Samantha Rose
Neil BrownWell, Mullvad's fall from grace was certainly fast. And I seem to recall that Proton had a moment too, a while back.
What's the current go-to recommendation for VPNs/proxies, for people who don't want to run their own?
ahnlak
Doerk
Troed Sångberg@neil In Mullvad's case it was actual big money spending on fascists from an active owner & founder of the company. In Proton's case it was not - just a lot of people who felt like screaming a bit.
I'm still a very happy Proton user.
Paul Leader@Noneeeed Their process for vetting people who signed up for affiliate links didn't catch a known French holocaust denier. Proton took the blame and changed their processes, but they also admitted that they can't do 100% pre-vetting on self signups and appreciate when the community notifies them if they screw up.
Apparently that was bad.
That wasn't what I had in mind (I'm not sure that I'd even seen it)!
I think it was this:
gay 420
The Doctor
SpycrabIf the government in their jurisdiction comes with a valid legal request for metadata they will obey the law. That's something all companies have to do.
In the case you're thinking of the user could've paid using cash in an envelope but decided to use their credit card so identifyable metadata existed.
IIRC, it was less about the fact that they did it, and more that Proton makes claims like
> With Proton, your data belongs to you, not tech companies, governments, or hackers.
on the front page of the site, without saying "but of course we will comply with disclosure obligations".
I think that there was also a question as to whether Proton attempted to push back against the request, but there may not have been scope to do so.
This is linked from the front page - and has been since 2014:
https://proton.me/blog/switzerland
Proton has never claimed they won't cooperate with the Swiss judicial system. They have (the link above) explained in detail how being incorporated and headquartered in Switzerland makes is much harder for governments to get access to user data than in the EU and the US, for example.
hyperreal@neil @troed @spycrab @Noneeeed Yeah, it's misleading on Proton's part. They also only encrypt the email contents, not the email metadata, so the metadata (including the IP addresses) could be subject to subpoena, and the email participants might want or expect that to be encrypted. Proton says that you could keep your real IP address out of the metadata if you use their ProtonVPN (or any reputable VPN) service. This seems more like a marketing ploy for tiered privacy services, which is pretty deceptive / manipulative.
To maximize privacy in email, I'd only recommend Tuta as of this time. Sadly I don't know of any VPN services to replace Mullvad.
William Oldwin@troed @Noneeeed @neil It's not just that, a couple of years ago the Proton CEO made a post somewhat ambiguously supportive of Trump and that blew way up in communities like this one. So there's been more than one thing out of Proton that's given real cause for concern about their politics (and it was enough to hasten me leaving them), but nothing as unambiguously damning as 'literally funds Nazis'.
There was absolutely nothing ambiguous about that post though.
Clare Hooley@Noneeeed someone from Proton (CEO?) also refused to change his Reddit username from having a number associated with neoNazis in it. Now it seems he really was born in 1988 but the fact that they didn’t change it when the association was pointed out didn’t seem great. Sill not in my view quite as actively a problem as this with Mullvad.
spacebug@neil I'm also looking for a new provider. I was recommended https://www.ivpn.net/en/ and I'm trying it now for a month. But I'm not sure if they can be trusted. They claim a lot on they website but who knows what is real and what they will do when something happens.
Swift
Christopher M0YNG@M0YNG @neil
I tried the generate config thing earlier today but when I did I saw nothing about PSK or any other thing that could mean post quantum safe. So I guess for that you need to use their app.
I'm using the app now in a VM but I'm not that keen on installing a randsom app from someone I may not fully trust on my host system.
I tried the generate config thing earlier today but when I did I saw nothing about PSK or any other thing that could mean post quantum safe. So I guess for that you need to use their app.
I'm using the app now in a VM but I'm not that keen on installing a randsom app from someone I may not fully trust on my host system.
Ivor Hewitt@neil personally. I like https://privatevpn.com/why-privatevpn/about-us/ and have used them for years without any trouble.
Mans R
Root Moose@neil I've seen AirVPN mentioned in a few threads and the web site looks promising but...
Can you trust anything nowadays?
Lewin@RootMoose @neil i use airvpn. Paid up front with a prepaid card
Linux using openvpn config; ditto for the windows clients. No need for their software.
openvpn or wireguard on phones.
Using it for accessing iplayer abroad was OK but now is not; so i have alternative for that.
TelH90@neil there are NO GOOD ONES!
- There never were any to begin with!
https://web.archive.org/web/20220112020000/https://twitter.com/thegrugq/status/1085614812581715968
AFAIK @monocles scrapped the Idea of doing a #VPN because of the way most just lazily rebrand some other corpo's white-label thing.
- Use @torproject / #TorBrowser instead…
Personally, I use @freifunk instead…
@neil maybe give @airvpn a shot if you merely want a #VPN for #NetNeutrality & #Geoblocking-override reasons…
- They accept #Monero!
https://airvpn.org
@mansr @neil @airvpn nope, it's a reason to choose them!
Name another globally available payment Method that is as anonymous as #Monero.
- The closest to it I know is #PaySafeCard, but that isn't even global. At least you can buy those for cash and don't have to give any details, but that's merely pseudonymous and unless you wait >72 hours, tgere's likely still CCTV footage that allows putting a face together with said purchase.
It's called #OpSec and I'd recommend to take it more serious…
6@6 @neil I heard of @calyxinstitute…
I remembered #AirVPN for allowing #OpenVPN over @torproject / #Tor, which helps working around sites that block Tor...
Otherwise I don't recommend usong a #VPN *UNLESS YOU ABSOLUTELY CANNOT USE ANYTHIBG ELSE!*
Stewart Tolhurst@neil I’m using tunnelbear - they are US based, but very open about the legal and practical limits of VPN use. Unfortunately internet privacy is a space that intersects with the internet wild west and attracts some very unsavoury types, so you have to go with a VPN provider whose values fit with your own…
Jaimie's Erotica@neil
I have a subscription with McAfee which has a VPN. It seems to work well enough.
I expect someone with a beard and a strange computer is about to tell me I'm an idiot....
I have a subscription with McAfee which has a VPN. It seems to work well enough.
I expect someone with a beard and a strange computer is about to tell me I'm an idiot....
> I expect someone with a beard and a strange computer is about to tell me I'm an idiot....
I have always been restrained in my conversations with you!
@neil 😂
To be fair, you're always the perfect gentleman and I appreciate you for it. For once, I'm not being ironic/sarcastic. X
To be fair, you're always the perfect gentleman and I appreciate you for it. For once, I'm not being ironic/sarcastic. X
My secret is that I see you as an actual person, deserving of respect and humanity.
But don't tell anyone my cunning trick.
It wouldn't catch on anyway.
@neil
In the times we live in, I think it certainly won't catch on. It's appreciated by this person, in any case.
In the times we live in, I think it certainly won't catch on. It's appreciated by this person, in any case.
Darren Hartland@Jaimieserotica @neil I don't know you at all aside from the few interactions we've swapped here but I'm in the camp of respect someone first.
Mx. Luna Corbden 🪿🐸@Jaimieserotica @neil I, uh, don't have a beard because it's not safe to get HRT and my computer is normal these days, BUT John McAfee was the OG problematic tech mogul.
Suzanne Aldrich (she/her)@neil I don’t think it’s a good idea to have a monster in the middle service. You’re better off using Tor Browser.
Simon Rolfmore@neil I am looking into Njalla, from one of the many long threads I’ve read: https://njal.la/vpn/
Hannes Deeken@neil I'm using tailscale, pretty happy with them.
taavi 
@Glenlivet @neil that Tailscale feature is sadly a Mullvad reseller
jonossa seuraavaDoes that make it better, or worse?!
Hmm... it sounds like they are using Mullvad funded / operated infrastructure?