Mastodawn

Eldritch kcarruthers 10h ago

Seeing a lot of “how to prepare” type posts for ICE at airports, which is great… but almost every post I’m seeing has said to turn off biometrics (great) and turn your phone off completely while going through security.

As someone who has been given an insanely difficult time at airports the past 3 years, please don’t rely on turning your phone off alone. It might work for some people, but I’m not allowed past security without showing all of my electronics turn on, and they have to remain on until I get through.

I have quite a few posts detailing my experiences. If it’s helpful I can try to dig them up and reshare. I know it won’t be the same for everyone, but what I go through is pretty intense and maybe getting an idea of some of the things they do will help.

Alissa Azar 1d ago

Some questions I have been asked, along with people I know who were targeted and harassed when flying post 9/11

Again, doesn’t mean it’s going to happen to you, but something to consider since you might not be allowed through without cooperating:

Where are you going
Are you traveling with anyone
Who are you going to see at destination
What are you going to do at destination
How much cash did you bring
How much money do you plan on spending
Did you bring gifts for anyone
Did anyone send gifts back with you
Where are you staying (sometimes exact address)
Who are you staying with
How did you book your accommodations (sometimes they request to see receipts)
How will you be traveling while there (car, public transit, etc)
Have you been there before

While some of these are not uncommon for international travel, many of these have been asked while traveling domestically too. On one of my most recent flights, I was asked a lot of these questions very informally. A dude with DHS was pretending to shoot the shit and it almost felt like flirting (but was very transparently questioning me)

Alissa Azar 1d ago

I mentioned this incident on here when it happened, so it’s up somewhere… but another thing to consider is clothing.

While I was waiting for an explosives specialist to come inspect my belongings one time while going through security, someone else with DHS approached me with a clipboard and circled me as he documented all of my visible tattoos.

Alissa Azar 1d ago

Just want to emphasize I do not say any of this to fear monger. This level of surveillance might not become more widespread and I hope it doesn’t. But I think people’s fears are understandable and maybe some insight into other people’s experiences from things that have already been happening will help folks feel better prepared. Only reason I share any of this

https://sfba.social/@jonathankoren/116279839588448399

jonathankoren™ (@[email protected])

Attached: 1 image @[email protected] @[email protected] exactly. I’d actually like to see a report of ICE *actually doing something* at the airport before people people start fear mongering with “tips”. From all the photos I’ve seen, they’re literally just standing around in the unsecured area getting in the way.

SFBA.social

@alissaazar the problem is the sheer existance of the #AmericanGestapo to begin with!

#USpol #fascism #SurveillanceState #ICE

LukefromDC 1d ago

@alissaazar Since I KNOW I am too reactive to ever pass through that sort of secondary screening I have stayed off the airlines since 2001. This is for autistic reasons as much as anything else. Being around cops puts me into combat mode. No way I would be willing to answer those questions. You are supposed to only be denied boarding and escorted out of the airport, but this is NOT something cops can be trusted with. While TSA is not a grand jury with a subpeona, we must remember that law is dead in the US.

All of my trips between Arizona and DC or FL have been on the ground. Takes about four days each way but is far more private and much less dangerous.

If I want to fly somewhere I have to build my own plane first, a process that takes most builders about a year for fullscale. At the moment I've never built one big enough to ride in. Also most small planes that get car-level fuel economy are only a little faster than the highway and can be grounded by bad weather. To fly a small plane (not a corporate jet) from FL to CA can take an entire week, an uncle of mine used to do exactly that.

Nathan A. Stine 1d ago

@alissaazar Hi Alissa! My understanding is ICE will be harassing people before they get to security (or at least that's been reported somewhere). Does "am I being detained or am I free to go" work in this circumstance? Of course bearing in mind that they have the upper hand because if they just hold you for a while you miss your flight.

Alissa Azar 1d ago

@stinerman that’s my understanding as well. For now anyways. People seem to just be planning for escalations as well as not trusting what they say the intent is.

And technically yes, in a hypothetical world where laws and constitutional rights mean anything. But that is not our reality. So I would exercise caution and safety regardless, and always don’t say a word. Saying that and requesting a lawyer if need be is fine but rule number 1 is every day is stfu Friday.

No biometrics, strong passwords and logged out of socials etc is a good move.

@alissaazar @stinerman https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/what-do-when-encountering-law-enforcement-airports-and-other-ports-entry-us

Know Your Rights | Enforcement at the Airport | ACLU

At the border, you are likely to encounter Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officers, and you may encounter Homeland Security Investigations (HSI) agents. HSI is part of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE). Know your rights in these scenarios.

American Civil Liberties Union

jonathankoren™1d ago

@stinerman @alissaazar exactly. I’d actually like to see a report of ICE *actually doing something* at the airport before people people start fear mongering with “tips”. From all the photos I’ve seen, they’re literally just standing around in the unsecured area getting in the way.

Alissa Azar 1d ago

@jonathankoren @stinerman I get that but also the insane surveillance and questioning has already been happening to people and it’s not a far reach to think it could escalate. Nothing wrong with being prepared before if/when it becomes more widespread.

UncleRico 1d ago

@jonathankoren @stinerman @alissaazar LOL because ICE has such a pristine reputation that any comments are premature fear mongering. Maybe get out of your bubble.

LukefromDC 1d ago

@jonathankoren @stinerman @alissaazar Notice we have unmasked ICE faces in the bottom right photo. Surveillance is a game two can play!

LukefromDC 1d ago

@alissaazar Note that a phone which is on but "before first unlock" (not decrypted) is exactly as secure as if it was off if it previously spent a few minutes in the off state to clear RAM contents.

This is because anyone can push a power button, but the passphrase has not been entered. So long as biometrics is not enabled they cannot get in. They should not be able to steal the phone in domestic travel but can in international travel. If its graphene this won't help them one bit as Cellbrite can't get in, and supposedly US citizens can re-enter even after defying demands to answer questions beyond citiizenship/identity or decrypt devices.

Real world: protecting your privacy and those around you might mean having to accept the risk of being denied boarding. In domestic travel there is usually at least Greyhound as an alternative if this happens.

I would not advise anyone to travel into the US internationally now. This is Nazi Germany 2.0, if you can get out best advice is to stay out until the civil war here is over.

✾, chief troublemaker 1d ago

@alissaazar It's okay if electronics turn _on_. Most devices with appropriate encryption (most correctly configured Android & Windows + Bitlocker devices, and all iPhones and Macs out of the box) will still be largely secure until unlocked or logged on the first time.

peachfront 1d ago

yes, i've seen it too & that particular advice is indeed just pure bad, you have to be able to prove that your devices turn on & that they are real working devices, not shells stuffed with whatever they feel like accusing you of smuggling today

SIGH

u shouldn't need to have to dig out your experiences, it feels like everybody should know that your phones must be provably capable of turning on, since it's kinda been a rule for over 20 years

LukefromDC 10h ago

@peachfront @alissaazar Remember that refusing to push the power button isn't needed, as anyone can push the button.

It's at the passphrase screen for encryption that the blockade is set by refusal to share the passphrase or unlock the device. Anyone can get to that screen but nobody but you can get past it with a strong enough passphrase and no biometrics.

peachfront 9h ago

@LukefromDC @alissaazar

true, thanks

@alissaazar Is one of your tips to use a burner phone, or is that considered suspicious?

David Fleetwood - RG Admin 1d ago

@alissaazar Do they force you to unlock the phone? If not then it's still encrypted even when you turn it on.

Alissa Azar 1d ago

@reflex no I have never had to unlock, just show they’re all turned on

David Fleetwood - RG Admin 1d ago

@alissaazar Good to know. Unfortunately the alternative is not accessible to most people, ie: install something like Graphene with multiple accounts and make one that looks 'normal' for unlocking purposes.

LukefromDC 10h ago

@reflex @alissaazar "Force" by what means? Waterboarding? It is no harder to defy a demand from a cop to unlock a phone (ALWAYS an illegal demand) than it is to defy a grand jury subpeona.

David Fleetwood - RG Admin 10h ago

@LukefromDC @alissaazar I don't really understand what you are getting at here. I'm just referring to the difficulty of dumping info from the device. The reason people say to turn off a phone is that the file system remains encrypted until the user signs in (ideally via PIN). Having to turn on your device does not make it easier to hack if you don't sign in.

Yes of course if they choose torture that's something very different than the technical point I'm making.

LukefromDC 10h ago

@reflex @alissaazar The point to turning the device OFF is to remove the disk decryption key from RAM, and let the contents of RAM decay to unrecoverability (cold not warm reboot) over a few minutes.

When the phone is turned back on, it's at "before first unlock" which can only be breached by a brute force attack of trying passphrase after passphrase trying to score. Strong passphrases are computationally impractical to brute force.

If you do NOT turn the device off at all however and have unlocked it, relocking it puts it at "after first unlock" which is far less secure on most devices. On some not all devices Cellbrite can fish the disk keys out of RAM in this case.

Turn it off, and just a few minutes later it is safe to turn it back on just don't unlock it.

David Fleetwood - RG Admin 7h ago

@LukefromDC @alissaazar That's what I've been saying. Interesting point on giving it a few minutes before power on, I was under the impression DRAM lost data in microseconds, but apparently some configurations vary. Good to know, thanks!

Queen 1066 1d ago

@alissaazar or 2 options:

1 avoid airports and stay home behind locked doors until the bad people go away

Or

2 rise up. There are more of you than them and don’t you all have guns?

marymessall 1d ago

@samk @alissaazar

We don't all have guns. It's just that some of us have a LOT of guns.

And the thing about violent conflicts is that they tend to be won by whoever is best at violence. That's not usually the good guys.

LukefromDC 10h ago

@marymessall @samk @alissaazar One person with 100 guns is a lot less combat power than 100 people with one gun apiece

Keeper of the orb 1d ago

@alissaazar im hoping turning off and putting it in my carry on thru the xray will be ok ... but the jig is up if they shove me thru the clockomatic and find no d

Drew 🇵🇭 ♾️1d ago

@alissaazar As a non-US citizen my best option, and the one I have chosen, is to never visit the USA again, ever.

Hydrojohn 1d ago

@alissaazar What about taking you SIM card out?

Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.13h ago

@alissaazar I, too, have been requested to turn on various devices. The excuse I've heard it that it lets the security "verify" the circuity is running that device, not an explosive in the case of that device.

It's always been easier for me to just do it, and I've not ever actually been asked to input my LUKS password or my phone unlock info.

I suppose instead of turning it off, you might put it on airplane mode and disable wifi, but I'm not an expert on all the ways my phone tracks me and how that can be accessed by authoritarians.

wonofone 🍉8h ago

@BoydStephenSmithJr @alissaazar at least restart it and don't enter first unlock code

@alissaazar
"Sorry, I don't have a phone"