RE: https://mstdn.social/@DemocracyMattersALot/116359292118345285
I am going to call it. These people conservatives, the Republican Party and the filthy rich are in human animals.
To ignore this is to agree to it. Don’t let anybody you know who supports Republicans or MAGA slide from this point.
Everyone he supports Donald Trump in the GOP and Christian nationalism are child abusers. They cannot be allowed to wriggle off the point and wriggle away from accountability.
Silence equals death. Just saying.
I agree with all of this apart from calling them inhuman. They are the worst is humanity, but still human.
I've never seen good come from dehuminizing others, and many atrocities that start with it.
But, to your main point, we cannot let people hide from what they are supporting. It doesn't matter if 'this is not what they voted for' because it is happening because they supported someone this atrocious.
Ostracism is a thing. It should be evident that what they are doing is choosing to be in human.
They should never ever be allowed to slide off of that fact. They can change their behavior. When people choose to support something that isn’t any different than epstein I don’t have any patience for them.
I don’t want people like that walking the same street as I
I am never going to say good morning Mr. Hitler good morning Mr. Göbels, have you had a good Easter?
Sorry, just no
But isn't that consistent with hating them as humans?
I don't think there is anything to serve by pretending this isn't an extreme, horrid part of the distribution of humanity.
And I'm very much not arguing we shouldn't ostracize and punish for supporting the evil that is Trump and the GOP. Those are valid reactions to this evil.
I don’t think so. People choose.
It’s like that old lady who participated in January 6 and refused the offer of a pardon from Donald Trump.
She said I don’t want to pardon what I did was wrong and the only thing that I can do to atone for it is to denounce January 6 and the man who caused it to happen.
They always have the choice, but they have to make it
Yes people have choices, but it doesn't follow that they can/should lose their humanity status based on it.
The premise of the book "Unhumans" (which JD Vance wrote the forward for) is that the left have lost their status as humans because of their politics. This is appalling. The issue is not that they have the wrong criteria for revoking people's humanity, but that they are doing it at all.
Humanity is not something with degrees, nor is it dependent on 'right action'.
I don’t believe in surrendering to the framing of the far right. My reply to somebody like JD Vance is at the far right, with their unblemished record of projection, had done exactly what they claim (especially because the meaning of the left right spectrum has been corrupted by a authoritarians for their own purpose)
To be left, wing would be to forgo violence and subjugation as a matter of of course.
There is a long list of anthropological examples of egalitarian societies who measure out increasing levels of a premium from ridicule to isolation to exile and eventually killing somebody who resorts to violence against others.
That’s how it works. And unfortunately, when I hear people understand, understandably, resist the idea of ostracizing abhorrent behavior, they normalize it. This is the essence of centrism.
We seem to be talking past each other, but I'll take one last stab.
None of the things you mention there about other societies includes stripping people of their humanity. And I've not argued about any kind of ostracization or violence against the abhorrent behavior.
I can't think of a single case where dehumanizing others leads to good outcomes. This isn't the same as ceding strategy or actions to the right in centrist fashion, imo.
I think the substantial difference between your attitude and mine can be found in comparing what people will say about those who commit crime against humanity.
To me, it’s an epithet no different than calling somebody a piece of shit or a horrible cockroach, for participating in crime against humanity, or cheering it on.
It’s there to ostracized them. If you don’t like the word, I get it, but evil child molesting murder bots don’t warrant civil language in my book.
1/n
Imagine the following scenario:
Donald Trump calling people pieces of excrement, versus the targeted population, calling Donald Trump, a piece of excrement.
One party wants to victimize and strip them as the rights and the other party is telling the perpetrator to go fuck himself, because what they want is him to stop in all his creepy followers to never ever try to do that.
n/n
Humans are sometimes asshats deserving of being called pieces of excrement.
Humans can do such horrible shit they deserve to be cast from society.
Humans all die, and sometimes it can be right to hasten their exit from life.
I agree with all your examples. It is bad strategy and we gain nothing morally by not using these tools to fight the right.
But humans are inherently human, and we lose something by ceding the point and accepting dehumanization as a possibility.
Sure, my argument is the motivations are more important than the name.
To be kind of blunt about it calling somebody a cockroach or a piece of poo poo isn’t different.
So far the canonically left wing approach has been to treat right wing insanity as an academic debate over facts. On one side, you have people who are actively waging a war to destroy human rights and human lives. This isn’t an academic debate. This is in a very real sense war
They are still human. Never forget that. Borne of human parents. They are what any of us could become once we start thinking one person is less of a person than another.
They are the worst of us. Despicable. Selfish. Hateful. Delusional.
Evil, even.
But they are still human. Humans are capable of such things. Humans can also hold each other accountable and seek justice. We could also turn away and make excuses; let bygones be bygones.
We have a choice.
They must be held accountable. We must not look away.
We must look them in the face and admit they are human because we must never again forget what we are capable of and we must never let it happen again.
The purpose of what I am saying is to ostracized them. I know what you’re saying is well meaning but I have no trouble understanding they are people and that the human species is capable of atrocities like genocide and mass murder , rape and trafficking in children. Human history is littered with these behaviors..
One of the ways human societies sanction morally abominable behavior like this is to ostracized the behavior.
I'm saying "ostracizing" them isn't enough.
They must be punished.
If they were animals, we could just say it's in their nature. But they are people and they must be held accountable and made an example of.
Yeah, in this, we are in complete agreement. The problem we face is on the scale of apartheid South Africa.
Quite often conservatives of all sorts, get arrested and convicted of human trafficking crimes, but the larger issue we face now is a significant chunk of the population who continues to support those people.
It’s a peace and reconciliation situation but it will require admission of what they supported.
GhostOnTheHalfShell
🇩🇪 🇺🇦 🇨🇦
Kyle Montanio
J. R. DePriest 
:EA DATA. SF: