situation with the fediverse because software is so far ahead of user practice. Normally, users hack new uses then software follows. Here, we have the tools to integrate short-blogging, long-blogging, photo feeds, music playlists, video... but adoption and integration by practice lags.
I haven't yet seen someone promote their podcast on Castopod or music album on Funkwhale or photo essay on PixelFed or video short on PeerTube or...
Ron Angell
Tom Walker@shoq Yes I think you are bang on. Twitter long since shut down any interesting project that tried to use its API, which the fediverse won't do (and pretty much can't, except via cultural pressure if something is strongly disliked). So sooner or later something sufficiently interesting will arise on top of it and allowed to grow in a way that it wouldn't have been on the centralised platforms.
bitzero@shoq Agreed. But I also think that decentralization in general, and its implications for the fragmentation of social/power structures, is a topic many average users are not interested into. Not now, at least.
The internet/web was decentralized by design but the centralization of web2 made things a lot easier for (relatively) less tech people. We should not underestimate this.
But yes, the evolutions of platforms like Mastodon is a big chance not to be missed.
magenta@shoq if there was tasks and time/date as a core shared unit, just as text, photo & video are, that would change everything