GrapheneOS18h ago

Gaël Duval is the founder and president of the /e/ foundation along with the CEO of Murena. Duval and his organizations have consistently taken a stance against protecting users from exploits. In this video, he once again claims protecting against exploits is for only useful pedophiles and spies.

Translation to English:

> There's the attack surface, on that front we're not security specialists here, so I couldn't answer you precisely, but from the discussions I've had, it seems that everything

Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
> we do reduces attack surface. However, we don't have a "hardened security" approach, we aren't developing a phone for pedo(censored) so they can evade justice. So there aren't difficult things to check if the memory is corrupted, really hardened security stuff that could clearly be useful for executives, in the secret service, or whatever. That's not our goal, our goal is to start from an observation: today our personal data is constantly being plundered and that wouldn't be legal in real life
Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
> with the mail or the telephone, we want to change that. So we are making you a product that changes that by default for anyone.
Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago

Transcription in French:

> Il y a la surface d'attaque, là pour le coup on est pas des spécialistes de la sécurité, donc je ne pourrais pas te répondre avec précision, mais des discussions que j'ai eu, il semblerait que tout ce qu'on fait, ça réduit la surface d'attaque. Donc oui, probablement ça aide. Par contre, on a pas une approche "sécurité durcie", on développe pas un téléphone pour les pédo(bip) pour qu'ils puissent échapper à la justice. Donc il y a pas des trucs pas possibles pour voir

Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
> si la mémoire est pas corrompue, des trucs de sécu vraiment durcis qui pourraient être utiles clairement pour des dirigeants, dans les services secrets ou que sais-je. C'est pas notre but, notre but c'est de partir d'un constat, aujourd'hui nos données personnelles sont pillées en permanence et ça serait pas légal dans la vraie vie avec le courrier ou le téléphone, on veut changer ça. Donc on vous fait un produit qui change ça par défaut pour n'importe quelle personne.
Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
GrapheneOS exists to protect users from having their privacy invaded by arbitrary individuals, corporations and states. Privacy depends on security. GrapheneOS heavily improves both privacy and security while providing a high level of usability and near perfect app compatibility.
Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
/e/ has far worse privacy and security than the Android Open Source Project. They fail to keep up with important standard privacy and security patches for Android, Linux, firmware, drivers and HALs. They fail to provide current generation Android privacy and security protections.
Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
For years, Gaël Duval has spearheaded a campaign to misrepresent GrapheneOS as not being usable, not compatible with apps and only useful to a tiny minority of people. He has repeatedly claimed GrapheneOS is for pedophiles, criminals and spies while claiming /e/ is for everyone.
Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
It's hardly only GrapheneOS focusing on protecting users against exploits. Apple and Google have put a ton of work into it. Apple heavily focuses on privacy and security. That includes protecting against remote exploits, local exploits from compromised apps and data extraction.
Show threadGrapheneOS18h ago
GrapheneOS and iOS are both heavily focused on privacy and security. Both are gradually adding much stronger protections against apps/sites scraping data, coercion users into giving data via alternatives with case-by-case consent and increasingly strong exploit protections.
Show threadSean18h ago

@GrapheneOS to be fair they don't promise security, only privacy. at least in their foreword on their website here.

I don't think it's by accident that they don't even use the word secure, or security, on the whole page.

https://e.foundation/e-os/

I've seen claims before where they claim it's better than GrapheneOS. But in what regard? Maybe degoogling and having alternatives pre-installed? GrapheneOS is probably more involved to get the same apps. That's the only way /e/ is better in my opinion

/e/OS - e Foundation - deGoogled unGoogled smartphone operating systems and online services - your data is your data

ECOSYSTEMKEY FEATURESGET /E/OSNEED HELP /e/OS is a complete, fully “deGoogled”, mobile ecosystem /e/OS is an open-source mobile operating system paired with carefully selected applications. They form a privacy-enabled internal system for your smartphone. And it’s not just claims: open-source means auditable privacy. /e/OS has received academic recognition from researchers at…

Show threadHybridStaticAnimate17h ago

@codebam @GrapheneOS

They dont provide privacy. So a promise is already broken. But beyond that, privacy cannot exist without security. They arent mutually exclusive, they are intertwined. To ignore security means you are not a privacy project.

E/ is not better at degoogling. GrapheneOS does not connect to any google servers, run any google play code, have any privilege google services, etc. Sandboxed google play is sandboxed and must be installed by the user. All default connections are to first party servers hosted by GOS. It is not more involved to get the same apps, google or otherwise.

Show threadClaudius Link

@HybridStaticAnimate @codebam @GrapheneOS

That it must be installed by the user doesn't make it different.

IMHO the two app stores included in GrapheneOS are not sufficient for the vast majority of users.

If "every" user needs to install it to have a usable phone, it really is part of the attack surface.
(And yes, I'm aware the Play services are sandboxed on GrapheneOS which improves privacy and security)

It's a bit like delivering a computer without network functionality because it reduces the attack surface, and then blaming the user if they install network drivers.

3:49amWeb
Show threadGrapheneOS1h ago

@realn2s @HybridStaticAnimate @codebam

> IMHO the two app stores included in GrapheneOS are not sufficient for the vast majority of users.

Our own App Store is the only one included in GrapheneOS. We don't bundle third party apps and services into the OS. Using those is entirely a user choice and will remain that way.

Our App Store provides Accrescent and the Play Store. If you think other apps such as Obtainium should be easily available then get those to submit their apps into Accrescent.