Sean Riley
Fabian Transchel@dogriley You picked the worst possible contender to do your comparison... go look up https://quickshell.org now 😅
Björn@ftranschel @dogriley I like Quickshell but it's not the target audience for those who don't to create their own setup. I think plasma is probably closer and similar to quickshell but more user friendly.
@ftranschel @dogriley Yeah I'm thinking of using it at point too. I hope it's quality and modularity will slowly increase, there are so many qml modules which can be reused so quickshell is more like glue around them.
It reminds me somewhat of stumpwm minus the repl.
It reminds me somewhat of stumpwm minus the repl.
@thaodan @dogriley For me it really is more like a sandbox QML interpreter that works in JavaScript than anything else - it eases the pain of compiling QtQuick components and allows for rapid prototyping. You can always go and port components to C if you feel that the performance is required. It's almost as fun as developing websites for me.
@ftranschel @dogriley Well that's pretty much what I meant, be it a QML element in C++ or QML, pretty much any QObject can be used.
There are quite many existing modules which can be used. Qt makes it really easy to combine C++ with QML.
The repl part was referring that you can easily reload/restart the shell to test your changes.
There are quite many existing modules which can be used. Qt makes it really easy to combine C++ with QML.
The repl part was referring that you can easily reload/restart the shell to test your changes.
tpaau@ftranschel @dogriley Quickshell is very clunky to use as a DE. I could only recommend it to people who crave the extra customizability or really like a specific compositor and want to use it as a DE.
@tpaau17db @dogriley #Quickshell is *NOT* a DE, it is a shell toolkit.
I don't recommend it because I think everybody should use it (in fact they probably shouldn't).
I was addressing the assertion that Cinnamon is "peak desktop" (which, compared to Ubuntu, is correct) and wanted to point out how there are other options that can do way, way, waaaay cooler stuff (and on a lower budget) - if that's what you want.
@ftranschel @dogriley I don't claim it is.
You mentioned Quickshell in the context of comparing two desktop environments, and shells showcased in https://quickshell.org could very well be considered desktop environments.
While you definitely can do some cool things with Quickshell, I wouldn't consider anything made with it a *serious* DE, especially compared to something like GNOME or Cinnamon.
@tpaau17db @dogriley Then what is *serious*?
If you look at DMS, I think it is definitely on the level of XFCE, LXQT, Cosmic et al.
@ftranschel @dogriley Except it:
- Takes 4 times more to start up
- Uses much more RAM
- Can't close popups while also redirecting mouse input to windows
- Is significantly less stable
- Breaks if you have incorrect versions of dependencies installed
It's certainly impressive what they've done here, but it can't be compared to full-blown DEs built from scratch instead of ones made with a programmable desktop shell toolkit.
And BTW I've been using DMS for like 3 days now and it's fine for me.
@tpaau17db @dogriley I will not address your other points, as they may be valid (not using DMS myself after creating my own dots), but you can't be serious when you say:
"Breaks if you have incorrect versions of dependencies installed"
Like: Wat?
@ftranschel @dogriley Eg. Matugen 4.0 or higher breaks color generation, or certain monitors won't work well unless you have ddcutil.
DEs like GNOME come as a single package with all the dependencies, or the dependencies are required to install the main package in the first place. DMS, on the other hand, is several tools and programs taped together. They don't bundle everything with DMS.
@tpaau17db @dogriley Ok, I get what you're saying now.
I mean, it's a tradeoff, obviously. Each version is frozen with a specific set of tools and that's what you pay for playing outside the DE world.
While accessibility as you seem to understand it is arguably better for #Gnome (and MUCH better for #plasma), if something DOES break, you're lost with a DE and you can usually just edit the hook on #quickshell.
@tpaau17db @dogriley To me, it's a little bit like saying you don't want to get into tuning your car because then you have to tune your car.
My point really was all about: Are there desktop experiences that address what e.g. Ubuntu gnome lacks? There are. They come with drawbacks.